My Swing (Jetfan1983)

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by logman

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

Yea, I definitely agree with that. Amazing up and down percentages for those older veterans that I need more of in my game. I'm making it a goal this year to become an up and down machine. Improving my misses around the greens with the full swing will be a major part of improving that though as it is certainly difficult to save par when I miss a green by 30 yards.

Do you want to borrow my chipper?

If you mean a wood chipper, then yea

[logman]

ha!

[logman]

serious though, is there a no chipper policy?

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by logman

serious though, is there a no chipper policy?

I'm sorry, I'm not really following you. Are you referring to me using a chipper club around the greens?

[logman]

Yeah Jetfan, You were talking before about tightening up those up and downs from around the green. Do you use one?

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by logman

Yeah Jetfan, You were talking before about tightening up those up and downs from around the green. Do you use one?

I actually do own a chipper, but I got it as a gift from a friend about a year and a half ago. I've messed around with it a little bit, but did not feel overly compelled to use it on the course.

I could certainly improve my technique when I'm fairly close to the green though: conventional chips and pitches where not a whole lot is being asked of me. Usually when I'm 10 yards or so off the putting surface, I have fairly decent up and down percentages.

But my biggest problem with short game can more or less be traced to my full swing; namely, when I miss by a good 30 yards left or right of where I'm aiming. Or if I even have something like 50 yards for my 3rd shot on a par 4. Those kinds of up and downs are not realistic, and I, like anyone would, struggle with those, especially if I end up facing a lot of them during a tough round of ball striking.

So essentially, what I was saying earlier is that my short game numbers would improve dramatically if I missing by less on my approach shots. Certainly, I could get a better conventional short game -- I don't doubt that at all -- and mostly, I need to practice it more. But I devote the majority of my practice to the full swing as IMO that's what's holding me back the most. I'm not trying to hit 18/18 GIR though. I know that's not really realistic for me anytime soon. But increasing it from 6/18 to 9/18 would do wonders for my scores, especially if proximity to the hole was improving too, which it naturally would be with a couple more greens hit.

Right now, frankly, my miss variance is just too high with the full swing... I've traced some of this to just really poor tempo, like over-swinging, and I've recently been able to improve on that by trying to think "swing gracefully" or "stay in control." I think that alone will help with this, regardless of mechanical improvements, which I am focusing on doing too with Mvmac thru evolvr, which I would recommend to anyone.

I haven't practiced in six days though because I sprained my wrist recently (overswinging). I'm hoping tomorrow will be my return to the range as I want to be absolutely sure its healed before hitting balls again. It was getting tedious icing it six or seven times a night after pounding balls on the practice tee for two hours.

[logman]

OK, so you're 150 meters out, dead straight shot, going straight for the pin. What club, what swing thought, what percentage would you get(if you had 10 shots in a row). I can't believe that you would miss that often.

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by logman

OK, so you're 150 meters out, dead straight shot, going straight for the pin. What club, what swing thought, what percentage would you get(if you had 10 shots in a row). I can't believe that you would miss that often.

I usually hit about 6/18 GIR when I play, but on the 12 greens I miss, it can be by a lot. Like I said, I never really understood that I was over-swinging until like a week or two ago.

From 150 meters/164 yards with perfect, flat conditions, I can use an 8-iron or a 7-iron. 8-iron I run the risk of being short. 7-iron I run the risk of being long. Its hard to answer because recently I was experimenting with using a 6-iron from about 155 yards just trying to chip the ball out there. That might be the smarter play going forward.

The one time I was on trackman, I had a 91 MPH swing speed with 6-iron and averaged about 188.0 yards of carry, but that was when I swung with a faster tempo, so it's hard for me to pinpoint what exactly my distances are right now -- slowing my tempo down has been a big change for me.

What swing thought I'd use is hard for me say right now. Usually its "bow my wrist" because I struggle with a flat left wrist at impact. That's largely because I don't bring my arms down fast enough (unloading #4 to use a TGM term), but its helpful to me because I understand now its limitations.

Mike (Mvmac) is getting me to work on the way my arms are loading on the backswing right now, so maybe I'll have to use that swing thought, I don't know. But that's what I'll be working on for next time -- which will probably be tomorrow.

But generally, I'll miss a green because a) I'll hit a tee shot OB or in a hazard b) I'll hit a tee shot into a spot where it's difficult to hit the green c) I'll overswing my iron shot and get poor contact (toe and thin usually) and it will overdraw or hook it or d) my not-so-good mechanics will get the better of me and I'll just miss.

