I am nothing like a Pro Golfer!!!!!

[Pretzel]

Sorry, I more meant to say that they prefer to show good shots than bad ones. They do still show bad ones, but they tend to show a lot more good than bad.

[Strandly]

That's not true ... They don't "cut away" from bad shots, they just don't show many shots from guys who aren't leading. But consider the times when guys hit really bad shots (like last season or the one before when Webb had a couple of cold shanks), they will show those over and over and over and over.

Although I will agree that we all have a slightly inflated view of the pros because we are only watching the ones playing the best that week. When in reality, they're averaging a collective 73 or 74 as a group, not 67.

You know I think this is one of the reasons I don't really care to watch PGA events.  To use another sport for an example I like it when a guy like Muhammed Ali comes along and tells you he's going to stomp your ass and then he goes out and does it, repeatedly.  It's funny and impressive at the same time.  That doesn't appear to happen in golf.  While I don't think the trash talking is necessary it seems like there's a different winner every week and I find that rather boring.  It's like we're watching a bunch of weekend duffers go through hot and cold periods except with much better average scores.  If I tune in I want to see someone absolutely DOMINATE for a few years.  I'm guessing other people feel the same way and that this is why Tiger was such a big deal for so many years.  Anyway, just an observation, don't flip out.

[Pretzel]

You know I think this is one of the reasons I don't really care to watch PGA events.  To use another sport for an example I like it when a guy like Muhammed Ali comes along and tells you he's going to stomp your ass and then he goes out and does it, repeatedly.  It's funny and impressive at the same time.  That doesn't appear to happen in golf.  While I don't think the trash talking is necessary it seems like there's a different winner every week and I find that rather boring.  It's like we're watching a bunch of weekend duffers go through hot and cold periods except with much better average scores.  If I tune in I want to see someone absolutely DOMINATE for a few years.  I'm guessing other people feel the same way and that this is why Tiger was such a big deal for so many years.  Anyway, just an observation, don't flip out.

That's also part of the reason I found it so much fun to watch the 2008 US Open. Tiger was winning left and right still (except for the period of time directly leading up to the tournament) and then he had a challenge for once in a tournament with the 18 hole playoff plus sudden death. I was only 10 at the time it happened and I thought it was the greatest thing to watch just because I had grown up watching Tiger Woods win a whole lot of tournaments.

[14ledo81]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strandly

You know I think this is one of the reasons I don't really care to watch PGA events.  To use another sport for an example I like it when a guy like Muhammed Ali comes along and tells you he's going to stomp your ass and then he goes out and does it, repeatedly.  It's funny and impressive at the same time.  That doesn't appear to happen in golf.  While I don't think the trash talking is necessary it seems like there's a different winner every week and I find that rather boring.  It's like we're watching a bunch of weekend duffers go through hot and cold periods except with much better average scores.  If I tune in I want to see someone absolutely DOMINATE for a few years.  I'm guessing other people feel the same way and that this is why Tiger was such a big deal for so many years.  Anyway, just an observation, don't flip out.

That's also part of the reason I found it so much fun to watch the 2008 US Open. Tiger was winning left and right still (except for the period of time directly leading up to the tournament) and then he had a challenge for once in a tournament with the 18 hole playoff plus sudden death. I was only 10 at the time it happened and I thought it was the greatest thing to watch just because I had grown up watching Tiger Woods win a whole lot of tournaments.

You are 16?

Definitely seem well versed for that age.  Good vocabulary and writing skills.  Hope you stick around Pretzel.

[newtogolf]

One hole isn't a good example, and a bit of an exaggeration in comparing the skill and ability of pro's versus non-pro's.  Pro's have blow up holes and if they happen to occur at the same time the bogey golfer plays at his best it's possible for the bogey golfer to score lower on one hole.  Winning one hole out of 18 isn't much of a feat, nor does it make much of a statement about the differences between a pro and non-pro.

Despite all the PC garbage @Strandly ro athletes perform at a level that most non-pros can even dream to be at in every sport.  It's not mythical, it's real.  Think about all the college athletes that play D1 and D2 and never even sniff pro level status or fail once they make it to the pros.

Is it disheartening to know that no matter how many hours Dan spends he'll never make it to the PGA Tour, sure, but then again it's reality.  Anyone that's competed against top level athletes understands the differences while those that haven't are incredulous due to their ignorance.

