Feedback Wanted!!

[Chunk]

Hey everyone.  New to the site.  Fairly new to the sport.

A little background: I got the bug last May and have not looked back since. I just turned 40 and I have no idea what took me so long. I love the game..... I think... haha. Really, I do... wait... yea... I'm pretty sure I like it most of the time. My first round last year was a 116.  I started breaking 100 after a month or so and started breaking 90 after 3 more months.  Best round was an 83 on a par 71 with a slope of 117.  Anyway, I bought some cheap clubs off of ebay Cleveland TA7's and a Cleveland Launcher DST 10.5*. All clubs have regular flex shafts.

First question: I am currently club shopping.  And it seems to me that the guys working at Golf Galaxy and Golfsmith just seem to push on me what they may or may not have alot of in stock... I dont know.  It just seems really impersonal and nonchallant.  Is this how it is?  Or should I try a mom and pop place?

Second question:  I hate how I can feel the clubs flexing when I swing.  I feel that my hands are way ahead of the club head at where impact should be.  Needless to say, I have grown some confidence with my swing and I swing hard but with my current clubs I get a lot of pushes and slices.  Would stiffer shafts really help?  AVG swing speed with driver is 98 MPH according to the Golfsmith machine.

Third question:  I have hit some of the new adjustable drivers.  Both of the people assisting me have been pushing some of the more adjustable (R1, 913, etc...) where I am kinda favoring the PING G25.  Mainly because its only slightly adjustable and I am worried that if I had a driver that could adjust in 168 different ways, I would start tinkering too much with the driver instead of my swing.  What have you guys found.  Are these super adjustable drivers good for a player or do they become swing crutches?

Forth question:  Shafts.  I want to get clubs and shafts that help me to get a higher ball launch/flight.  I hear this is a part of it.

Fifth question:  How helpful are lessons.  I am and always have been very good at sports.  Baseball was my best as I played in college and some years after.  I usually pick things up to where I am above average in a short time.  This little game of golf is the hardest thing I have ever played.  Hands down.

Thanks in advance for any input and thanks in advance for reading my book I just wrote.  I have been reading through this site for months and have finally joined due to the simple fact that I love the game and could talk about it for hours and there seems to be some decent players on here that I could learn a thing or 2 from.

[bjwestner]

Welcome Chunk.  Like yourself, I got the bug last June myself.  I had never played golf before but since then I golf as much as I can.  It sounds like you and me are similar in that we are new to the game and have been lucky enough to improve pretty quickly.  I'm just hoping that the trend continues for both of us......

Regarding your questions.....I do not buy my clubs anymore from GG or Golfsmith.  I will try clubs out there to find out what I like, but then I will search online and buy the club that way.  It is usually much cheaper and there are lots of great deals to be found online and even on Ebay for brand new clubs.

Regarding shaft flex.  I am far from an expert.  I will say that I have a similar swing speed and a few months ago bought new irons based on numbers obtained from my swing speed/etc.  I got irons that had a stiff shaft in them.  They were not for me.  All shafts are not created equal, just because both may be labeled "stiff" does not mean anything.  To find what will work for you will require you trying out what is available.  Since your ss is close to 100 then stiff shafts are probably the way to go but since they are not the same, one stiff shaft may be too stiff or not have the right kick point for your swing.  So basically it's trial and error.  Using the numbers/stats will point you in the right direction but only you can know if it's right.

[clearwaterms]

Originally Posted by Chunk

Hey everyone.  New to the site.  Fairly new to the sport.

First question: I am currently club shopping.  And it seems to me that the guys working at Golf Galaxy and Golfsmith just seem to push on me what they may or may not have alot of in stock... I dont know.  It just seems really impersonal and nonchallant.  Is this how it is?  Or should I try a mom and pop place?

Second question:  I hate how I can feel the clubs flexing when I swing.  I feel that my hands are way ahead of the club head at where impact should be.  Needless to say, I have grown some confidence with my swing and I swing hard but with my current clubs I get a lot of pushes and slices.  Would stiffer shafts really help?  AVG swing speed with driver is 98 MPH according to the Golfsmith machine.

