• Announcements

    • iacas

      Create a Signature!   02/05/2016

      Everyone, go here and edit your signature this week: http://thesandtrap.com/settings/signature/.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
JonMA1

Is overconfidence ever an issue?

0   19 votes

  1. 1. Can overconfidence be detrimental to your game?

    • Yes
      11
    • No
      8

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

35 posts in this topic

Much has been written about the need to be confident on the golf course. While I understand how much damage any doubt can have on a shot, a balance of reasonable confidence and realistic expectations seem to work best for me.
I wonder if the reason good play is often followed by bad isn't due to overconfidence.
For example, I make a controlled swing with the driver, landing in the center of the fairway only to follow it up with a bad iron shot - seems to happen a lot. Or I might start a round off with with a couple of pars or bogeys (bogeys being good for me) with all my clubs feeling pretty good. Then things go south. I know that as my confidence grows, I start to swing harder which can lead to bad results.
It seems like my good rounds in 2013 were accompanied by controlled emotion - not getting too excited about the good shots or holes and not too P.O.'d about the bad ones. Not sure if the good play is the cause for the easy going attitude or the other way around.
I guess a better question would be how do you control your confidence level going into a round and during the round?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Want to get rid of this advertisement? Sign up (or log in) today! It's free!

Over confident isn't a problem for me. I find that emotions are the culprit 99.99% of the time. For example, I hit a great drive on a par 4, walking to my ball, I'm usually over excited, when I get ready to hit my 2nd shot, that excitement causes me to lose my Focus, i.e. I swing to hard, not mindful of my posture, ect, so I hit a crummy approach shot. Then I get angry, and loose all hope of making a decent score. I have never walked to a shot, thinking..I've got this.

As of late, I have curbed my emotions. Now bad shots are a result of poor technique, but I'm working on that.. :-D

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

For me if I start out hitting good shots it seems to snowball and I end up having a good round. Last season only choked away 1 round and I think it was due to fatigue.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Overconfidence - fine if a person can back it up .... More often I see (and suffer from) delusions of grandeur syndrome - try to pull off shots I am not consistently capable of
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More often I see (and suffer from) delusions of grandeur syndrome - try to pull off shots I am not consistently capable of

Funny. Glad I'm not the only one who suffers from this. Not so much on trying an impossible shot (I may have learned that lesson). For me, my expectations run high as a result of a good practice session where I think "I got this down. Scores in the 80's... club championships... here I come!". Delusions of grandeur.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess "over confidence" is a matter of both perspective and thus perception. I said it can be a problem because I equate it with questionable decisions like hitting a poor drive and trying to make up for it by carrying the too far out water hazard with a slammed three wood off a tight lie. That said, making smart decisions about the next shoot and then committing to them completely is a very good thing, IMO.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I voted, yes.

The reason why overconfidence can kill your game is that you expect too much of your current skills. This leads to frustration, and this kills your decision making.

Humility is the best way to play better. I can trace down every double bogey and blowup hole to overconfidence, whether it is conscious or sub-conscious.

I would even go so far as to say that if I play like I don't care how I do, I play better. Once I start getting pars, and I "expect" to get them is where I start to mishit much worse.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I can't think of a time when overconfidence hurt my game but I can think of plenty when a lack of confidence hurt my game. Of course both situations are mostly self-fufilling because if I'm hitting the ball well I'm going to be more confident and if I'm hitting the ball like crap I'm going to be less confident. I've blown plenty of shots that I shouldn't have even tried but that falls more under stupidity than overconfidence.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't think of a time when overconfidence hurt my game but I can think of plenty when a lack of confidence hurt my game.

Of course both situations are mostly self-fufilling because if I'm hitting the ball well I'm going to be more confident and if I'm hitting the ball like crap I'm going to be less confident.

I've blown plenty of shots that I shouldn't have even tried but that falls more under stupidity than overconfidence.

My thoughts also, especially the Stupidity part..lol

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I can't think of a time when overconfidence hurt my game but I can think of plenty when a lack of confidence hurt my game.

Of course both situations are mostly self-fufilling because if I'm hitting the ball well I'm going to be more confident and if I'm hitting the ball like crap I'm going to be less confident.

I've blown plenty of shots that I shouldn't have even tried but that falls more under stupidity than overconfidence.


I don't think any bad shot is a result of stupidity. If you expect to make a shot because it looked easy, I consider that overconfidence.

For example, if you are 70 yards from the pin and it is roughly a 50 degree wedge with a nice easy 3/4 swing with very little wrist break.

