Taylormade CEO says the sport has declined since Tiger Woods came into golf

[Harmonious]

I think people are confusing the growth of the game with the faces on the PGA Tour. There is much more to it than that. Some 10 year old kid loving Tiger Woods or Ricky Fowler doesn't necessarily mean he will immediately start playing golf if there is no affordable option available to him. Woods increased the exposure of golf to non-golfers (I know many folks who only watch golf when Woods is playing but have never set foot on a golf course), but may not have actually increased golf participation.

Golf is an expensive sport to get started in, if you include equipment, greens fees, lessons, etc. It's out of reach to millions of kids. That is the direct relation to the growth of the game, not whether Tiger Woods exists or not.

[muggs]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

Right muggs because no one ever cheated on their wife before Tiger.  Are you related to Elin?  She found herself another sugar daddy so maybe it's time you let it go.

LEMMING ALERT!!! LEMMING ALERT!!!!

I forgot to add, professionalism and class have also been in declined since Tiger's first F-bomb and club throw in front of the gallery. Newtogolf, how is it that Nike has controlled your thoughts for so long?

[Mr. Desmond]

Not to excuse Tiger, but did you ever see Tommy Bolt or hear Weiskopf? Plus Tiger is followed on every shot. If the camera would focus on other professional golfers, you would hear and see similar comments and actions as that of Tiger As to Mr. King and marketing, I think people over emphasize the marketing aspect taylor-made. They also make very good clubs. In some respects, there are on the cutting edge. In other aspects, they don't push the line.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by muggs

LEMMING ALERT!!! LEMMING ALERT!!!!

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a lemming, and saying that makes you look at least a little stupid.

[460CompMark]

if you actually think about it, the reason that golf has declined lately is because all the kids that grew up watching Tiger are settling down and having families.  i fall into this category, although i started playing in high school before he came onto the scene.  a lot of kids went out and started playing trying to become the next Tiger.  when that dream fell through after college, what do you think happened?  they stopped playing as much and settled down and had a family.  TV rating dropped when Tiger was going through his marital problems.  now that he is BACK, there is no way that the rating are as bad as 2009 and 2010.

[Spyder]

Originally Posted by muggs

LEMMING ALERT!!! LEMMING ALERT!!!!

I forgot to add, professionalism and class have also been in declined since Tiger's first F-bomb and club throw in front of the gallery. Newtogolf, how is it that Nike has controlled your thoughts for so long?

Since you're on your little stepladder, I'll entertain you. You mention that Tiger has influenced a decline in morals, integrity and class in golf. If you feel this way, I am left to believe that you are easily influenced by other people's actions/words - yet you are pointing the finger at others saying Nike is controlling their thoughts.

What Tiger Woods does on or off the course is in no way reducing the sportsmanship, class, etiquette, or integrity of golf as a sport. Does it impact his own image? Absolutely. Does it persuade viewers at home to mimic his actions and behavior when he throws a club or drops an FCC no-no? I would say no, because enough people do that on their own without needing to justify it as a "Hey, Tiger does it!" action.

I am not sure how you think Tiger has any impact on how the other players portray themselves on or off of the golf course in terms of behavior. I tend to give people more credit and think that they are not so easily influenced by other people's actions though.

So in short, who (or what ) is influencing you to be so anti-Tiger? Typically, people with radical and nonsensical views like what you're boasting are the types that are simply told "Hey, do this: _____" and you jump. The follower type.

On-topic

This is a ridiculous claim by King and I laughed at most of what was said. Think of all of the different platforms that Tiger has brought in attention to golf. Hell, I would put money on the fact that his video games alone give more exposure to the game of golf, especially to the 12-18 demographic, than any other entity alone.

[460CompMark]

Originally Posted by Spyder

Since you're on your little stepladder, I'll entertain you. You mention that Tiger has influenced a decline in morals, integrity and class in golf. If you feel this way, I am left to believe that you are easily influenced by other people's actions/words - yet you are pointing the finger at others saying Nike is controlling their thoughts.

