When To Tee It Back

[InTheRough]

After reading through the Tee It Forward thread I would like to pose a new question to put a more tangible solution to the problem...when to move it back a tee?  Right now the TIF program has guidelines for players based on how far they hit their driver but when you mention driver distance to golfers there is too much guessing and a lot of players who decide to play the tips because they "can get it out to 300 on a good shot".  So my thought is to change the program to match tees to overall scores...more tangible, easier to track, and less of an ego issue than driver distance. Also since many recreational players dont keep a handicap it is easier for them to understand and can become part of learning the game: until you can score x you should play y tees.  So what do you guys think?  Assuming you are playing an average difficulty course, what score or score range do you need to be consistently posting before you should consider playing a more challenging tee?

For me it is the low 80's.  On most courses it's about 10 over and If you can shoot a course in the low 80's on a particular tee than you are most likely not playing too slow and are probably good enough to move back if you want the challenge  Once your scores start to consistently creep over the low 90's however its time to move back up

[Grndslmhttr3]

Just get one of these and you'll be hitting it from the back tees in no time

[Aguirre]

It's a combination of distance and skill.  If you're one of these guys who CAN hit the ball 260 when you catch one, but are still a 20 handicapper, just stick with the white tees.  If you're a guy who consistently hits the ball 260, but are like a 14 handicapper because you spray it a bit and can't putt for shit, stick with the white tees.  But if you hit it 240 consistently, and are a 7 handicapper, moving back to 6400-6800 would probably improve the variety of shots you get to hit per round.

EDIT--By white tees I mean the usual member tees, 6000-6400 range.

[David in FL]

For me it is the low 80's.  On most courses it's about 10 over and If you can shoot a course in the low 80's on a particular tee than you are most likely not playing too slow and are probably good enough to move back if you want the challenge  Once your scores start to consistently creep over the low 90's however its time to move back up

Given that standard, the vast majority of golfers should be playing the forward tees....

[Aguirre]

Given that standard, the vast majority of golfers should be playing the forward tees....

Which is true, of course.  I mean, if you average in the low 80s, that's a single digit handicapper, which literally puts you in something like the top 5-8% of golfers worldwide.

[InTheRough]

Given that standard, the vast majority of golfers should be playing the forward tees....

Isnt that the whole point behind the TIF program.  The majority of golfers are playing from tees that are too long for them.

It's a combination of distance and skill.  If you're one of these guys who CAN hit the ball 260 when you catch one, but are still a 20 handicapper, just stick with the white tees.  If you're a guy who consistently hits the ball 260, but are like a 14 handicapper because you spray it a bit and can't putt for shit, stick with the white tees.  But if you hit it 240 consistently, and are a 7 handicapper, moving back to 6400-6800 would probably improve the variety of shots you get to hit per round.

EDIT--By white tees I mean the usual member tees, 6000-6400 range.

I'm looking to take the distance out of the equation because who cares if you can stripe it 260 every time if double and triple bogey every whole.  By arranging it by score it doesnt matter if you are hitting 250 or 200 with the driver...its all about the score

[Aguirre]

Isnt that the whole point behind the TIF program.  The majority of golfers are playing from tees that are too long for them.

I'm looking to take the distance out of the equation because who cares if you can stripe it 260 every time if double and triple bogey every whole.  By arranging it by score it doesnt matter if you are hitting 250 or 200 with the driver...its all about the score

Sure, but distance does matter.  Think of that 70 year old guy who is a four handicapper because he makes very consistent contact and chips to four feet every damn time, but only gets it out there 210-220 off the tee.  That guy should probably stick to the 6150 tees, regardless of handicap.

[InTheRough]

Which is true, of course.  I mean, if you average in the low 80s, that's a single digit handicapper, which literally puts you in something like the top 5-8% of golfers worldwide.

Should the top 10% be the only ones playing the tips then?  The average handicap in golf is about 16 (last i heard) so for an average difficulty course you could expect a slightly better than average golfer to shoot anywhere from 80-85

[Aguirre]

Should the top 10% be the only ones playing the tips then?  The average handicap in golf is about 16 (last i heard) so for an average difficulty course you could expect a slightly better than average golfer to shoot anywhere from 80-85

A 16 handicapper averages around 90.

[InTheRough]

A 16 handicapper averages around 90.

haha...my terrible math skills aside i still hold that anything below an 84-85 is good enough to warrant moving back and once you start getting into the 94 and up range you might want to consider moving up.  Keep in mind that i am just thinking of this as a guideline that is easier to understand and quantify then how good of a ball striker they are or what their FIR percentage is

[David in FL]

Isnt that the whole point behind the TIF program.  The majority of golfers are playing from tees that are too long for them.

Yep, but the issue isn't those that are playing the tees immediately behind the forward (ladies) tees. It's the guys who insist on playing the tips or one up tees that need to re-evaluate their choice of tees.

[iacas]

Sure, but distance does matter.  Think of that 70 year old guy who is a four handicapper because he makes very consistent contact and chips to four feet every damn time, but only gets it out there 210-220 off the tee.  That guy should probably stick to the 6150 tees, regardless of handicap.

Find that guy. Bet you can't. Not easily.

He'd have to be shooting around par on most golf courses, or better, because to be a 4 handicap, the course rating is likely 67 or so from 6150 yards.

[Aguirre]

Find that guy. Bet you can't. Not easily.

He'd have to be shooting around par on most golf courses, or better, because to be a 4 handicap, the course rating is likely 67 or so from 6150 yards.

I know that guy.  He's a good friend of my dads.  He plays in a senior group with them, tees it up from the golds and often shoots his age.

My dad suggested he move back, and the guy said he likes winning the skin money.

[Golfingdad]

I don't think score, driving distance or any other factor matter, save for two: 1. You can keep up the pace. 2. You have fun. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Aguirre]

I don't think score, driving distance or any other factor matter, save for two:

1. You can keep up the pace.

2. You have fun.

That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

This is actually the best answer.

I think most of are just assuming that it's more fun to hit a variety of clubs into greens, and scoring an 82 is more fun than an 89.

[iacas]

I know that guy.  He's a good friend of my dads.  He plays in a senior group with them, tees it up from the golds and often shoots his age.

My dad suggested he move back, and the guy said he likes winning the skin money.

Congratulations. Find another. 70-year olds that shoot par are pretty rare… especially since 4 handicappers are pretty darn uncommon at any age.

[Golfingdad]

This is actually the best answer.

I think most of are just assuming that it's more fun to hit a variety of clubs into greens, and scoring an 82 is more fun than an 89.

Yeah, I agree.  By and large, shooting lower scores, I imagine, is more fun for everybody.  That's why I've been trying to get my dads to move up.  They still play the white tees ... cuz that's what they've always played.  Those are the "mens" tees.  Yet, they fail to acknowledge that there is hardly a single par 4 on the course that they can reach in two (and we're talking about a short course here).  I can't fathom why they wouldn't want to play a set of tees that would allow them, not only to reach several of the par 4's, but to reach them with clubs other than hybrids and fairway woods.  There is no reason why they shouldn't be able to hit a driver and a wedge or a 9 iron to reach a par 4 green occasionally.  There is no reason why they shouldn't be able to hit an 8 or 7 iron into the par 3's.  I know they would have more fun playing that way.

[Aguirre]

Congratulations. Find another.  70-year olds that shoot par are pretty rare… especially since 4 handicappers are pretty darn uncommon at any age.

It was just an example.