Do you take 4 or 5 practice swings before executing it? If you are overconfident, then most likely not. You expect to make it pretty easily.

If, on the other hand you take the approach that this is a tough shot you might rehearse it in your mind a few times and do 4 or 5 practice swings to gauge the distance mentally. You don't expect to make it, but you are building the confidence in your body to do it because you are not overconfident that you will make it.

If you are saying that it was stupid not to have rehearsed it and get your body in the groove for the shot, then I call the cause overconfidence.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Over confident isn't a problem for me. ...

For those of us who seldom break 90, overconfidence is not a problem.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Much has been written about the need to be confident on the golf course. While I understand how much damage any doubt can have on a shot, a balance of reasonable confidence and realistic expectations seem to work best for me.

I wonder if the reason good play is often followed by bad isn't due to overconfidence.

For example, I make a controlled swing with the driver, landing in the center of the fairway only to follow it up with a bad iron shot - seems to happen a lot. Or I might start a round off with with a couple of pars or bogeys (bogeys being good for me) with all my clubs feeling pretty good. Then things go south. I know that as my confidence grows, I start to swing harder which can lead to bad results.

It seems like my good rounds in 2013 were accompanied by controlled emotion - not getting too excited about the good shots or holes and not too P.O.'d about the bad ones. Not sure if the good play is the cause for the easy going attitude or the other way around.

I guess a better question would be how do you control your confidence level going into a round and during the round?

Um sorry to say this but what your suffering from isn't over confidence, its just an inconsistent swing. Over confidence might be trying a shot you are not able to pull off. The shot to shot struggling isn't over confidence.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

No. My stupid shots were usually the ones that left me saying something like, "Damn. I thought I could hit that low 60 yard hook around those two trees, under that first limb and over the second, and then carry that 200 yards of lake beyond the trees." Confident or not confident, stupid either way.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

I don't think any bad shot is a result of stupidity. If you expect to make a shot because it looked easy, I consider that overconfidence.

For example, if you are 70 yards from the pin and it is roughly a 50 degree wedge with a nice easy 3/4 swing with very little wrist break.

Do you take 4 or 5 practice swings before executing it? If you are overconfident, then most likely not. You expect to make it pretty easily.

If, on the other hand you take the approach that this is a tough shot you might rehearse it in your mind a few times and do 4 or 5 practice swings to gauge the distance mentally. You don't expect to make it, but you are building the confidence in your body to do it because you are not overconfident that you will make it.

If you are saying that it was stupid not to have rehearsed it and get your body in the groove for the shot, then I call the cause overconfidence.

No. My stupid shots were usually the ones that left me saying something like, "Damn. I thought I could hit that low 60 yard hook around those two trees, under that first limb and over the second, and then carry that 200 yards of lake beyond the trees."

Confident or not confident, stupid either way.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Um sorry to say this but what your suffering from isn't over confidence, its just an inconsistent swing. Over confidence might be trying a shot you are not able to pull off. The shot to shot struggling isn't over confidence.

No need to say you're sorry Matt. It would be far worse if you didn't offer an opinion.

While you are 100% correct in your assessment of my inconsistent swing, over confidence can effect my concentration or allow me to swing too hard. In the example I gave, part of the reason a previous shot was successful may have been due to swinging within my capabilities and remembering to keep everything under control. If I become over confident, I tend to swing a bit too freely or with a bit too much power. It's just the way my brain works - or rather doesn't.

I don't have the experience to argue this point, but I would suggest that even if I had a mechanically sound swing, I would still need to forget the previous shot or hole - be it the best ever or worst ever.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

Originally Posted by saevel25

Um sorry to say this but what your suffering from isn't over confidence, its just an inconsistent swing. Over confidence might be trying a shot you are not able to pull off. The shot to shot struggling isn't over confidence.

No need to say you're sorry Matt. It would be far worse if you didn't offer an opinion.

While you are 100% correct in your assessment of my inconsistent swing, over confidence can effect my concentration or allow me to swing too hard. In the example I gave, part of the reason a previous shot was successful may have been due to swinging within my capabilities and remembering to keep everything under control. If I become over confident, I tend to swing a bit too freely or with a bit too much power. It's just the way my brain works - or rather doesn't.

I don't have the experience to argue this point, but I would suggest that even if I had a mechanically sound swing, I would still need to forget the previous shot or hole - be it the best ever or worst ever.

