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Determining Out of Bounds


scerpico22
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Cost?? What can a handful of 1"X1" wooden stakes that are 2' in length cost? I'm gonna guess $1 a piece.

So, what other reason then would you give to excuse the course?

That is the excuse every golf course I have ever seen that was not properly marked comes up with when you question them.  "We just can't add all the OB markers we need because of cost".  Just like, "Well, we would paint the inside of the cup above the liner but it "cost" money."

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So, what other reason then would you give to excuse the course?

I don't know. I think it boils down to laziness. Maybe a stake or 2 were damaged or lost and never put back in place. I just can't see "cost" being the reason for white stakes not being there. The cost of stakes is almost nothing at all. It's $1 for an 8' length. You can get 4 of them out of it. After a can of white paint, they cost you .50 cents each.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Rulesman

The OB margin is straight line between the course side edges of the stakes. See the Definition.

The reason white lines are not widely used is cost. In particular man hours. They wash or grow out frequently.

I understand that rule. A lot of times I'll just play what the course looks like. So if a white stake is missing, I'll go by intent. If OB is marked by White stakes along a tree line and there is a segment that curves. You know the OB is the tree, brush area. It's obvious. To me it's pretty stupid to penalize a golfer for laziness of the course. Especially when the ball is clearly playable on the course.

You can make that assumption if you want, but you are in the wrong if you do.  I've played lots of trees and brush which are in bounds and in play.  I couldn't just assume a stake was missing without evidence to that effect, and I don't know how you prove something is supposed to be there if it isn't.

Rick

"He who has the fastest cart will never have a bad lie."

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I don't know. I think it boils down to laziness. Maybe a stake or 2 were damaged or lost and never put back in place. I just can't see "cost" being the reason for white stakes not being there. The cost of stakes is almost nothing at all.

It's $1 for an 8' length. You can get 4 of them out of it. After a can of white paint, they cost you .50 cents each.

I don't own or run the course(s), I just play there.  You can sell me on the cost all day long.  If you can't sell the courses, and they are everywhere I travel, you are not going to rectify the issue and the #1 excuse is COST.  As a matter of fact, Myrtle Beach is full of courses poorly marked.

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Check out littlejohngolfleague.com  A Greater Houston TX traveling golf league.

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I don't own or run the course(s), I just play there.  You can sell me on the cost all day long.  If you can't sell the courses, and they are everywhere I travel, you are not going to rectify the issue and the #1 excuse is COST.  As a matter of fact, Myrtle Beach is full of courses poorly marked.

I'm just finding it odd that COST can be a major reason why courses are poorly marked, when it costs just pennies to put up a stake? That's all I'm saying. Doesn't make any sense to me.

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I'm just finding it odd that COST can be a major reason why courses are poorly marked, when it costs just pennies to put up a stake? That's all I'm saying. Doesn't make any sense to me.

I'm with you, I just think most people are lazy and don't think it is a big deal.  Another thing I've seen is that home owners will remove the stake and throw it away.

-Jerry

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I'm with you, I just think most people are lazy and don't think it is a big deal.  Another thing I've seen is that home owners will remove the stake and throw it away.

My guess is that 95%+ of golfers don't follow the rules nor do they care to. The golf course is isn't going to gain any extra business by carefully staking the OB throughout the course, it is the least of their concerns. Is that right, no, but it is reality. They make their money on the beer guzzling Saturday morning foursomes that use foot wedges and mulligans and brag about their 78 over lunch in the clubhouse. $$$ The guys counting every stroke, bringing their own water on the course, and trying to sneak a round in before they go back to their families are not their core market, unfortunately.

Now I have seen courses where the groundskeeper is a committed golfer and he takes time to mark OB and hazards properly. Cost is not the issue, it's time and resources of the staff, as well as lack of golf experience among the staff.

- Mark

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My guess is that 95%+ of golfers don't follow the rules nor do they care to. The golf course is isn't going to gain any extra business by carefully staking the OB throughout the course, it is the least of their concerns. Is that right, no, but it is reality. They make their money on the beer guzzling Saturday morning foursomes that use foot wedges and mulligans and brag about their 78 over lunch in the clubhouse. $$$ The guys counting every stroke, bringing their own water on the course, and trying to sneak a round in before they go back to their families are not their core market, unfortunately.

Now I have seen courses where the groundskeeper is a committed golfer and he takes time to mark OB and hazards properly. Cost is not the issue, it's time and resources of the staff, as well as lack of golf experience among the staff.

My course, is typically well defined, we have a very good maintenance staff.  Plus we hold lots of tournaments, so the course markings are usually always good.  Plus we have one of he top rules officials in the country as a member, so he is always on top of that stuff.

Clyde Luther served as NCAA Division I head Rules official from 2000-11. Over his career he has officiated 21 NCAA Division I, II and III championships. He also serves as head Rules official for the Atlantic Coast Conference Championship, a post he has held since 1991. Luther has served as a Rules official at the Palmer Cup and many regular season collegiate events over the years.

Outside of college golf, Luther has been a veteran rules official at countless VSGA events, has worked more than 120 USGA championships and officiated at three Presidents Cups, as well as at the Masters Tournament and the PGA Championship.

-Jerry

Driver: Titleist 913 D3 (9.5 degree) – Aldila RIP 60-2.9-Stiff; Callaway Mini-Driver Kura Kage 60g shaft - 12 degree Hybrids: Callway X2 Hot Pro - 16 degree & 23 degree – Pro-Shaft; Callway X2 Hot – 5H & 6H Irons: Titleist 714 AP2 7 thru AW with S300 Dynamic Gold Wedges: Titleist Vokey GW (54 degree), Callaway MackDaddy PM Grind SW (58 degree) Putter: Ping Cadence TR Ketsch Heavy Balls: Titleist Pro V1x & Snell MyTourBall

"Golf is the closest game to the game we call life. You get bad breaks from good shots; you get good breaks from bad shots but you have to play the ball where it lies."- Bobby Jones

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My course, is typically well defined, we have a very good maintenance staff.  Plus we hold lots of tournaments, so the course markings are usually always good.  Plus we have one of he top rules officials in the country as a member, so he is always on top of that stuff.

Clyde Luther served as NCAA Division I head Rules official from 2000-11. Over his career he has officiated 21 NCAA Division I, II and III championships. He also serves as head Rules official for the Atlantic Coast Conference Championship, a post he has held since 1991. Luther has served as a Rules official at the Palmer Cup and many regular season collegiate events over the years.

Outside of college golf, Luther has been a veteran rules official at countless VSGA events, has worked more than 120 USGA championships and officiated at three Presidents Cups, as well as at the Masters Tournament and the PGA Championship.

Quit bragging, Jerry!!  To be fair, you're right, your course was in great shape when I played it in April.  Plus, you have one of the nicest assistant pros around, who just happened to have interned at Stoneleigh last year.

Dave

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If they really want the curved boundary, get some additional white stakes and pound them into the ground. If I play the course I'm drawing a straight line between stakes, sorry, that's the rule in the book.

Julia

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Note: This thread is 3185 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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