Third question:  I have hit some of the new adjustable drivers.  Both of the people assisting me have been pushing some of the more adjustable (R1, 913, etc...) where I am kinda favoring the PING G25.  Mainly because its only slightly adjustable and I am worried that if I had a driver that could adjust in 168 different ways, I would start tinkering too much with the driver instead of my swing.  What have you guys found.  Are these super adjustable drivers good for a player or do they become swing crutches?

Forth question:  Shafts.  I want to get clubs and shafts that help me to get a higher ball launch/flight.  I hear this is a part of it.

Fifth question:  How helpful are lessons.  I am and always have been very good at sports.  Baseball was my best as I played in college and some years after.  I usually pick things up to where I am above average in a short time.  This little game of golf is the hardest thing I have ever played.  Hands down.

I am not an expert, but I play one on the internet (and lets face it, if you want a real expert you shouldn't go looking on the internet) that being said, I will take a stab at answering your questions with the best of my ability.

1: Get fit, Golf Galaxy, Golfsmith, etc. all offer fittings, but the quality of the fitting will vary from store to store and employee to employee.  In my experience golf club purchases are as much mental as they are physical.  So hitting lots of different clubs to get an impression of feel, swing and how the club looks at address.  My point is that all golf clubs are good, if you like it, and its properly fit, it will be the best tool for you.

2: Golf club shafts come in lots of different flavors, different weights, different flexes, flighted vs nonflighted, different tip stiffness, etc.  Getting a quality fitting will give you a good idea on what kind of shaft works for you.  As a rule of thumb, a stiffer flexed shaft will give you less feel of the shaft flexing, but going to stiff would become board like and you lose the feeling of where the club head is.  As for the slice, that is more than likely a swing fault and not an equipment fault.

3: the adjustable drivers are nice when you are just starting off because you are going to find that your swing adjusts, so having the ability to continually dial in your driver "should" provide you a benefit in the long run.

4: see answer 2

5: Lessons again depends on the person giving the lessons.  People will give different opinions of the value of golf lessons.  You should have a clear idea of what you want out of golf lessons before you go in, and that will help you identify the value when you come out.  Erik (the owner of our beloved TST) is an instructor and he has said that he works with a golfers current swing to make them a better golfer.  I remember him posting before, that too often a golfer gets a lesson, plays better for a while, then starts to play worse, reverts back to the way they played before and then says golf lessons are a waste of money.  However, people like me, who couldn't break 100 before taking lessons and now considers a bad round anything over 90 and hopes to knock another 5 strokes off his game this year.

[tristanhilton85]

Originally Posted by Chunk

Hey everyone.  New to the site.  Fairly new to the sport.

A little background: I got the bug last May and have not looked back since. I just turned 40 and I have no idea what took me so long. I love the game..... I think... haha. Really, I do... wait... yea... I'm pretty sure I like it most of the time. My first round last year was a 116.  I started breaking 100 after a month or so and started breaking 90 after 3 more months.  Best round was an 83 on a par 71 with a slope of 117.  Anyway, I bought some cheap clubs off of ebay Cleveland TA7's and a Cleveland Launcher DST 10.5*. All clubs have regular flex shafts.

First question: I am currently club shopping.  And it seems to me that the guys working at Golf Galaxy and Golfsmith just seem to push on me what they may or may not have alot of in stock... I dont know.  It just seems really impersonal and nonchallant.  Is this how it is?  Or should I try a mom and pop place?

They might be doing that... but no guarantee that a smaller store wouldn't try to do the same thing. However, you should seek out somebody that can do a good fitting for you.

Originally Posted by Chunk

Second question:  I hate how I can feel the clubs flexing when I swing.  I feel that my hands are way ahead of the club head at where impact should be.  Needless to say, I have grown some confidence with my swing and I swing hard but with my current clubs I get a lot of pushes and slices.  Would stiffer shafts really help?  AVG swing speed with driver is 98 MPH according to the Golfsmith machine.

As I said above, find a fitter... they will make sure that you have the right shaft for your swing.