But from 150 meters, I'd probably hit the green around half the time maybe? Depending on the day? I dunno, you raise a good question. It's hard for me to say.

I feel confident that with my new, slower tempo I will control flight a lot better going forward.

I will say though, that when the ball is below my feet, I have been struggling like crazy to get good contact.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by logman

OK, so you're 150 meters out, dead straight shot, going straight for the pin. What club, what swing thought, what percentage would you get(if you had 10 shots in a row). I can't believe that you would miss that often.

Before he gets to any of that, he needs to break out his calculator. ;)  Psst ... (I think it's something like 164 yards) :)

Logman, just messing with you.  However, I tend to agree with you ... Jetfan's swing looks a lot more solid than he's making it out to be in that post.  (I think he's just being really modest) :)

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

I usually hit about 6/18 GIR when I play, but on the 12 greens I miss, it can be by a lot. Like I said, I never really understood that I was over-swinging until like a week or two ago.

From 150 meters/164 yards with perfect, flat conditions, I can use an 8-iron or a 7-iron. 8-iron I run the risk of being short. 7-iron I run the risk of being long. Its hard to answer because recently I was experimenting with using a 6-iron from about 155 yards just trying to chip the ball out there. That might be the smarter play going forward.

The one time I was on trackman, I had a 91 MPH swing speed with 6-iron and averaged about 188.0 yards of carry, but that was when I swung with a faster tempo, so it's hard for me to pinpoint what exactly my distances are right now -- slowing my tempo down has been a big change for me.

What swing thought I'd use is hard for me say right now. Usually its "bow my wrist" because I struggle with a flat left wrist at impact. That's largely because I don't bring my arms down fast enough (unloading #4 to use a TGM term), but its helpful to me because I understand now its limitations.

Mike (Mvmac) is getting me to work on the way my arms are loading on the backswing right now, so maybe I'll have to use that swing thought, I don't know. But that's what I'll be working on for next time -- which will probably be tomorrow.

But generally, I'll miss a green because a) I'll hit a tee shot OB or in a hazard b) I'll hit a tee shot into a spot where it's difficult to hit the green c) I'll overswing my iron shot and get poor contact (toe and thin usually) and it will overdraw or hook it or d) my not-so-good mechanics will get the better of me and I'll just miss.

But from 150 meters, I'd probably hit the green around half the time maybe? Depending on the day? I dunno, you raise a good question. It's hard for me to say.

I feel confident that with my new, slower tempo I will control flight a lot better going forward.

I will say though, that when the ball is below my feet, I have been struggling like crazy to get good contact.

Funny, I have been having a heck of a time lately when the ball is ABOVE my feet.  Otherwise, all you described above sounds a lot like me, especially all of your misses (Bad tee shots, and toed and thin irons).  That is exactly what I do.  (I just do it all with a swing that is much less pleasing to the eye ;))

I geuss it makes sense, then, that we tend to be working on a lot of the same stuff (like the elbows right now :))

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Quote:

Originally Posted by logman

OK, so you're 150 meters out, dead straight shot, going straight for the pin. What club, what swing thought, what percentage would you get(if you had 10 shots in a row). I can't believe that you would miss that often.

Before he gets to any of that, he needs to break out his calculator. ;)  Psst ... (I think it's something like 164 yards) :)

Logman, just messing with you.  However, I tend to agree with you ... Jetfan's swing looks a lot more solid than he's making it out to be in that post.  (I think he's just being really modest) :)

It looks solid, but I'm still a newb in many, many ways.

I was using my 8-iron from about 145 yards the last time I played, just trying to stay in total control, and it was working well for me... but twice I hit a few 20 yards over the green. It showed me that perhaps I did not fully understand why I can hit the ball with power.

But I just don't have much experience out there.  I make up for that with how much I read and study, but nothing trumps practice, experience, and just years upon years of playing this game.

I'd be lying if I said I didn't have days where I've thought about quitting.... but then about 5 minutes pass, and I can't wait to get out there again.

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Funny, I have been having a heck of a time lately when the ball is ABOVE my feet.  Otherwise, all you described above sounds a lot like me, especially all of your misses (Bad tee shots, and toed and thin irons).  That is exactly what I do.  (I just do it all with a swing that is much less pleasing to the eye ;))

I geuss it makes sense, then, that we tend to be working on a lot of the same stuff (like the elbows right now :))

The above the feet shot is my bread and butter. My guess is because of my poor elbow positioning, but since you are sort of suffering from that too somewhat, then I'm probably wrong there. When I see the ball is below my feet, especially if its fairly significant, I know I am completely ****ed. It's hard to find places to practice this shot.