[johnclayton1982]

Quote:

One hole isn't a good example, and a bit of an exaggeration in comparing the skill and ability of pro's versus non-pro's.  Pro's have blow up holes and if they happen to occur at the same time the bogey golfer plays at his best it's possible for the bogey golfer to score lower on one hole.  Winning one hole out of 18 isn't much of a feat, nor does it make much of a statement about the differences between a pro and non-pro.

Perhaps you are right.  I stopped responding when I started getting hideously misquoted, but the topic came up because someone questioned how, if I was any good at tennis at all, I managed to win only two points in a set against a guy who himself didn't make it.  I was trying to illustrate its a bit like a 1 or 2 handicap (fine golfers) not winning a hole off a pro in match play.  But your right, it may be a bad example.  I still think it would take quite a few 18 hole rounds to happen.

Quote:

It's not mythical, it's real.  Think about all the college athletes that play D1 and D2 and never even sniff pro level status or fail once they make it to the pros.

The thing is, most athletes, in order to get close, honestly believe they are going to make it.  Jim Calhoun (ex-UCONN coach) has a great story in his book where he had his players (12 basketball players) fill out a survey about where they'll be in five years.  11 said playing in the NBA.  None did.  Virtually everyone on my college tennis team knew they'd be on the ATP tour.  None made it and most didn't get a single start.

Its unfortunate the thread kinda went down a rabbit hole, but it is incredible how good the professionals are when you consider they are the best of the best from the entire world.

[newtogolf]

Perhaps you are right.  I stopped responding when I started getting hideously misquoted, but the topic came up because someone questioned how, if I was any good at tennis at all, I managed to win only two points in a set against a guy who himself didn't make it.  I was trying to illustrate its a bit like a 1 or 2 handicap (fine golfers) not winning a hole off a pro in match play.  But your right, it may be a bad example.  I still think it would take quite a few 18 hole rounds to happen.

The thing is, most athletes, in order to get close, honestly believe they are going to make it.  Jim Calhoun (ex-UCONN coach) has a great story in his book where he had his players (12 basketball players) fill out a survey about where they'll be in five years.  11 said playing in the NBA.  None did.  Virtually everyone on my college tennis team knew they'd be on the ATP tour.  None made it and most didn't get a single start.

Its unfortunate the thread kinda went down a rabbit hole, but it is incredible how good the professionals are when you consider they are the best of the best from the entire world.

I had a similar experience playing football but never even got as close to pro level as you did.  I was good enough in H.S. to get offered a scholarship to play D2 football but broke my leg senior year and lost it, so I walked on to a D3 school in hopes of dominating D3 and maybe transferring to D1 my junior year.  Those thoughts vanished quickly the day I showed up for my first practice and every guy at my position was bigger, hit harder and was faster than I was.

I worked my ass off freshman and sophomore year and realized that much like Al Bundy my best football memories would come from high school.  The level of talent at D3 was far superior to what I faced in H.S.  I can't imagine how tough it would have been for me to make the D2 team, D1 was pure fantasy and any pro dreams I had were squashed that first day of practice.  Junior year, I quit the team, focused on academics and took a job with the university full time to pay for my tuition.  It wasn't easy accepting I wasn't good enough but it was the right decision.

Golf is one of those sports like bowling that people see on television and assume it must not take much athleticism if old men, women and fat out of shape guys are on television are pros.   5000 hours in, Dan Plan claims his handicap is a 2.8, I'm guessing he's really a 5+ given his results in tournaments.  He'll be a good golfer, maybe win a local club championship, but he's not ever going to be on the PGA Tour.  I think he's come to that realization already but appears committed to see it through to 10,000 hours which won't be easy if he knows his goal is pure fantasy now.

[Jeremie Boop]

I had a similar experience playing football but never even got as close to pro level as you did.  I was good enough in H.S. to get offered a scholarship to play D2 football but broke my leg senior year and lost it, so I walked on to a D3 school in hopes of dominating D3 and maybe transferring to D1 my junior year.  Those thoughts vanished quickly the day I showed up for my first practice and every guy at my position was bigger, hit harder and was faster than I was.

I worked my ass off freshman and sophomore year and realized that much like Al Bundy my best football memories would come from high school.  The level of talent at D3 was far superior to what I faced in H.S.  I can't imagine how tough it would have been for me to make the D2 team, D1 was pure fantasy and any pro dreams I had were squashed that first day of practice.  Junior year, I quit the team, focused on academics and took a job with the university full time to pay for my tuition.  It wasn't easy accepting I wasn't good enough but it was the right decision.