Originally Posted by Chunk

Third question:  I have hit some of the new adjustable drivers.  Both of the people assisting me have been pushing some of the more adjustable (R1, 913, etc...) where I am kinda favoring the PING G25.  Mainly because its only slightly adjustable and I am worried that if I had a driver that could adjust in 168 different ways, I would start tinkering too much with the driver instead of my swing.  What have you guys found.  Are these super adjustable drivers good for a player or do they become swing crutches?

No matter how much/little adjustablity a club has, it won't fix a bad thing. Think of it as the last step to fine tune a fitting. A good fitter will find the right club for your swing and then help you adjust it so you get the most out of it.

Originally Posted by Chunk

Forth question:  Shafts.  I want to get clubs and shafts that help me to get a higher ball launch/flight.  I hear this is a part of it.

Same answer as for the second question. A good fitter will help you find the right shaft, not only for flex but also to optimize your launch.

Originally Posted by Chunk

Fifth question:  How helpful are lessons.  I am and always have been very good at sports.  Baseball was my best as I played in college and some years after.  I usually pick things up to where I am above average in a short time.  This little game of golf is the hardest thing I have ever played.  Hands down.

Lessons are a good idea. Find a good instructor and go from there; maybe before you even get new sticks. Don't think that the instruction has to be in person either. Evolvr does great work... you send them video of your swing and they reply back to you.

If you do find a local instructor here is a link to help you out: http://thesandtrap.com/b/playing_tips/the_instructor_quiz_nine_questions_youve_gotta_ask

[Chunk]

Thanks for the replies.  I am taking that I need to get some in town reccomendations on a fitter from some of my friends and go from there.  I went and hit a G25 7 iron today and liked it.  Alot.  How accurate are those simulators at golf galaxy BTW?

[clearwaterms]

Originally Posted by Chunk

Thanks for the replies.  I am taking that I need to get some in town reccomendations on a fitter from some of my friends and go from there.  I went and hit a G25 7 iron today and liked it.  Alot.  How accurate are those simulators at golf galaxy BTW?

It depends on which simulator.  Was it the one that you hit into the screen and the ball passes through two "laser fields" one immediatly in front of the matt and the other just prior to the screen?

Those in my experience are set to be firm conditions with above average altitude.  As a result, they tend to read higher than average numbers.

The other simulator is the one that the ball sits next too, Trackman and Foresight golf are the two that I have seen, those measure ball speed, spin and angle.  Those tend to be FAR more accurate.  They are still a simulator so you have to remember that like any simulator you have to make assumptions (wind, temp, altitude, etc.) but the ball flight tends to be pretty accurate.

The best fittings are always going to be done by an experienced golf club fitter off of grass at a range that uses regular flight golf balls.

Also, if you decide to go with Ping, do some research, Ping does demo days and you can usually schedule a fitting with the Ping rep.  This time of year (beginning of golf season) you should have no trouble finding a Ping demo day in your area.

Ping retailer / demo day locator.

http://www.ping.com/dealerlocator/default.aspx

[Chunk]

Originally Posted by clearwaterms

It depends on which simulator.  Was it the one that you hit into the screen and the ball passes through two "laser fields" one immediatly in front of the matt and the other just prior to the screen?

Those in my experience are set to be firm conditions with above average altitude.  As a result, they tend to read higher than average numbers.

The other simulator is the one that the ball sits next too, Trackman and Foresight golf are the two that I have seen, those measure ball speed, spin and angle.  Those tend to be FAR more accurate.  They are still a simulator so you have to remember that like any simulator you have to make assumptions (wind, temp, altitude, etc.) but the ball flight tends to be pretty accurate.

The best fittings are always going to be done by an experienced golf club fitter off of grass at a range that uses regular flight golf balls.

Also, if you decide to go with Ping, do some research, Ping does demo days and you can usually schedule a fitting with the Ping rep.  This time of year (beginning of golf season) you should have no trouble finding a Ping demo day in your area.

