• Announcements

    • iacas

      Create a Signature!   02/05/2016

      Everyone, go here and edit your signature this week: http://thesandtrap.com/settings/signature/.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Rulesman

R&A / USGA DMS for amateurs

19 posts in this topic

http://www.randa.org/en/RandA/News/News/2014/January/THE-R-and-A-ALLOWS-DISTANCE-MEASURING-DEVICES-IN-ITS-AMATEUR-EVENTS-IN-2014.aspx http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-tours-news/blogs/local-knowledge/2014/01/usga-still-deciding-on-allowing-distance-measuring-devices-f.html
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Want to get rid of this advertisement? Sign up (or log in) today! It's free!

It's about time. Next step is getting them in the hands of professionals. I would like to see the tours issue GPS devices. It is silly that anyone with a couple hundred dollars to spare can have more accurate yardage info while playing than the guys playing for millions of dollars.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's about time. Next step is getting them in the hands of professionals. I would like to see the tours issue GPS devices. It is silly that anyone with a couple hundred dollars to spare can have more accurate yardage info while playing than the guys playing for millions of dollars.

Really?  You think that they don't have information as accurate as you do?  Their yardage books are more accurate than your laser, because they are made using the slope version, usually the Bushnell 1600 or what ever the most current model is.  They measure anything and everything that could possibly be pertinent.  That data is all compiled on Monday or Tuesday of the tournament week, partly by the caddies and partly by the players.

By the rules you are not allowed to use any DMD which measures slope during a competition or handicap round, so the detailed yardage book that they compile puts them one up on you.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During the rounds players and caddies still have to do calculations by hand from yardages paced off from markers.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During the rounds players and caddies still have to do calculations by hand from yardages paced off from markers.

There is a lot less pacing that you might think.  I worked a PGA Tour event for 4 years and watched them in the practice rounds as well as in the competition play.  They have so many course features marked that they rarely have to pace more than 10 yards.  The don't really calculate because all of the numbers are in the book.  If it's 157 yards from the front edge of the bunker to the middle of the green, and the hole is cut 5 yards in, they pace off 7 yards from bunker to ball, then it isn't exactly higher math to come up with a 145 yard shot.  That can be done in about the same amount of time that it takes to get the laser out of its case, take a reading, then take it again to be sure you got it right.

I don't have any issue with it they do decide to allow it, but it won't really change how they play, nor will it make them any faster.  The odds are that they will still have the book and double check it against the laser.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I started in the game there was typically a bush or pine tree planted at the 150 yard position.  It was on the players to familiarize themselves with the course and learn what club to hit from certain positions.  Of course, if one played numerous public courses it was more difficult to dial in the distances but that was just the way it was.

I own a GPS but at times I wonder if we haven't lost something from the game in the ability to judge distances.  Any fool can look at a GPS or laser a flag.  There is some talent in having the "feel" for distances just from eye-balling the target.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

There is a lot less pacing that you might think.  I worked a PGA Tour event for 4 years and watched them in the practice rounds as well as in the competition play.  They have so many course features marked that they rarely have to pace more than 10 yards.  The don't really calculate because all of the numbers are in the book.  If it's 157 yards from the front edge of the bunker to the middle of the green, and the hole is cut 5 yards in, they pace off 7 yards from bunker to ball, then it isn't exactly higher math to come up with a 145 yard shot.  That can be done in about the same amount of time that it takes to get the laser out of its case, take a reading, then take it again to be sure you got it right.

Not to mention that with a laser you only get the distance between your ball and the pin. From the notes pros get to know how much green there is between the pin and the closest hazards. And that data is always accurate, unlike the one provided by GPS devices such as GolfBuddy or Garmin G-series.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not to mention that with a laser you only get the distance between your ball and the pin. From the notes pros get to know how much green there is between the pin and the closest hazards. And that data is always accurate, unlike the one provided by GPS devices such as GolfBuddy or Garmin G-series.


I thought anything could be shot for distance with the laser devices? Edge of bunker, base of tree, ball in fairway, leg of someone in the group in front of you, at least it seems that way when I play with the lasers inside the golf store (distance to manikins, bags, signs, displays, racks, all seem to work). Maybe it is different on the course.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Ignorant was saying that you can only get a distance from where you are standing to an object, not the distance between two objects that are not adjacent to you (eg the distance between the flagstick and a greenside bunker to one side).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, okay, thanks for the clarification.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Not to mention that with a laser you only get the distance between your ball and the pin. From the notes pros get to know how much green there is between the pin and the closest hazards. And that data is always accurate, unlike the one provided by GPS devices such as GolfBuddy or Garmin G-series.

I thought anything could be shot for distance with the laser devices? Edge of bunker, base of tree, ball in fairway, leg of someone in the group in front of you, at least it seems that way when I play with the lasers inside the golf store (distance to manikins, bags, signs, displays, racks, all seem to work). Maybe it is different on the course.

You can also only shoot a consistent measurement to something with a decent surface to bounce the beam off of.  The more indistinct or sloped the surface is the less accurate or decisive the measurement will be.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When people are talking about the tour guys going this way I do think there's a fairly big difference between R&A; amateur events and Pro tournaments - in R&A; amateur events they don't always have a caddy and they don't always play practice rounds. Although I think it's a great idea for the amateur guys, I think the caddies do a great job of telling their players what the yardages are. The rule in golf that states that you can only get advice from your caddy is an important one - at the pro level it means it becomes (to an extent) a team effort. There are good caddies and possibly not so good ones and great partnerships have grown out of great players teamed with great caddies. Anything that takes any of the skill involved with differentiating one of the best caddies from the rest isn't really a step forward in my view. As an aside, I heard of a caddy once, on assessing his players state coming down the stretch (he was catching the leader and was hyped) deliberately giving slightly shorter yardages than the truth, knowing his guy always flew the ball that extra few yards with the adrenalin pumping. True or not? No idea but technology doesn't always trump decent common sense.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

You can also only shoot a consistent measurement to something with a decent surface to bounce the beam off of.  The more indistinct or sloped the surface is the less accurate or decisive the measurement will be.

