how many people do you know that lie about their score?

[dak4n6]

Originally Posted by tuffluck

wow, the whole shift key debacle is quite interesting.  sorry you guys are so offended.

It's not a debacle and we're not offended. Annoyed would be more accurate. It's just hard to read lots of sentances back to back without caps, and it really does not take much effort to press shift.

[Golfingdad]

itdoesnttakeanymoreeffortthanitdoestohitthespacebarorpressenterorusepunctuationbutyouatleastdothatmuchwhynotalsouseshift

[dak4n6]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

itdoesnttakeanymoreeffortthanitdoestohitthespacebarorpressenterorusepunctuationbutyouatleastdothatmuchwhynotalsouseshift

couldnthavetypeditanybettermyselfwelldonehaha

[Chas]

Now that you know that some people are irritated by your laziness on the keyboard, why are you still doing it? Makes you wonder what you'd be like to play with. IME the better the player truly is, the more accurate his scoring is.

[ejimsmith]

wow about the shift key.   those that are offended (or annoyed) are showing great ignorance in the "norms" of online etiquette.

hey gramps!   shift key is sooooooooo 1990's brah!

[NM Golf]

Originally Posted by ejimsmith

wow about the shift key.   those that are offended (or annoyed) are showing great ignorance in the "norms" of online etiquette.

hey gramps!   shift key is sooooooooo 1990's brah!

Not offended its just irritating and more difficult to read. I mean why come on an internet forum then make every post difficult to read? Its just common courtesy, but then again there's nothing common about courtesy anymore.

[Ernest Jones]

betweentheshiftkeyandotherworldlyballstrikingithinkillpassopnfurthertuffluckposts

[el shanko]

Originally Posted by NM Golf

Not offended its just irritating and more difficult to read. I mean why come on an internet forum then make every post difficult to read? Its just common courtesy, but then again there's nothing common about courtesy anymore.

shoot this trash is nothing compared to shitty reports that i have to PLOW through and decipher go ahead and read text messages, now i am

[el shanko]

Originally Posted by Chas

Now that you know that some people are irritated by your laziness on the keyboard, why are you still doing it? Makes you wonder what you'd be like to play with.

IME the better the player truly is, the more accurate his scoring is.

He haS poSted the pEople tHat hAs particiPated in tHis worldly gAme with hiM........

[JasonStreet]

Most of my golfing buddies do a little adjusting for the most part. But if we are every playing seriously or really trying to measure our skills, we try to be as honest as we can. Meaning we hope we are calculating our scores correctly.

[newtogolf]

I don't think people lie about their scores, but based on the Rules of Golf, they do cheat.  During rounds I play for handicap I follow all the rules I'm aware of.  Quite often my playing partners will offer me to improve my lie or take a mulligan, which I always decline, but in their minds it's a perfectly acceptable practice.

It doesn't bother me what they do except at the end of a round when we post our scores into the clubs system and they call me a sandbagger because my posted scores cause my handicap to be higher than theirs.  They prefer to view it as I'm sandbagging when they in reality are playing with vanity handicaps.

[RetroJFrancisco]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

I don't think people lie about their scores, but based on the Rules of Golf, they do cheat.  During rounds I play for handicap I follow all the rules I'm aware of.  Quite often my playing partners will offer me to improve my lie or take a mulligan, which I always decline, but in their minds it's a perfectly acceptable practice.

It doesn't bother me what they do except at the end of a round when we post our scores into the clubs system and they call me a sandbagger because my posted scores cause my handicap to be higher than theirs.  They prefer to view it as I'm sandbagging when they in reality are playing with vanity handicaps.

Hmm, when practicing on my own or with mates I routinely improve my lie if sitting down terribly in the rough.. It would never get to a point where I would think of that as acceptable in a competition, but still .. its bad practice..

[Parker0065]

OP,

Your numbers are probably not too far off but as others mentioned better players tend to play with better players. At my home course there are three of us that play to a scratch level, another 5-6 that break 80 from time to time, another 8-10 that have broken 80 at least once or have been close, then there's everyone else that score in the 85-100 range. The three of us don't exclusively just play with each other but we do play together quite often. We also basically hand pick who we are willing to play with on a regular basis and it's usually those that can break 80 or are close. For me it's all about the rythym and pace of the game. Even when playing with higher handicaps that play fast, it still effects the flow of the round. To do that occasionaly is one thing, but to do that day in and day out would get old fast.

For example a while back I got stuck with a couple guy's in a cart(I always walk) and on the first tee they both skunk it in the woods. Ok, so they have to go look for their balls, no big deal. They race ahead to the woods while I start walking down the fairway and by the time I caught up they had either found or dropped balls. So I stop and wait for them to hit and both players chunk it about 75 yards. They race ahead to their ball(at this point they are about halfway to my drive) and I start walking again, catch up and wait for them to hit. They both finally made decent contact on their 3rd shots and hit it past my drive. They jump in their cart and race up to my ball while I start walking,,,again. They pull up to my ball and look back at me with this expression of like "Waiting On You Dude"! That basically got repeated over the entire front nine so at the turn I told them I think I left the stove on at home and went to hit balls at the range,,,lol!