Ping retailer / demo day locator.

http://www.ping.com/dealerlocator/default.aspx

That demo day would be a great thing.  I will be sure to look into that.  Golfsmith used the one on the side.  Galaxy used the one you hit into.... That is the one I felt was off anyway.

[WUTiger]

On lessons: You're one of those baseball players who has successfully transferred his horsehide skills to golf. Lessons from a thoughtful pro - especially one who can videotape your swing and do slow-motion - can help you understand the finer points of your swing. And, don't forget about short game: a lesson on chipping and pitching can help you find your most reliable shot type.

Lessons and finding out your own basics should be quite helpful if you want to shoot in the 70s and compete regularly in amateur tournaments.

As for clubs, find someone you can work with and get a launch monitor fitting. A full fitting may cost $100 or so, but it will show  you which shaft/head combinations will work best for you and your swing. Sometimes if you buy new clubs, the fitting will be free.

If you get a full fitting, you can get a list of the best club and shaft combinations. And you don't have to buy everything at once. You might start out buying irons, and as money became available add a new driver, FWs, and wedges.

And as clearwater and tristan said, you will have to hunt around for a good fitter.  You will find excellent fitter and lousy fitters in both chain stores and custom club shops. You just have to find a good one.

[Chunk]

Originally Posted by WUTiger

On lessons: You're one of those baseball players who has successfully transferred his horsehide skills to golf. Lessons from a thoughtful pro - especially one who can videotape your swing and do slow-motion - can help you understand the finer points of your swing. And, don't forget about short game: a lesson on chipping and pitching can help you find your most reliable shot type.

Lessons and finding out your own basics should be quite helpful if you want to shoot in the 70s and compete regularly in amateur tournaments.

As for clubs, find someone you can work with and get a launch monitor fitting. A full fitting may cost $100 or so, but it will show  you which shaft/head combinations will work best for you and your swing. Sometimes if you buy new clubs, the fitting will be free.

If you get a full fitting, you can get a list of the best club and shaft combinations. And you don't have to buy everything at once. You might start out buying irons, and as money became available add a new driver, FWs, and wedges.

And as clearwater and tristan said, you will have to hunt around for a good fitter.  You will find excellent fitter and lousy fitters in both chain stores and custom club shops. You just have to find a good one.

Thanks for the input.  My strongest and most confident area of my game is my PW, 52*, 56*, and my putter.  Hands down.  I think I have a bead on a good fitter in town.  I never realized there is sooooo many combinations for shafts, grips, etc.....

What a game.

[antnee94]

Originally Posted by Chunk

Hey everyone.  New to the site.  Fairly new to the sport.

A little background: I got the bug last May and have not looked back since. I just turned 40 and I have no idea what took me so long. I love the game..... I think... haha. Really, I do... wait... yea... I'm pretty sure I like it most of the time. My first round last year was a 116.  I started breaking 100 after a month or so and started breaking 90 after 3 more months.  Best round was an 83 on a par 71 with a slope of 117.  Anyway, I bought some cheap clubs off of ebay Cleveland TA7's and a Cleveland Launcher DST 10.5*. All clubs have regular flex shafts.

First question: I am currently club shopping.  And it seems to me that the guys working at Golf Galaxy and Golfsmith just seem to push on me what they may or may not have alot of in stock... I dont know.  It just seems really impersonal and nonchallant.  Is this how it is?  Or should I try a mom and pop place?

Second question:  I hate how I can feel the clubs flexing when I swing.  I feel that my hands are way ahead of the club head at where impact should be.  Needless to say, I have grown some confidence with my swing and I swing hard but with my current clubs I get a lot of pushes and slices.  Would stiffer shafts really help?  AVG swing speed with driver is 98 MPH according to the Golfsmith machine.

Third question:  I have hit some of the new adjustable drivers.  Both of the people assisting me have been pushing some of the more adjustable (R1, 913, etc...) where I am kinda favoring the PING G25.  Mainly because its only slightly adjustable and I am worried that if I had a driver that could adjust in 168 different ways, I would start tinkering too much with the driver instead of my swing.  What have you guys found.  Are these super adjustable drivers good for a player or do they become swing crutches?