What Tiger Woods does on or off the course is in no way reducing the sportsmanship, class, etiquette, or integrity of golf as a sport. Does it impact his own image? Absolutely. Does it persuade viewers at home to mimic his actions and behavior when he throws a club or drops an FCC no-no? I would say no, because enough people do that on their own without needing to justify it as a "Hey, Tiger does it!" action.

I am not sure how you think Tiger has any impact on how the other players portray themselves on or off of the golf course in terms of behavior. I tend to give people more credit and think that they are not so easily influenced by other people's actions though.

So in short, who (or what) is influencing you to be so anti-Tiger? Typically, people with radical and nonsensical views like what you're boasting are the types that are simply told "Hey, do this: _____" and you jump. The follower type.

On-topic

This is a ridiculous claim by King and I laughed at most of what was said. Think of all of the different platforms that Tiger has brought in attention to golf. Hell, I would put money on the fact that his video games alone give more exposure to the game of golf, especially to the 12-18 demographic, than any other entity alone.

well said.  also i will go as far as to say that most of the Tiger "haters" debate much like democrats.

[muggs]

Originally Posted by 460CompMark

well said.  also i will go as far as to say that most of the Tiger "haters" debate much like democrats.

I can't bring myself to root for a bad person. I find poor character very hard to stomach. I also cannot help but take issue with so many people choosing to support such a man. I get that he has built a strong following over the years and I find it a little sad that most people can't stand to have their image of him burst. So after the true colors were shown, people will still say things like "he's not the first person to cheat on his wife." Haha, how is that for rationale? If Tiger represents the type of person you can support, well then, I guess that is your choice.

But please know, it's okay, there are some very fine players on Tour. They don't get spoon-fed to us by the media as much, but they are out-playing Tiger and none of them have displayed the poor morals, ethics or edittquete your hero has.

And Iacas, everything about you makes you look at least a little egostistical.

[gnorris74]

I have to agree in saying that king made a rediculous comment saying tiger has influenced a decline in golf. In actuality the most common limiting factor of involvement is commitment to the game. Most people who decide to pick up the game often times their interest fizzles when they realize it take putting in a few days a week at the range before you even step on a course. So to say that tiger influences that negatively is just not true.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by muggs

I can't bring myself to root for a bad person. I find poor character very hard to stomach. I also cannot help but take issue with so many people choosing to support such a man. I get that he has built a strong following over the years and I find it a little sad that most people can't stand to have their image of him burst. So after the true colors were shown, people will still say things like "he's not the first person to cheat on his wife." Haha, how is that for rationale? If Tiger represents the type of person you can support, well then, I guess that is your choice.

But please know, it's okay, there are some very fine players on Tour. They don't get spoon-fed to us by the media as much, but they are out-playing Tiger and none of them have displayed the poor morals, ethics or edittquete your hero has.

And Iacas, everything about you makes you look at least a little egostistical.

Name One...............I'll wait

[muggs]

Adam Scott.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by muggs

Adam Scott.

Ohhhhhh so I missed all of Adam Scott's other major wins. That explains it.

[Mr. Desmond]

Originally Posted by 460CompMark

well said.  also i will go as far as to say that most of the Tiger "haters" debate much like democrats.

.... TM Haters debate much like right wing conservatives ... all fear and no facts.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by muggs

But please know, it's okay, there are some very fine players on Tour. They don't get spoon-fed to us by the media as much, but they are out-playing Tiger and none of them have displayed the poor morals, ethics or edittquete your hero has.

Yeah, there are hundreds of golfers out-playing Tiger Woods. Ooooookay dude.

Originally Posted by muggs

And Iacas, everything about you makes you look at least a little egostistical.

Being right all the time has that effect, I know...

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Any further political comments in this thread from anyone and they will be placed in the penalty box.

