Do Woods Built with an Offset "Closed Face" Really Help Fight a Slice?

[EverythingGolf]

With the new ball flight laws it says if a golfer is coming OTT with a square club face and an out to in swing path it will cause a straight slice. If he is using an offset driver with a closed face than he would end up pull slicing the ball. What are your thoughts on this?

[Dave2278]

I would think that if the face is closed (to the target line) it would be closer to square with the club path.  If this is the case it would end up being a straighter ball flight, maybe even a straight pull.

[Gordon McTavish]

I thought that off-set was designed to push the CG further back from the hosel.  Through impact, does an off-set face perform any different to a non off-set face with regards to direction?

[B-Con]

Offset does almost nothing to change the clubface orientation at impact. If the face is open to the target line with no offset, then with offset it will be a fraction of a degree (maybe a full degree) less open at impact. It [b]might[/b] be enough to turn a slight, lazy fade into a straight shot, but it won't affect a full-blown slice noticeably. If the clubface is closed, then it depends on how out-to-in the swing path was. If the swing path was more out-to-in than the clubface is closed, then instead of hitting a straight slice they'll hit a slight pull-slice. Not a desirable shot, but more likely to find the fairway. If the out-to-in swing path was about the same as the closed face, then the result will be a fairly straight pull. (Final case omitted: If the out-to-in swing path was less than the closed face, they probably were only gently fading, not full-out slicing. At least, that's my guess.)

[sean_miller]

Drivers with an offset closed face are for people who don't have the patience to learn how to hit a proper drive. Or if they do, they're going about it backwards anyway. That kind of driver is so counterintuitive it's almost like a practical joke or novelty item.

Being able to hit a straight shot, with some pop, is not a new concept. Learning to use the flight of the ball as your guide isn't new either. Why do some people choose to make this game so hard on themselves?

[grandaddy510]

^making it harder by trying to find a way to make it easier lol. its marketed towards mid to high cappers like me, most of who are looking for the miracle swing fix. when i was coming ott and slicing i tried putting an r9 on draw, didn't help me one bit. so i spent countless nights on the range (free buckets lol) trying to hit draws with the fade setting hosel. now i hit slight draws, and play a slight open face with my irons at address.

[zeg]

My driver has a draw bias, and it certainly doesn't get rid of my tendency for a moderately strong fade.  However, I don't buy that it's as harmful a "feature" as people believe.  It just doesn't really do what it claims.

It actually probably does slightly reduce the tendency to slice/fade, but since that is usually mostly caused by the out-to-in swing, it's just going to turn it into a pull.  If your problem is that you have an in-to-out swing and you don't quite close up the club face, then maybe it'd help, but that's a pretty rare minority.  Still, mine is only (IIRC) a degree biased, and, based on experimental evidence, that is smaller than the errors in my swing.

All else equal, I'd have gone for an unbiased club, but this one was a gift and I'm not worried enough (or seeing enough problems) to run screaming for a replacement.  My driver ball flight is as repeatable and accurate as any of my unbiased clubs.

[Gerald]

Don't know .... I never tried, but I have a natural baby fade and after having tried many drivers and hitting many buckets (also free at our course for the clubmembers) my better drives are dead straight, now that I come slightly more from the inside and focus staying behind the ball more than I used to.

My swingpath is inside-square-inside at best ...... I have been trying with an adjustable driver last few months ...... Neutral brings me the above and only if I really focus on inside-square-outside I might find a slight draw now and then....... nice to see and then the topspin/drawspin adds more roll than my natural swing.

I have tried the open setting, which is recommended for better players ....... oughhhhh not for me...... fade became almost slice, last saturday I tried closed 1.5* and well I actually hit some very nice draws, without changing anything to my natural swing ........ But personally I think it is best to work on my swing and at some point reach these results with a "better" swing ........ although I feel against fighting my natural swing ...... so putting the head closed, might be a sound idea.

I find the 1.5* closed a bit too much, something between 0.5* and 1.0* would be enough for me, so I am thinking of the new 910 D2........

[jamo]

It depends on what kind of a slice you have. With a neutral-faced driver, if your path is square to your target and the face is open (a push slice) then yes, a closed face could help. However, if with a neutral-faced driver your path is out-to-in relative to the target and your face is square to the target (straight slice) or your path is out-to-in relative to the target and your face is closed to the target (though open to the path, pull slice) you will end up hitting pulls or pull-hooks with a closed face. Hope that makes sense.

Offset is another beast altogether. It has no affect on face angle or path, it just changes the COG. That could help some people hit it higher, but it won't do anything for your slice.

[Stretch]

If initial shot direction is 85% determined by the face angle, then a draw-biased driver is always going to start the ball to the left of a square-face driver, all else being equal. Additionally, assuming a slicer's out-to-in swing path, it's also going to apply incrementally less fade spin -- as the further left you orient the club face, the closer you come to hitting a straight pull with face and path aligned.

That's my theory, anyway.

[Dave2278]

Originally Posted by Gerald

........ although I feel against fighting my natural swing ...... so putting the head closed, might be a sound idea.

I don't like trying to change my swing at all.
I have a natural draw, my mishits are a  terrible duck!

I usually only miss when I am trying to get cute with it, so I just don't fight my natural swing.

The only way I can hit a fade is to open my stance to the target and swing along my normal path, I never try to change my swing.

[Gordon McTavish]

Originally Posted by Stretch

If initial shot direction is 85% determined by the face angle, then a draw-biased driver is always going to start the ball to the left of a square-face driver, all else being equal. Additionally, assuming a slicer's out-to-in swing path, it's also going to apply incrementally less fade spin -- as the further left you orient the club face, the closer you come to hitting a straight pull with face and path aligned.

That's my theory, anyway.

Which implies the only kind of "draw" that would be produced by a draw-biased club would be a pull-draw.

I guess it's the same with fade-biased clubs... if they are set up with an open-face, then surely the most likely outcome is either a push-fade or push-draw.

[basscat348]

All the offset does is help generate lift for people that cant get the ball airborne.

[WUTiger]

Quote:

Drivers with an offset closed face are for people who don't have the patience to learn how to hit a proper drive. Or if they do, they're going about it backwards anyway. That kind of driver is so counterintuitive it's almost like a practical joke or novelty item. ...

My previous driver came labeled as having a "square face." But, I found that once I got warmed up for the season, my mishits tended to hook into the first or second cut of rough.

Took it to a local golf shop, and got on the launch monitor. Turned out I had my straightest hits when I was 1 to 2 degrees open. On measurement, the clubface was 2 degrees closed. My current driver is definitely square faced. A solid drive tends to be straight, or have a slight draw.