Forth question:  Shafts.  I want to get clubs and shafts that help me to get a higher ball launch/flight.  I hear this is a part of it.

Fifth question:  How helpful are lessons.  I am and always have been very good at sports.  Baseball was my best as I played in college and some years after.  I usually pick things up to where I am above average in a short time.  This little game of golf is the hardest thing I have ever played.  Hands down.

Thanks in advance for any input and thanks in advance for reading my book I just wrote.  I have been reading through this site for months and have finally joined due to the simple fact that I love the game and could talk about it for hours and there seems to be some decent players on here that I could learn a thing or 2 from.

Wow are these loaded questions:

1. Get fit for your clubs. Before you do hit everything at GG, Golfsmith, and Dick's in their simulators. Take notice of your swing speed, launch angles, and dispersion. When you narrow down the feel to 3 or so sets, make an appointment with a recommended fitter. It will be OK is it's at one of the chain stores as long as that person know's what they are talking about. At the point you seem to be in your game, I don't think you will be getting into exotic shafts like I do. My problem with the chain stores is they don't carry what I want and need. I refer to my clubs as my babies. So for me the club buying process is a several month trek. I just did that last year and the club fitter gave me a set I never tried after I told him I like the feel of three different sets. Sure enough I was in love with the clubs from swing #1. But I went to a reputable high end fitter.

2. The fitter will put you in the right shaft. But if you hate the feel, tell him that and he will work with you getting you the right one.

3. Driver is the funniest and pickiest club in my bag. Last year I bought a club that I hit a ton. All the numbers in the simulator were perfect. When I got it out on the course, it went a mile. But I was so far right with the club I never took to it. The old driver went back in my bag and I lost the 10-15 yards I gained, but I was in the fairway again. Bottom line is you might need an adjustable driver and the fitter can dial you in. My advice is keep it simple. You need the lessons and the best way to learn to hit properly will be with a neutral face to really correct any swing flaws. I use an adjustable driver because I'm trying to flight the ball a certain way more than anything.

4. See a fitter. They will dial you in.

5. Lessons are the best thing in the world. I'm an 11 Handicap and took about 12 lessons from my local pro last year as I'm trying to break into single digits and learn shot making skills. When I started I was like you. Shooting high 100s. Took lessons, started breaking 100. Skipped a season and played in the mid-upper 90s. Took more lessons to start breaking 90. Skipped a season of lessons. Now I'm at the point I want a consistent low 80/high 70s score. So I look more lessons. I corrected a slight swing flaw and started gaining yards and accuracy again. They also taught me a short game. Up until last year I was dead inside 85 yards. I learned how to pitch and flight balls from 50, 65, 85, and 100 yards out. Before I would lay up to full swings. Now I love these touch shots. The best part, I figured out how to hit them with multiple clubs from 9I, PW, 50, 55, 60 degree wedges. It opened up a whole new aspect. I'm a big lesson fan. I've learned an expensive lesson. It's the Indian, not the arrow. I tried to buy a game for a long time. I am finally set and ready to move to a single digit with time and practice....and lessons.

[Liko81]

Originally Posted by bjwestner

Regarding your questions.....I do not buy my clubs anymore from GG or Golfsmith.  I will try clubs out there to find out what I like, but then I will search online and buy the club that way.  It is usually much cheaper and there are lots of great deals to be found online and even on Ebay for brand new clubs.

While I can't say I haven't done the same, there is a reason the M&Ps; are going out of business, and that the big-box stores have stopped caring about having product experts on their store floor, and it's that people do exactly what you have just recommended. Best Buy, Golfsmith, Barnes & Noble, REI, BB&B;, they're all just de facto showrooms for Amazon.com. When you walk into a GS, take their floor staff's time, try their demo clubs in their computerized indoor range, decide on a club, then walk out and buy it on Amazon, you are helping to ensure that all those resources will not be there for you the next time you need a new club. It's an untenable situation for the store; Amazon isn't paying them any money for all the demoing the store does of the products that end up being bought online. One of two things will happen; you'll find yourself being charged in hour blocks to rent the range bay and charged upfront for fittings, or these services will go away and you'll be just as blind as to what works for you in the store as online.