Golf is one of those sports like bowling that people see on television and assume it must not take much athleticism if old men, women and fat out of shape guys are on television are pros.   5000 hours in, Dan Plan claims his handicap is a 2.8, I'm guessing he's really a 5+ given his results in tournaments.  He'll be a good golfer, maybe win a local club championship, but he's not ever going to be on the PGA Tour.  I think he's come to that realization already but appears committed to see it through to 10,000 hours which won't be easy if he knows his goal is pure fantasy now.

Bowling isn't that hard :-P I carried a 200+ average for years and had multiple 300 games. Getting good at golf continues to elude me even after playing it for longer than I bowled. I think the main difference is that I started bowling at a younger age and I worked at a bowling alley which allowed me to practice a lot. Had I started golf at that age and worked at a driving range or golf course allowing me to practice the same amount I don't even know if I'd be better than a single digit handicap golfer. Golf, to me, is much harder to get good at then any other sport/game I've played before. At the same time though, I've had some "pro-like" performances on the golf course from time to time. Sunday I had driver and 7 iron to 2 feet on a 500 yard par 5 for eagle and 2 holes later I had 4 iron 4 iron chip in for eagle on 475 yard par 5 *forced lay up do to water*. I'm not saying I'd be able to do that against a pro though, but sometimes being a massive underdog who's not expected to be able to win at all frees you of any pressure which *might* allow you to get a hole or 2 of brilliant play in :-p

[CarlSpackler]

I just stood along the 10 tee box while Dustin Johnson teed off. I swear I heard the ball snap back into shape after it exploded off the clubface. They play a different game for sure.

[14ledo81]

I just stood along the 10 tee box while Dustin Johnson teed off. I swear I heard the ball snap back into shape after it exploded off the clubface. They play a different game for sure.

Just??? As in right now??

Pics please.......

[CarlSpackler]

Just??? As in right now?? Pics please.......

A while ago now. I'll be here all week. Should have plenty to share. I'll post in the event thread if that works. Edit: Assuming I can get some good ones.

[Lihu]

Keep in mind while watching this video that Mark Crossfield is approximately a +2 handicap. He was an aspiring pro at one time, but now is the "Golf Guru".

I just stood along the 10 tee box while Dustin Johnson teed off. I swear I heard the ball snap back into shape after it exploded off the clubface. They play a different game for sure.

Yeah, it's quite impressive. Although, keep in mind that Dustin is one of the top long hitters.

All the others are also quite impressive, even a "short" hitter like Cory Pavin in the Champions tour (Toshiba Classic).

[Golfingdad]

Bowling isn't that hard :-P I carried a 200+ average for years and had multiple 300 games. Getting good at golf continues to elude me even after playing it for longer than I bowled. I think the main difference is that I started bowling at a younger age and I worked at a bowling alley which allowed me to practice a lot. Had I started golf at that age and worked at a driving range or golf course allowing me to practice the same amount I don't even know if I'd be better than a single digit handicap golfer. Golf, to me, is much harder to get good at then any other sport/game I've played before. At the same time though, I've had some "pro-like" performances on the golf course from time to time. Sunday I had driver and 7 iron to 2 feet on a 500 yard par 5 for eagle and 2 holes later I had 4 iron 4 iron chip in for eagle on 475 yard par 5 *forced lay up do to water*. I'm not saying I'd be able to do that against a pro though, but sometimes being a massive underdog who's not expected to be able to win at all frees you of any pressure which *might* allow you to get a hole or 2 of brilliant play in :-p

Bowling is certainly easier than golf, and the gap between good amateurs and pros is smaller, IMO, than in golf or tennis, but it's still wide.  I played in a scratch league for the last couple of years and there are several guys in that league that average 220+, one even averages over 230.  Some of those same guys play in a "scratch challenge" league, which uses the oil patterns that the pros play on, and they all average in the 180's in that league.

[Jeremie Boop]

Bowling is certainly easier than golf, and the gap between good amateurs and pros is smaller, IMO, than in golf or tennis, but it's still wide.  I played in a scratch league for the last couple of years and there are several guys in that league that average 220+, one even averages over 230.  Some of those same guys play in a "scratch challenge" league, which uses the oil patterns that the pros play on, and they all average in the 180's in that league.

True, but the issue with the pro patterns is most people don't get a chance to play on them. I think the highest I averaged before quitting was 213 or so. I only bowled one night a week and never practiced. Like golf, I could have gotten better if I actually put the time in to practice. Practice is my nemesis, I always want to just go out and play the sport! I mean gosh, can't I be good just by thinking about what I need to fix?