As far as cheating or inaccurate scoring. I think so much of it comes from ignorance of the rules and or some players who are just out there to whack a ball and don't care about rules. Obviously there are out right cheaters and liars but overall I think most people are generally honest but ignorant to the rules. Other than rule infractions probably the one other thing that really effects scoring is gimme's from the 2-3 foot range justified as a means of speeding up play. For myself gimme's are an absolute no,no but I don't have a problem with higher handicaps using gimme's in a non tournament round because I do think it helps speed up play. Basically how close you follow the rules always comes out in stroke play tournaments. All of a sudden players that claim they break 80 all the time struggle to break 90. Sucks when they actually have to make those 3-4 footers for real!!!

[CR McDivot]

OP whines about folks not scoring "properly, My Way", and continues to ignore reasonably expected English language rules!

Why bother...

but no comment on acceptable USGA Stableford?

Maybe OP just wants to bitch about others while covering his own faults?

[CR McDivot]

BTW...

All you folks who want to bitch about high cappers or recreational golfers holding up your so excellent and speedy games...

Why not encourage the hacks to play Stableford, Par, or Match to speed their game, rather than whining that they cheat while being coerced into strict stroke play?

Remember... were it not for the hacks, you would have no place to flout your superior skill but on PRIVATE Club courses!

[Wisguy]

I know a guy who plays a lot more than I do who typically scores 7-15 lower than me.  There have been times, though, when he's claiming he's 20 strokes better, I start to look back at the holes we played, the number of holes where my drive was 20+ yards further down the fairway, when we both had GIR, and there's no way that I had that many blow-up holes and he had that many pars and birdies.    I wonder how many strokes the real difference would be taking into consideration the fact that I play my ball where it lies and, well, he fiddles at least a third of his shots.  But we don't play for money so I guess I really don't care that much.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by tuffluck

anyway, when i do get a chance to play with players who appear to be really good, they make up rules a lot more than i would expect to see, and hence their scoring is not accurate.

I play with players of different abilities and scoring averages.  Some are out there just to have time away from their family/work - stress reliever.

And the biggest areas that I see where the rules are 'bent' are on two items...

OB - Stroke and Distance

In Socal it isn't uncommon to have a 6hr round on a weekend here in Orange County.  So if a guy hits a ball near OB - but there is possibility that it is in bounds, the guy hits a provisional - in case the original ball is OB... If the provisional goes OB - or near OB.  Then we just say - "Lets go look and see if we can find the first ball."  If we get out there and find that the first ball is indeed OB.  Then the provisional is in play.  If the provisional happened to go OB too... Then instead of going back to the tee box and pissing everyone off (our group included - and the groups behind us - due to slow play)... We typically just have the guy drop it near the OB area and play it as the 6th shot (two lost balls/OB).  We know this isn't 100% by the rules, but again, if we are in a casual round - we want to keep moving and not hold up the course.

Gimme Putts

Again, due to slow play - if a putt is inside of say 2ft... Typically we just have the guy pick it up.  Of course, if he refuses to pick it up and putt it out - and misses - then we laugh at him and make him count it the stroke.

I would say outside of these two items... The guys I play with are all pretty good at following the rules of golf.  Playing the ball down everywhere... And not lieing about their score.

Lastly, one thing that does kind of bother me is when I play against guys who 'Adjust' their scores while playing.  Instead of playing the hole out - will say that they have Equitable Stroke Control - and can't take higher than a X or whatever.  I've only ran into a few of these types during my time playing this lovely game, but they are out there and I get a little annoyed at how they seem to think that they can just pick up on that particular hole because they can't score higher than X.

For reference:

Equitable Stroke Control Chart

Course Handicap	Maximum Score
0-9	Double Bogey
10-19	7
20-29	8
30-39	9
40 or more	10

[turtleback]

Originally Posted by dak4n6

Agree. How much energy does pressing Shift really drain from you?

And, you must play with a lot of suck-ass players. Most of the folks I play with at my club play the ball down and are between 4 - 12 caps.

4-12 caps?  Must be short messages.  LOL

Originally Posted by RetroJFrancisco

Its funny you say that about cheating yourself, because golf may be one of the only sports in which cheating could only harm your chances of winning in the future.. You cheat, your handicap goes down, you win less.. Its quite remarkable.. haha.

In my experience the people who, shall we say, miscount and have a lack of awareness of the rules, are not serious enough to be maintaining handicaps in many (most) cases.  Most of the people I have played with that have handicaps play by the rules and count their strokes correctly.  And with an 18.8 index it is not a case of me playing with just low handicappers.  I get the opportunity occasionally but usually play with people in my own range of handicap or people who are recreational golfers with no handicap.  The former play by the rules and can count and the latter are just out to have a good time and really don't care about improving or even knowing how good or bad they actually are.

Originally Posted by RetroJFrancisco

Hmm, when practicing on my own or with mates I routinely improve my lie if sitting down terribly in the rough.. It would never get to a point where I would think of that as acceptable in a competition, but still .. its bad practice..

Yeah, especially when you have aspirations of playing professionally.  You are obviously a serious player so why would you do that?  Golf is about overcoming obstacles, not side-stepping them.