Throw the store a bone. If you use their facilities to make your decision, buy the club from them. Even if you don't do that, you should make an effort to spend money regularly at that store, such as on consumables like balls/gloves/tees. If you don't, sooner or later you'll find yourself with no other recourse than the one or two manufacturer demo days per year at the driving range, or simple "buy-and-try", which for a $1000 iron set becomes untenable for *you* very quickly.

[antnee94]

Originally Posted by Liko81

While I can't say I haven't done the same, there is a reason the M&Ps; are going out of business, and that the big-box stores have stopped caring about having product experts on their store floor, and it's that people do exactly what you have just recommended. Best Buy, Golfsmith, Barnes & Noble, REI, BB&B;, they're all just de facto showrooms for Amazon.com. When you walk into a GS, take their floor staff's time, try their demo clubs in their computerized indoor range, decide on a club, then walk out and buy it on Amazon, you are helping to ensure that all those resources will not be there for you the next time you need a new club. It's an untenable situation for the store; Amazon isn't paying them any money for all the demoing the store does of the products that end up being bought online. One of two things will happen; you'll find yourself being charged in hour blocks to rent the range bay and charged upfront for fittings, or these services will go away and you'll be just as blind as to what works for you in the store as online.

Throw the store a bone. If you use their facilities to make your decision, buy the club from them. Even if you don't do that, you should make an effort to spend money regularly at that store, such as on consumables like balls/gloves/tees. If you don't, sooner or later you'll find yourself with no other recourse than the one or two manufacturer demo days per year at the driving range, or simple "buy-and-try", which for a $1000 iron set becomes untenable for *you* very quickly.

While you are right, it's the store's lack of choices for better players that annoys me. They never have the right shaft combo for me. I have to go to a high end fitter in order to test those shaft and head combos. But you are right, I do get my clubs re-gripped there and buy my tees, gloves, and small things there.

[Chunk]

Wow are these loaded questions: 1. Get fit for your clubs. Before you do hit everything at GG, Golfsmith, and Dick's in their simulators. Take notice of your swing speed, launch angles, and dispersion. When you narrow down the feel to 3 or so sets, make an appointment with a recommended fitter. It will be OK is it's at one of the chain stores as long as that person know's what they are talking about. At the point you seem to be in your game, I don't think you will be getting into exotic shafts like I do. My problem with the chain stores is they don't carry what I want and need. I refer to my clubs as my babies. So for me the club buying process is a several month trek. I just did that last year and the club fitter gave me a set I never tried after I told him I like the feel of three different sets. Sure enough I was in love with the clubs from swing #1. But I went to a reputable high end fitter. 2. The fitter will put you in the right shaft. But if you hate the feel, tell him that and he will work with you getting you the right one. 3. Driver is the funniest and pickiest club in my bag. Last year I bought a club that I hit a ton. All the numbers in the simulator were perfect. When I got it out on the course, it went a mile. But I was so far right with the club I never took to it. The old driver went back in my bag and I lost the 10-15 yards I gained, but I was in the fairway again. Bottom line is you might need an adjustable driver and the fitter can dial you in. My advice is keep it simple. You need the lessons and the best way to learn to hit properly will be with a neutral face to really correct any swing flaws. I use an adjustable driver because I'm trying to flight the ball a certain way more than anything. 4. See a fitter. They will dial you in. 5. Lessons are the best thing in the world. I'm an 11 Handicap and took about 12 lessons from my local pro last year as I'm trying to break into single digits and learn shot making skills. When I started I was like you. Shooting high 100s. Took lessons, started breaking 100. Skipped a season and played in the mid-upper 90s. Took more lessons to start breaking 90. Skipped a season of lessons. Now I'm at the point I want a consistent low 80/high 70s score. So I look more lessons. I corrected a slight swing flaw and started gaining yards and accuracy again. They also taught me a short game. Up until last year I was dead inside 85 yards. I learned how to pitch and flight balls from 50, 65, 85, and 100 yards out. Before I would lay up to full swings. Now I love these touch shots. The best part, I figured out how to hit them with multiple clubs from 9I, PW, 50, 55, 60 degree wedges. It opened up a whole new aspect. I'm a big lesson fan. I've learned an expensive lesson. It's the Indian, not the arrow. I tried to buy a game for a long time. I am finally set and ready to move to a single digit with time and practice....and lessons.

