Ryder Cup Observations....

[Madriver]

First of all ...THANK YOU Stewart Cink for shutting up Sergio!!!! As for the rest...well...nothing unexpected. As for the Team aspect. The Euros are NOT a team, meaning that because they comprise the European Nations rather than one Nation, and they do not nor do they need to play as team or at least with that burden. The US Team is our National Team and therefor carries a much larger burden. I will not go as far as to say this is why the US lost, but I now see the difference in the "Team" aspect of the Ryder Cup. You could see it in the faces and demeanors of the Euros all weekend, they had NO pressure at all. Hats off to the Euros and their stellar play. For the US to win in the future they will have to change the mindset of a National burden and start thinking about having a good time with 12 of their best friends. Just my thoughts....yours?

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Madriver

First of all ...THANK YOU Stewart Cink for shutting up Sergio!!!!

I think Sergio has plenty to squawk about. Cink put a damper on him, no doubt, but 4-1-0 led the way for the Euros, tying only with Westwood.

Originally Posted by Madriver

For the US to win in the future they will have to change the mindset of a National burden and start thinking about having a good time with 12 of their best friends. Just my thoughts....yours?

The point was made that many of the Europeans travel together and stay in the same hotels (because there may only be one or two at the site of European Tour events). I think it holds some water. They're more familiar with each other.

Tiger Woods is as good as he is, in part I believe, because he doesn't have many friends on Tour. Same with Jim Furyk, and he's one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. But friendly to his competition? That's not the American way, really. Maybe there's some truth to it all.

Now, let's see how badly I did in my predictions:

Originally Posted by iacas

Final Score: United States: 14½, Europe: 13½.
The United States ekes out a win. They're still stronger on paper and a .500 record by the rookies will be good enough to win. Barely.

Originally Posted by iacas

Biggest Point-Getter (United States)
Tiger Woods/Jim Furyk. Each has a new-found partner in each other, and they'll step it up. Both are playing well coming into the event, and both have a lot to prove.

Had Furyk not lost his singles match, I'd have been right. Furyk didn't prove anything, and Tiger's 3-2-0 record is the weakest proof of anything I've ever seen. All it proved is that he can have a winning (barely) record in a Ryder Cup.

Originally Posted by iacas

Biggest Point-Getter (Europe)
Sergio Garcia. He can putt in Ryder Cups, and he gets pumped up like nobody else. The Ryder Cup is the one place, it seems, where Sergio's child-like exuberance is not out of place.

I was right. Though he tied with Lee Westwood, I'm still taking a win here, because I don't get many in other places.

Originally Posted by iacas

Biggest Disappointment (United States)
Phil Mickelson has been flat for months - ever since the 72nd hole at Winged Foot.

Ooh, got another one. Mickelson played like a dog the entire week. While I previously didn't care one way or the other for Phil, things like this make me really, really dislike the oaf.

Originally Posted by iacas

Biggest Disappointment (Europe)
Darren Clarke, despite the emotional boost (or baggage?), will suffer from his time away from golf, not from lack of heart.

Uh, yeah, I was just a wee bit off here. Turns out the biggest disappointment were THE IRISH PLAYERS. Who'd have thunk it?

Originally Posted by iacas

Key Matchup or Factor
The rookies on the U.S. Team will need to hold it together at least well enough to break even. If they can manage to do that - knocking off a stalwart Euro team or two along the way - they'll be just fine. Nobody expects any more than that out of them.

Let's see - Wetterich stunk up the joint (0-2-0), Taylor managed only a half (0-1-1), Johnson did okay (1-2-1), and JJ Henry tied everything (0-0-3). So the rookies were 1-5-5, or four points down from playing 0.500 ball. Shuffle things around - make them 3-3-5 instead - and the Ryder Cup ends 16.5 to 11.5 - much closer. Phil Mickelson's 0-4-1 record should have been at least 3-1-1. Do that and the U.S. wins comfortably, 14.5 to 13.5.

So, I think that was one of the key matchups, and we failed in that regard. The rookies were well below .500, and that put pressure on the stars to win everything they played.

Next time, my "key matchup" is going to be "the team events." The U.S. simply has to come out of them ahead. We don't even have the edge in singles play anymore. The Euros whipped the U.S. butt in singles today, 8.5 to 3.5 - the same margin the U.S. would have needed to overcome their 10-6 deficit.

[Xt1ncT]

Originally Posted by Madriver

First of all ...THANK YOU Stewart Cink for shutting up Sergio!!!! s?