Yea, I'd post my evolvr lesson on here just to show you guys what Mike wants me to do, but I doubt that's kosher. Maybe there should be a private section of the forum here where evolvr members could post their lessons.

But yea, we don't want my elbow to get behind me. Mainly though, Mike wants me to load my arms across the chest better with a better fold rate in the trail arm to allow the arms to go "up" more. I need more "war chant" to use a David Orr term. Focusing on applying the correct amount of pressure in my trail armpit is important too, in order to control that trail elbow location.

I really, really want to fix this as fast as possible because I really want to move on to working on unloading #4 soon. I really want to fix that badly. But we just aren't there yet. I don't like how my lead arm stays loaded too much on the downswing, and as a result, I have to palmar flex to keep the left wrist flat. This can cause serious overdraws because palmaring is difficult to get right sometimes.

[Beachcomber]

Having the ball above or below your feet - try modifying your ball position and stance line.

When the ball is above my feet - I play it more forward in my stance.  I also close my stance line a little. I will try and feel the club load more 'in' on the backswing.

When the ball is below my feet - I play it more back in my stance.  And I open my stance line a little.  I will try and feel the club load more 'out' on the backswing.

Note, when the ball is below my feet - I try to crouch or squat more - almost like a bunker shot and keep my lower COG steady and balanced.  So I will club up, choke down, and swing a little easier.

[JetFan1983]

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

Having the ball above or below your feet - try modifying your ball position and stance line.

When the ball is above my feet - I play it more forward in my stance.  I also close my stance line a little. I will try and feel the club load more 'in' on the backswing.

When the ball is below my feet - I play it more back in my stance.  And I open my stance line a little.  I will try and feel the club load more 'out' on the backswing.

Note, when the ball is below my feet - I try to crouch or squat more - almost like a bunker shot and keep my lower COG steady and balanced.  So I will club up, choke down, and swing a little easier.

Thanks, Beach! I crouch more, try to keep some knee flex, and maybe raise the handle a little bit, but I don't open my stance or play the ball farther back.

If there's one thing I've learned it sucks big time to early extend when playing the ball below the feet!

Appreciate the help, man. I'll try that for next time.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

Thanks, Beach! I crouch more, try to keep some knee flex, and maybe raise the handle a little bit, but I don't open my stance or play the ball farther back.

If there's one thing I've learned it sucks big time to early extend when playing the ball below the feet!

Appreciate the help, man. I'll try that for next time.

Yeah, definitely change the ball position.  The stance line is what I do - just to ensure my feels.... The reason is that the ball below your feet - you are most likely going to cut it and hit it right (as a right handed golfer).  So I try and swing Out to In to follow the ball flight laws.

[Beachcomber]

Here is a video from Chuck Evans on the ball below your feet.  Looks like lowering the handle can help hit the ball straight - or prevent that push/slice.

And opposite - raise the handle for ball above your feet.

[JetFan1983]

Lol.... so raising the handle might have not been the best idea.... Oopsies. Thanks again, Beach.

I also found this post from Erik from 2011 on this too:

Originally Posted by iacas

Ball below your feet effectively makes the lie angle more upright, which tends to point the face more to the right (the more loft, the more of this effect).

Wider stance, knees more bent, stand a little closer to the ball... and make sure your aim is good. That's about all I try to do.

Thanks, guys.

[mvmac]

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

The above the feet shot is my bread and butter. My guess is because of my poor elbow positioning, but since you are sort of suffering from that too somewhat, then I'm probably wrong there. When I see the ball is below my feet, especially if its fairly significant, I know I am completely ****ed. It's hard to find places to practice this shot.

Yea, I'd post my evolvr lesson on here just to show you guys what Mike wants me to do, but I doubt that's kosher. Maybe there should be a private section of the forum here where evolvr members could post their lessons.

The biggest issue with that is when other people watch another guy's video, they all think they need the same fix Private forum is an interesting idea but don't get your hopes up lol  Also I wouldn't call your elbow positions "poor", just need to be aware of it and make it "softer" earlier rather than rigid where it slides behind you.  Fool around with a tee in your arm pit and watch that 5SK video with Dave and Erik before you go hit balls so you have that image in your head.

You and Beach are too damn hard on yourselves lol