Man, thanks. I found a lot of similarities in your road. Mine may be a little more condensed (1 year) but running a popular bar certainly has its perks. Especially when the pros and Assitant pros from a very nice popular golf course frequent said bar. Played about 5 rounds total with them last year. And it has helped. I just didn't know if I should actually get formal lessons. That's my dilemma. I'm down to breaking 90 most of the time. At least that's how it ended last December. I've mostly been hitting wedges this winter. I want to break 80 a few times this year. It helps that one of my "golf buddies" is an assistant pro and a 6 handi and my other "golf buddie" is a 1 handi. So I think I'm going to just go with the same this year and see if I can break 80 without formal lessons. I've spoke to a fitter and hit some balls with DGX shafts and titleist AP1 710's that he had sitting around in his shop and loved them. Hit 6-9 iron and they were high, straight (maybe a slight draw, averaged 7 yards off center) and an entire club longer than my current. I know there's a lot that goes into it. I know those clubs are a few years old. But are those clubs deemed "dated" now with all the new technology out?

[antnee94]

Originally Posted by Chunk

Man, thanks. I found a lot of similarities in your road. Mine may be a little more condensed (1 year) but running a popular bar certainly has its perks. Especially when the pros and Assitant pros from a very nice popular golf course frequent said bar. Played about 5 rounds total with them last year. And it has helped. I just didn't know if I should actually get formal lessons. That's my dilemma. I'm down to breaking 90 most of the time. At least that's how it ended last December. I've mostly been hitting wedges this winter. I want to break 80 a few times this year. It helps that one of my "golf buddies" is an assistant pro and a 6 handi and my other "golf buddie" is a 1 handi. So I think I'm going to just go with the same this year and see if I can break 80 without formal lessons.

I've spoke to a fitter and hit some balls with DGX shafts and titleist AP1 710's that he had sitting around in his shop and loved them. Hit 6-9 iron and they were high, straight (maybe a slight draw, averaged 7 yards off center) and an entire club longer than my current.

I know there's a lot that goes into it. I know those clubs are a few years old. But are those clubs deemed "dated" now with all the new technology out?

No...The 710s are still awesome. You find the dated technology more in Drivers and woods now. Irons I think have a much longer shelf life. They are only up to 712. So you are one generation behind.

[bjwestner]

Originally Posted by Liko81

While I can't say I haven't done the same, there is a reason the M&Ps; are going out of business, and that the big-box stores have stopped caring about having product experts on their store floor, and it's that people do exactly what you have just recommended. Best Buy, Golfsmith, Barnes & Noble, REI, BB&B;, they're all just de facto showrooms for Amazon.com. When you walk into a GS, take their floor staff's time, try their demo clubs in their computerized indoor range, decide on a club, then walk out and buy it on Amazon, you are helping to ensure that all those resources will not be there for you the next time you need a new club. It's an untenable situation for the store; Amazon isn't paying them any money for all the demoing the store does of the products that end up being bought online. One of two things will happen; you'll find yourself being charged in hour blocks to rent the range bay and charged upfront for fittings, or these services will go away and you'll be just as blind as to what works for you in the store as online.

Throw the store a bone. If you use their facilities to make your decision, buy the club from them. Even if you don't do that, you should make an effort to spend money regularly at that store, such as on consumables like balls/gloves/tees. If you don't, sooner or later you'll find yourself with no other recourse than the one or two manufacturer demo days per year at the driving range, or simple "buy-and-try", which for a $1000 iron set becomes untenable for *you* very quickly.