See below

Originally Posted by iacas

I think Sergio has plenty to squawk about. Cink put a damper on him, no doubt, but 4-1-0 led the way for the Euros, tying only with Westwood.

Exactly, and it's not like Sergio played bad - Cink had played really well.

Originally Posted by iacas

The point was made that many of the Europeans travel together and stay in the same hotels (because there may only be one or two at the site of European Tour events). I think it holds some water. They're more familiar with each other.

THank you - was yours truly who made that point. And yes it absolutely has some truth in it. You could see all through the weekend how much the Europeans wanted to win, and do it for each other. You could see in the celebrations afterwards how well they all get along - yes it's easy to celebrate a win, but do you think that the US would have been quite as enthusiastic? A couple of them maybe, but not Tiger, probably not Furyk.

Originally Posted by iacas

Tiger Woods is as good as he is, in part I believe, because he doesn't have many friends on Tour. Same with Jim Furyk, and he's one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. But friendly to his competition? That's not the American way, really. Maybe there's some truth to it all.

It's a strange one, all weekend ho looked to me as though he wanted to be anywhere BUT at the K Club. About the only smile we saw all weekend was when Stevie lost his nine iron into the river..!!! (That was quite funny)

I wonder if someone can answer this - is it a requirement of a US member of the PGA Tour that they play in the RC if they qualify?

[ragontona]

Yep, the cameraderie on the European team was cool to watch. I was actually jealous. I got the distinct sense that these guys actually enjoyed each others' company.

We used to have that going for us, back in the Azinger/Jacobson/Pavin/etc. era. And even though the caliber of player we have today may be better, they're not exactly "backyard-barbecue-at-my-place" kinda guys.

After Clarke finished up, I was watching him hugging his teammates, and it was a very emotional experience for all of them. My wife looked over at me and asked, "Can you imagine Phil and Tiger hugging after a round?"

She had a point...

[muskegman]

This was painful to watch. The U.S. boys couldn't gain any traction.

I think had the United States put some points on the board we'd have seen a more jovial, happy, and cohesive team. I don't know how any of us could expect the United States to enjoy themselves when they're having their asses handed to them. Poor play doesn't equal enjoyment.

When and if the United States plays well at the Ryder Cup we'll see more cohesive team, they'll seem like they're enjoying themselves, and they will start to bond. I can't blame them for being sour.

Johnson's hole in one was nice but it was like a cherry on a turd.

It amazes me that the top three players in the world play so tight when the Ryder Cup rolls around. I think they know they're going to lose. Something like that anyway.

Tiger can't get on a roll in alternate shot because he's relying on someone else. Why does Furyk have to hit balls into the water during key moments of the Ryder Cup?! Ugh.

Europe deserves the win.

[tartanjack]

I liked Furyk's quote that went something like, "Everyone wants answers and there's nobody up here who can give you one."

The fact is the U.S. was outplayed by Europe. Why? It's almost fruitless to speculate. But here are some thoughts:

Tiger Woods is the best player in the world and a supreme match player. But he is not a team player. His team play record in the Ryder Cup is abysmal.

Mickelson is not a world ranked player after mid-August. Did he prepare for the Ryder Cup the same way he does for a major? No. Thanks, Phil.

Furyk's failures are simply inexplicable. Losing to Casey, the hottest player in the world right now is understandable. But he just didn't get the same vibe going with Woods. Failure fed failure.

There's too much a social, economic and status chasm within the U.S. team to foster the shared joy of the Europeans. The second day, I believe, Verplank talked about looking up at the leaderboad and seeing nothing but blue in the "premier" U.S. matchups and what effect that had on him and the others. Woods may have taken Henry, Wetterich and Taylor to dinner, but those guys know they didn't have Michael Jordan winking at them from the gallery. I'd love to know if they all flew home together. I bet not.

During the Saturday team matches it occured to me that we'd have been better off sending a team of the top 12 money winners on the Nationwide Tour to do battle. They can play. They know pressure. And they're used to going low or going home. They are birdie machines because that's the only way they can survive and move on to the PGA Tour. The top guys on tour... they're no longer playing for a livelihood, and apparently, don't know how to summon their best when they don't personally take home the money and the trophy.

Every member of this team should be slammed in the press for their performance. Will that happen? I don't think so. They stunk. But the golfing press is much too timid to take on the top guys because they know they'll be cut off. Woods, Mickelson and Furyk, among others, don't need the press. And that sets up a situation where they're never held accountable to the degree they deserve.