[460CompMark]

Originally Posted by muggs

I can't bring myself to root for a bad person. I find poor character very hard to stomach. I also cannot help but take issue with so many people choosing to support such a man. I get that he has built a strong following over the years and I find it a little sad that most people can't stand to have their image of him burst. So after the true colors were shown, people will still say things like "he's not the first person to cheat on his wife." Haha, how is that for rationale? If Tiger represents the type of person you can support, well then, I guess that is your choice.

But please know, it's okay, there are some very fine players on Tour. They don't get spoon-fed to us by the media as much, but they are out-playing Tiger and none of them have displayed the poor morals, ethics or edittquete your hero has.

And Iacas, everything about you makes you look at least a little egostistical.

so do you think Arnie or Jack never cheated on their wife?  i bet it is more common on tour than you think.  yeah it wasn't morally right, but he isn't the only one doing it in sports.  look around you.  i root for Tiger because he is the best in the world.  the stage has been set for history to be made in my lifetime in the game of golf.  i don't care what he does off the course, that's not my business.  i watch him for his impact and dominance in golf.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by 460CompMark

so do you think Arnie or Jack never cheated on their wife?  i bet it is more common on tour than you think.  yeah it wasn't morally right, but he isn't the only one doing it in sports.  look around you.  i root for Tiger because he is the best in the world.  the stage has been set for history to be made in my lifetime in the game of golf.  i don't care what he does off the course, that's not my business.  i watch him for his impact and dominance in golf

I totally agree with you here. I think Muggs is a little old to still be searching for Role Models.

[Spyder]

Originally Posted by muggs

I can't bring myself to root for a bad person. I find poor character very hard to stomach. I also cannot help but take issue with so many people choosing to support such a man. I get that he has built a strong following over the years and I find it a little sad that most people can't stand to have their image of him burst. So after the true colors were shown, people will still say things like "he's not the first person to cheat on his wife." Haha, how is that for rationale? If Tiger represents the type of person you can support, well then, I guess that is your choice.

But please know, it's okay, there are some very fine players on Tour. They don't get spoon-fed to us by the media as much, but they are out-playing Tiger and none of them have displayed the poor morals, ethics or edittquete your hero has.

And Iacas, everything about you makes you look at least a little egostistical.

The problem is that you seem to not be able to separate the sport/talent/job of the person from their personal lives. I don't care what Tiger does in his spare time, or who he does it with within reason . If he's a murderer or committing serious crimes, yes I would have a problem then. I honestly could care less about his marital status/issues or extracurricular tail that he opts to pull on the side.

When I was growing up, my father always told me that it was fine to root for a player, or a team, and to want to grow up and emulate them on the field/court/course. However, he also instilled the fact that these professionals are real people who make real mistakes and have real lives away from their profession as well. I guess that is why I easily stay neutral and don't change my opinion on these guys when they make themselves look more "human" by making mistakes that are made public by Star and People magazines.

Also, isn't it immoral to make a moral judgement on others as well? Thou shalt not.... damn what's the word. I know I heard this somewhere before....

Anyway, some of what King said in that article is completely insane to. Where he says:

Mark King (TaylorMade CEO): "Golf has been on a 16-year continual decline since Tiger came into golf," King said. "Now, has he had an impact on people watching TV because he's maybe the greatest athlete of our generation? Absolutely. But are those people running out, taking golf vacations, buying a home on a golf course, buying a new driver? No, they're not. So Tiger, play well, get people watching TV, sell more spots, but it's not helping us."

Um, yes people are buying a new driver because of Tiger woods and the Nike marketing machine. I have seen more new Nike Covert clubs so far this year than the new RocketBallz-ier (Stage 2) equipment. To say that nobody is going out and buying clubs because Tiger is using them is really dumb to be blunt. As far as buying a home on a course or going on a golf vacation, which golfer on the planet would be able to persuade someone to do that? Again, completely irrelevant and baseless comments. I just can't take this guy seriously.

[460CompMark]

King is just trying to be relevant.  He notices Tiger's rise to dominance again and has to create drama to get people to notice TM.  News flash dumbazz, it's going to negatively affect your product.