IMO the big problem with a lot of people is they just want to go out and golf and get better. They watch stuff on tv or the internet that is supposed to fix their problems but they don't really commit to applying those things with range time. I'm definitely in that group of people as far as not committing to taking the time to practice swing fixes at the range. I've always been that way though, and if I ever expect to get better I'll have to break that pattern.

[Strandly]

True, but the issue with the pro patterns is most people don't get a chance to play on them. I think the highest I averaged before quitting was 213 or so. I only bowled one night a week and never practiced. Like golf, I could have gotten better if I actually put the time in to practice. Practice is my nemesis, I always want to just go out and play the sport! I mean gosh, can't I be good just by thinking about what I need to fix?

IMO the big problem with a lot of people is they just want to go out and golf and get better. They watch stuff on tv or the internet that is supposed to fix their problems but they don't really commit to applying those things with range time. I'm definitely in that group of people as far as not committing to taking the time to practice swing fixes at the range. I've always been that way though, and if I ever expect to get better I'll have to break that pattern.

Yeah when I get paired with random people occasionally they ask how long I've been playing and when I tell them a year they're usually a little surprised.  I just tell them I research stuff on the web and buy 10 bucket range passes so I can get a slight discount and hit the same shots multiple times.  Anyway, I actually don't mind going to the range to practice but the price of it is really stupid.  I think plenty of people enjoy the game but they just can't afford to pay $8-9 every single time they want to practice.  That makes them try to use their rounds as practice time and that never works either since you can't hit the same shot repeatedly.  Practicing for any sport should be minimal cost imo.  You want people to get better and continue playing, right?

[Lihu]

Yeah when I get paired with random people occasionally they ask how long I've been playing and when I tell them a year they're usually a little surprised.  I just tell them I research stuff on the web and buy 10 bucket range passes so I can get a slight discount and hit the same shots multiple times.  Anyway, I actually don't mind going to the range to practice but the price of it is really stupid.  I think plenty of people enjoy the game but they just can't afford to pay $8-9 every single time they want to practice.  That makes them try to use their rounds as practice time and that never works either since you can't hit the same shot repeatedly.  Practicing for any sport should be minimal cost imo.  You want people to get better and continue playing, right?

Yes, the cost is very high just for practice. There are other ways to improve without such a drain on your wallet.

For instance, a net in the backyard can help you with your ball striking, and is a very minimal cost.

My son and I only go to the range if we want to try different ball flights and see how far we hit on any given day (Contrary to what I've read, range balls go roughly the same distances as most playing balls. Only really old ones with no dimples left or ones that say "limited flight" go shorter). It's also a good for warmup to gain some confidence before the first tee shot.

[Jeremie Boop]

Yes, the cost is very high just for practice. There are other ways to improve without such a drain on your wallet.

For instance, a net in the backyard can help you with your ball striking, and is a very minimal cost.

My son and I only go to the range if we want to try different ball flights and see how far we hit on any given day (Contrary to what I've read, range balls go roughly the same distances as most playing balls. Only really old ones with no dimples left or ones that say "limited flight" go shorter). It's also a good for warmup to gain some confidence before the first tee shot.

I'm not sure hitting into a net would give me the needed feedback I am looking for. Most of the time the contact I make with the ball is solid, however without seeing the flight path I don't know if I hit it straight/draw/big draw/push/fade/slice/etc. I do agree if someone is just having trouble getting the ball in the air that a net would be worth hitting into.

[Lihu]

I'm not sure hitting into a net would give me the needed feedback I am looking for. Most of the time the contact I make with the ball is solid, however without seeing the flight path I don't know if I hit it straight/draw/big draw/push/fade/slice/etc. I do agree if someone is just having trouble getting the ball in the air that a net would be worth hitting into.

Depends upon your skill level, and the type of club you are using.

When we practice against a net, we use blades (Cleveland CG Tour or Mizuno MP32). Even a 1cm off center hit feels like crap, and ones that are off by 0.5cm still feel worse than ones right in the sweet spot which is actually only about a quarter inch with the Cleveland CG Tour.

For flight, you are correct. We spend lots of time at the range for that, but we spend a lot more against a net.

If you can find a large field you can also bring a couple shag bags which only cost about $24 each with 48 balls each from Target. These are real golf balls, and they will last you a year or more depending upon how many you lose.