I can assure you that GG has made their fair share of $ off me.  When I first started golfing last June, I blew quite a bit of cash there as this was before I realized that I could purchase clubs online.  I've also traded in many putters there that I am certain they have made a killing on when re-selling.

[Chunk]

Well, the road has ended.  I pulled the trigger on a Titleist AP1 710 iron set (4-G).  Nippon 105T Stiff shafts.  I went and got fitted and was told these lighter gram shafts will help me get the ball up in the air more.  And of all the irons I hit over the winter, these have been the most consistent.  They arrive Monday then its off to the range then to play 18.

Thanks for the input guys.

[AudiRob]

I have the TA7 black pearl irons and found them to be nice clubs when you are on point. They are not very forgiving on off center shots. If you have a consistent swing from the beginning of the rounf til the end, you will love these clubs. But if not you won't be happy. I never broke 82 with them, but that's me, not you. I started with some old Cleveland off set irons, then to the TA5 irons (wish I still had these), then the Cleveland gold irons( which I never had a chance to really break in because I was between jobs and short on cash) Now after playing with TA7's for last season, I looking at getting the Cleveland CG Black irons for the upcoming season. Let you you how they work for me.

[cincigolf]

Hey everyone.  New to the site.  Fairly new to the sport.  A little background: I got the bug last May and have not looked back since. I just turned 40 and I have no idea what took me so long. I love the game..... I think... haha. Really, I do... wait... yea... I'm pretty sure I like it most of the time. My first round last year was a 116.  I started breaking 100 after a month or so and started breaking 90 after 3 more months.  Best round was an 83 on a par 71 with a slope of 117.  Anyway, I bought some cheap clubs off of ebay Cleveland TA7's and a Cleveland Launcher DST 10.5*. All clubs have regular flex shafts. First question: I am currently club shopping.  And it seems to me that the guys working at Golf Galaxy and Golfsmith just seem to push on me what they may or may not have alot of in stock... I dont know.  It just seems really impersonal and nonchallant.  Is this how it is?  Or should I try a mom and pop place?  Second question:  I hate how I can feel the clubs flexing when I swing.  I feel that my hands are way ahead of the club head at where impact should be.  Needless to say, I have grown some confidence with my swing and I swing hard but with my current clubs I get a lot of pushes and slices.  Would stiffer shafts really help?  AVG swing speed with driver is 98 MPH according to the Golfsmith machine.  Third question:  I have hit some of the new adjustable drivers.  Both of the people assisting me have been pushing some of the more adjustable (R1, 913, etc...) where I am kinda favoring the PING G25.  Mainly because its only slightly adjustable and I am worried that if I had a driver that could adjust in 168 different ways, I would start tinkering too much with the driver instead of my swing.  What have you guys found.  Are these super adjustable drivers good for a player or do they become swing crutches? Forth question:  Shafts.  I want to get clubs and shafts that help me to get a higher ball launch/flight.  I hear this is a part of it.  Fifth question:  How helpful are lessons.  I am and always have been very good at sports.  Baseball was my best as I played in college and some years after.  I usually pick things up to where I am above average in a short time.  This little game of golf is the hardest thing I have ever played.  Hands down.  Thanks in advance for any input and thanks in advance for reading my book I just wrote.  I have been reading through this site for months and have finally joined due to the simple fact that I love the game and could talk about it for hours and there seems to be some decent players on here that I could learn a thing or 2 from.

well I can say there is not a thing wrong with the ta7 those are possibly the best set of irons Cleveland has ever produced. I think u need stiff shafts in them if they are whippy or sloppy. N u want your hands to be cocked and in front of the club at impact. Also look at your stance playing the ball closer to the back foot can cause u to push shots. Golf sales people suck. They push you to the masses. What's popular isn't always the best. AdjustBle drivers are nice but I do not believe a necessity people have been smacking the crap out of the ball forever without adjustable drivers. EBay would be a perfect place for you. I'd leave golf galxy along. Also you have cut a considerable amount of strokes in a short time so your doing something right. Strokes are lost on the range. You have to make yourselfa repetitive ball striker with ultimate reward. Hope ya get into the seventies.