I would tend to agree with Matt here. This is a case where if you develop a decent swing, the distances will not vary that much with any given club. You can then depend upon a specific club to give you a specific distance range. Once you have even a little bit of consistency, you will select the proper club and not swing any differently to get the desired distance.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I would tend to agree with Matt here. This is a case where if you develop a decent swing, the distances will not vary that much with any given club. You can then depend upon a specific club to give you a specific distance range. Once you have even a little bit of consistency, you will select the proper club and not swing any differently to get the desired distance.

Oddly enough, my club distances are the least of my problems. With the exception of hitting the ball fat, my distances are consistent. But I think I get your point. I should be happy with those distances and not try to swing any harder from shot to shot.

As I've said on more than one occasion, you guys are far more knowledgeable and experienced than I am. Whether I agree or disagree with a certain point, I have to respect your opinions and trust you know what you're talking about. Too much disagreement and I just come off as being that f$^&ing; guy.

I will only add that on my way to the golf course, I have to be cautiously optimistic on how I will perform. Overconfidence or false confidence based on my last round, last practice session or last shot has thus far proven to be a sure recipe for disaster. Hopefully you guys are correct and that's been purely coincidental. :beer:

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

I would tend to agree with Matt here. This is a case where if you develop a decent swing, the distances will not vary that much with any given club. You can then depend upon a specific club to give you a specific distance range. Once you have even a little bit of consistency, you will select the proper club and not swing any differently to get the desired distance.

Oddly enough, my club distances are the least of my problems. With the exception of hitting the ball fat, my distances are consistent. But I think I get your point. I should be happy with those distances and not try to swing any harder from shot to shot.

As I've said on more than one occasion, you guys are far more knowledgeable and experienced than I am. Whether I agree or disagree with a certain point, I have to respect your opinions and trust you know what you're talking about. Too much disagreement and I just come off as being that f$^&ing; guy.

I will only add that on my way to the golf course, I have to be cautiously optimistic on how I will perform. Overconfidence or false confidence based on my last round, last practice session or last shot has thus far proven to be a sure recipe for disaster. Hopefully you guys are correct and that's been purely coincidental.

Yes. I wish I hit my 7 iron 190 yards, but I don't.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0