Interesting. If and whenever I decide to buy a laser I'm going to have to take it outside the store and field test it a bit.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now we have this to contend with.

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/into-sports/golfing/approach-g8/prod144530.html

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Ignorant was saying that you can only get a distance from where you are standing to an object, not the distance between two objects that are not adjacent to you (eg the distance between the flagstick and a greenside bunker to one side).

That is what I meant. But also that it is not necessarily possible to get a reading from an edge of a bunker if it is not well visible to you. All hazards with their exact locations are in the notes which alwasy gives you a better starting point, and of course faster.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I must confess, I struggle to see what that device does that is truly useful over and above the Golfshot app I have on my phone costing £20 ($33) over here. I use it when I don't know a course as it's quicker than a course planner and pacing out for social play. Other than try to tell you what club to hit, which frankly I'd find as annoying as the trend in modern cars when it tells you what gear you 'should' be in, it basically does pretty much the same as the app. In fact the extra 'features' such as telling you which club to hit, including taking into consideration uphill or downhill to the flag, would not only irritate me (half the fun of plotting your way round the course and course management is working these things out for yourself), it may even be counter productive, especially to a beginner. Is that an 8 iron bearing in mind it's a cold day? Pretty sheltered spot, but is it still an 8 with that breeze I felt walking up to the tee? It's downhill so it's saying 8 not 7, but that means the very slight breeze into me will have more of an effect as I'll hit it higher, so it'll need some extra club - in fact a knock down 7 is the club from up here. Course management, pitting yourself against the course and out thinking it is part of the fun, especially as you progress and on tougher courses. Walk up to ball, look at gadget, pull club it tells me to pull doesn't sound that appealing if I'm honest.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

PlaysLike Distance

Despite its slim profile, the Approach G8 debuts a substantial range of features to help you take on any course. PlaysLike Distance gives golfers distances to the target, adjusted for uphill or downhill shots.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PlaysLike Distance

Despite its slim profile, the Approach G8 debuts a substantial range of features to help you take on any course. PlaysLike Distance gives golfers distances to the target, adjusted for uphill or downhill shots.

I know mate, and that's my point - the adjudtment for downhill, for example, is subject to ourside conditions. A '1 club wind' (ie requires an extra club into it than the yardage in still air) may well be a '2 club wind' downhill if your shooting right into it. So say it would normally be an 8 iron, the gizmo may 'correct' it to a 9 for downhill, and you may think "take an extra club so it's back to an 8." But a wind into an exposed steep slope pushes it a tad higher so the wind the gizmo doesn't know about has more of an effect than on the flat. And what about correcting for temperature? Basically it's doing half the calculation, disregarding factors that may effect it. I'd trust myself more than I'd trust it which would just make its selection irritating.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0



  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • 2016 TST Partners

    GAME Golf
    PING Golf
    Lowest Score Wins
  • Posts

    • 1 Iron Golf Clubs
      So...finally broke 90 the other day....would have been better but for cored and sanded greens. Never struck the ball so well. Have been trialing the "Bobby Clampett" Impact Zone training, and focusing on a point forward of the ball...working a treat so far and my irons are way more solid. Time will tell whether it is a flash in the pan or a good move, but the range session are very encouraging. Played since xmas at all?
    • Donald Trump for president?
      Notice this comment ;)  Yea but he's been doing that since he's been in office. At least he hasn't wavered away from his agenda for how ever long he's been in office. He's not going to pass it. He's going to try.  Trump doesn't have an agenda except to his own ego. He doesn't care about America. He doesn't care about the American people. He's uses to screwing as many people over as possible. Heck, why not add Washington to the list.  For me I think Trump just sat back and thought, "you know what I can win the presidency." Then he's going about doing it. It's all about vanity nothing else.   
    • How Do You Decide Where to Play Golf
      This is a more difficult question for me to answer than it once was, so I selected "Other".   If I play locally, then I only have a couple of choices.  But this year I rejoined the Men's Club at my old home course, so that has now become my current home course even though it's a 2½ hour drive (about 150 miles).  I also play several other courses just as I feel like it, no one course by price because I can get varying deals at 30 or 40 Colorado courses with my Avid Golfer Passport.   A lot depends on how far I feel like driving, it may depend on when my brother drives down from Idaho to play for a few days, and it just depends on what I feel like.
    • Donald Trump for president?
      Isn't Bernie doing the same thing?  He's leading a witch hunt against big business and the wealthy.  Do you really believe he's going to pass a 90% income tax on the wealthy, outlaw guns, provide better free healthcare, increase the minimum wage to $15+ country wide and provide free college to everyone? They are both snake oil sales people appealing to the lowest common denominators of their parties.  Bernie may be more sincere about his beliefs, but that could just mean he's crazier too.
    • Jack or Tiger: Who's the Greatest Golfer?
      But that stat goes directly to Tiger's lack of longevity (to this point in time).  If he hadn't had the issues that he's had, he wouldn't have missed all of those recent starts.  I don't see how you can diss Jack for being competitive over a longer period, and then still making many starts (which attracted more money to the events just by his presence) after his competitive career was past.  I don't know what the numbers work out to age for age to the point when Tiger was no longer starting in Majors, but that has to be a more telling number.
  • TST Blog Entries

  • Images

  • Today's Birthdays

    1. glinks
      glinks
      (43 years old)
  • Blog Entries