Finally I don't blame Lehman all that much. He could be second guessed on a couple of counts, but he didn't miss crucial putts and consistently hit balls into the water. Of everyone involved, I feel saddest for him.

[Xt1ncT]

Originally Posted by muskegman

This was painful to watch. The U.S. boys couldn't gain any traction.

I think had the United States put some points on the board we'd have seen a more jovial, happy, and cohesive team. I don't know how any of us could expect the United States to enjoy themselves when they're having their asses handed to them. Poor play doesn't equal enjoyment.

When and if the United States plays well at the Ryder Cup we'll see more cohesive team, they'll seem like they're enjoying themselves, and they will start to bond. I can't blame them for being sour.

Johnson's hole in one was nice but it was like a cherry on a turd.

It amazes me that the top three players in the world play so tight when the Ryder Cup rolls around. I think they know they're going to lose. Something like that anyway.

Tiger can't get on a roll in alternate shot because he's relying on someone else. Why does Furyk have to hit balls into the water during key moments of the Ryder Cup?! Ugh.

Europe deserves the win.

The thing is, they weren't cohesive even before the start. You could see it on their faces. They are just NOT a unit like the Europeans. And if you don't really want to be there a la Tiger, subconciously that'll work against you.

And it was Verplank who had the HIO wasn't it?

[Madriver]

Originally Posted by iacas

I think Sergio has plenty to squawk about. Cink put a damper on him, no doubt, but 4-1-0 led the way for the Euros, tying only with Westwood.

Originally Posted by iacas

I think Sergio has plenty to squawk about. Cink put a damper on him, no doubt, but 4-1-0 led the way for the Euros, tying only with Westwood.

Sergios incredulous attitude especially on 14 while playing Cink got under my skin. His demeanor was condecending as if to say "Who in the hell are you to sink all these 20 footers"....I appreciated Stewart Cinks tenacity and fire by shutting Sergio down. Thanks for the one memorable match Stewart...great captains choice pick.

[scottishgolfer121]

Originally Posted by iacas

I think Sergio has plenty to squawk about. Cink put a damper on him, no doubt, but 4-1-0 led the way for the Euros, tying only with Westwood.



The point was made that many of the Europeans travel together and stay in the same hotels (because there may only be one or two at the site of European Tour events). I think it holds some water. They're more familiar with each other.

Tiger Woods is as good as he is, in part I believe, because he doesn't have many friends on Tour. Same with Jim Furyk, and he's one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. But friendly to his competition? That's not the American way, really. Maybe there's some truth to it all.

Now, let's see how badly I did in my predictions:





Had Furyk not lost his singles match, I'd have been right. Furyk didn't prove anything, and Tiger's 3-2-0 record is the weakest proof of anything I've ever seen. All it proved is that he can have a winning (barely) record in a Ryder Cup.



I was right. Though he tied with Lee Westwood, I'm still taking a win here, because I don't get many in other places.



Ooh, got another one. Mickelson played like a dog the entire week. While I previously didn't care one way or the other for Phil, things like this make me really, really dislike the oaf.



Uh, yeah, I was just a wee bit off here. Turns out the biggest disappointment were THE IRISH PLAYERS. Who'd have thunk it?


Let's see - Wetterich stunk up the joint (0-2-0), Taylor managed only a half (0-1-1), Johnson did okay (1-2-1), and JJ Henry tied everything (0-0-3). So the rookies were 1-5-5, or four points down from playing 0.500 ball. Shuffle things around - make them 3-3-5 instead - and the Ryder Cup ends 16.5 to 11.5 - much closer. Phil Mickelson's 0-4-1 record should have been at least 3-1-1. Do that and the U.S. wins comfortably, 14.5 to 13.5.

So, I think that was one of the key matchups, and we failed in that regard. The rookies were well below .500, and that put pressure on the stars to win everything they played.

Next time, my "key matchup" is going to be "the team events." The U.S. simply has to come out of them ahead. We don't even have the edge in singles play anymore. The Euros whipped the U.S. butt in singles today, 8.5 to 3.5 - the same margin the U.S. would have needed to overcome their 10-6 deficit.

Sorry but i think u r very unfair on Clarke he has just losed his wife but yet he comes out and does what he has 2 do and beat whats infront of him and he did and i think the Euro team, was a team and not like the US they looked spilt from each other! do u not think?