  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • 2016 TST Partners

    GAME Golf
    PING Golf
    Lowest Score Wins
  • Posts

    • My Swing (coop6)
      It pretty much is, I'm not going to debate 5 degrees with you. As I've said repeatedly, Tiger's swing and a standard swing do not require rotation. On this shot he rotated 5 degrees, not much. If you want to play with rotation to closed enjoy. I prefer to keep the club square. 
    • Struggles of turning pro
      http://thesandtrap.com/blogs/ Normally you must be an Established Member to create a blog, but I've enabled this for you now.
    • No Forearm Rotation - Biggest Swing Flaw?
      Completely bogus. The arms (forearms) rotate in every good golf swing. Here's an old thread that's appropriate for this discussion.   Also, I don't think I've ever really seen a golfer, throughout his backswing, rotate his forearms the opposite way. For short periods of time, maybe a few golfers "counter-rotate," but all end up rotating some. No, there won't be "arguments" over this, or there shouldn't be, because… like many things, this is pretty much a fact. There really doesn't need to be an argument or a discussion. It's a knowable, understandable thing. Hunter, like every other PGA Tour pro, rotates his forearms during the backswing. You're rotating your arms as you do this. It's subtle, but if you just pick the club up straight without rotating, you'll have the shaft resting against the top of your head. Look at where the back of your left hand points. Toward the target at setup, and then rotated to put the club on your right shoulder. Turn to the top when the club is on your face or the top of your head and the club will be leaning out over the target line (it'll be roughly parallel to your bend toward the ball, since it's basically just staying inline with your spine). Bending your right arm rotates your forearms. It pulls everything to the right (you can't bend your right arm straight in front of you without also bending your left arm). Then even more rotation is added after that. I agree that you don't want to be doing a lot of "things" on the downswing, but that's not how physics works. You can do all sorts of things on the backswing and not do them on the downswing. We have students who swing steep to steep, steep to shallow, shallow to steep, shallow to shallow, and all sorts of things. We have students who address the ball with a closed clubface, roll it way open, and then return it wide open, etc. The "equal and opposite" does not mean a delayed reaction - it means that if I push on something it will, right at that very moment, push back. If I fire rocket propulsion downward, the missile or space shuttle or whatever will move upward. You don't fire rockets and then, a week later, a different missile takes off as a "reaction." Furthermore, PGA Tour players have a variety of backswings. Ray Floyd was underneath, Rickie Fowler or Ryan Moore are steep or over the top on the backswing. The golfer who comes closest to the "square" or "no rotation" backswing is a guy who CAN'T really rotate his forearms: Tim Clark. And even Tim rotates some. But notice how far "out over his head" the clubhead is, despite the fact that he's well short of parallel on the backswing. It's so much more than that. I ask people in my lessons how much skill or raw natural talent it takes to set up properly. The correct answer: none. They just have to know how to do it. If golf was as simple as "set up properly and then turn" we'd all be a whole lot better than we are. Golfers can be set up the same and make very, very different backswings, and both can be successful. So Bubba is doing it wrong? And what does that have to do with the swing flaw of "rotating your forearms"? (Is overswinging a big problem? Absolutely. More, IMO, for what it tends to do to the trail elbow and the subsequent inability of the player to get the arms and hands down fast enough. I'll never really argue against overswinging, except when it's made as a blanket statement covering all golfers who go past parallel or something.) Also, you said (though it feels off topic since this is mostly about forearm rotation, n'est-ce pas?) "the more you have to wait for them to come down." That's not really true - you can MAKE them come down faster. Your arms aren't just limp things hanging from your shoulders that get dragged behind your hips and torso rotating. Because, biomechanically, making a swing with no forearm rotation would be ridiculous and resemble the golf swings of precisely no good players, ever. Tim Clark comes closest, and people don't even copy his swing, and if Tim Clark's forearms would rotate as most people's do, even Tim Clark would have a different golf swing. Modeling your golf swing on someone with a disability hardly seems like the prudent choice. My last piece of evidence, right here: This should drive the point home pretty significantly. Spoiler One last thing here. Consider the sagittal plane (in the spoiler above, just so it's not taking up a ton of space) and the back of the left hand (assuming a right-handed golfer). At address, they're parallel - the back of the left hand is parallel to the sagittal plane. Yet at the top of the backswing, what do we see? The sagittal plane (at the point of attachment of the arms, i.e. near the shoulders) is about 90° from where it started. It's inclined at about 35° or so, but otherwise just is still just a plane bisecting the sternum, neck, face, etc. What plane is the back of the left wrist on? Why, it's one that's about 90° to the sagittal plane. I've illustrated this here: In this illustration, I've drawn a little "cube" in the screen on the left. The green face of the cube is parallel to the sagittal plane (the edge of the plane is pointing "at the camera"). The blue side - perpendicular to the green side - is parallel to the back of the left hand. It too is pointing at the camera, but has rotated about 90°. That's why it's parallel to a perpendicular side of the cube. On the right, above, to make the back of Mike's left hand parallel the green face of the cube, he'd have to rotate his arms BACK about 90° to the red line. Now, then, @Golfer2223, you'd set a record as the first human being in history to present an argument as you have done and immediately recognize, given my response and a little thought on your part, that you want to take back your entire argument and completely change your position. In other words, I don't expect that to happen. A small part of me hopes it will some day, but I don't think today is going to be that day. But, realistically, that's what should happen. As I see it, you have no real ground to stand on here. Not biomechanically, not based on simple geometry, nothing. The arms rotate during the backswing in EVERY good player. Even in Tim Clark's backswing (or he'd truly have the club hanging out over his head. I will also say this, @Golfer2223: I appreciate your willingness to help, and to jump in, and to offer your thoughts on things. I hope you can take this rebuttal in the spirit in which it's intended - to help and to discuss. I don't know who you are (you should add more info to your profile), and I'm not responding just to be mean, but to help people learn, think critically, and better understand the golf swing. We encourage debate and discussion here, and that's all my response is to be taken as - more debate and discussion. Do I think I'm right? Yes. And I think I've backed up why. P.S. As someone noted above, often students need to feel like there's no rotation in the backswing. But that doesn't make it accurate.
    • Northern Michigan Courses
      I have been to Northern Michigan on several occasions. There are a lot of great golf courses but they are SPREAD OUT so keep driving distance in mind.   Arcadia Bluffs Forest Dunes True North Little Traverse Bay Belvedere Dunmaglas Black Lake Grand Traverse Resort (Nicklaus and Player Course) Lochenheath  Leelanau Boyne Hills Course   These are all EXCELLENT golf courses that are worth playing
    • Crandon/Key Biscayne or Biltmore
      Wow, tough choice! Key Biscayne or Crandon. Either one would be awesome.
  • TST Blog Entries

  • Images

  • Today's Birthdays

  • Blog Entries