Correct Tee question ...

[Dave2512]

My experience is the entitlement types that think their fees are a pass to do whatever they want on the courses are inconsiderate in every way.

[wmadoty]

That other guy paid the same amount, and may live by the same mistaken philosophy as you do, only he's comfortable with 60 hour rounds.  If we all thought that way, golf would have become extinct long ago.

Then you haven't been around golf enough.  I worked as a starter, I've played golf for 40 years, and forcing others to play through on a busy course slows everything down even more.  If a group is already slow, and they then have to wait for you to play through, that slows them even more.  Now somebody else has caught them, so they do it again.... lather, rinse, repeat.  Now they have a log jam behind them that will never get unstuck until the day is about finished.

Keep pace or pick up and move forward until you have caught up.  Then find a way to keep up with the group in front of you.  That is how it's supposed to work and if you are going to play much golf, you had better learn it now.

What other guy Fourputt? I never said I was okay with holding anyone up. If said player is not making anyone wait why do you have a problem with how long it takes him to play his round? Is iit because someone on TV told you that was what was wrong with golf?

[oregongolfguy]

Be respectful to the course and the people on it.  Keep pace with the group in front of you.....After that, I don't care what tee's people play from.

[Dave2512]

But it's not the number of strokes that lead to slow golf it's how you get to the number of strokes. Poorly played golf is rarely on pace because errant shots (mishits) land all over the course. You aren't just golfing you are searching. Sometimes more than once on the same hole.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

That other guy paid the same amount, and may live by the same mistaken philosophy as you do, only he's comfortable with 60 hour rounds.  If we all thought that way, golf would have become extinct long ago.

Then you haven't been around golf enough.  I worked as a starter, I've played golf for 40 years, and forcing others to play through on a busy course slows everything down even more.  If a group is already slow, and they then have to wait for you to play through, that slows them even more.  Now somebody else has caught them, so they do it again.... lather, rinse, repeat.  Now they have a log jam behind them that will never get unstuck until the day is about finished.

Keep pace or pick up and move forward until you have caught up.  Then find a way to keep up with the group in front of you.  That is how it's supposed to work and if you are going to play much golf, you had better learn it now.

What other guy Fourputt? I never said I was okay with holding anyone up. If said player is not making anyone wait why do you have a problem with how long it takes him to play his round? Is iit because someone on TV told you that was what was wrong with golf?

You said you were okay with playing through a slow group.  My point is that if you are the 5th group of the day to play through them, the odds are that they have a line waiting behind them.  If we all agreed with your philosophy, they would have no inspiration to improve their pace.  And I'm actually intelligent enough to figure that out for myself, thank you.  Like I said, I worked at a very busy course and saw first hand just how little it takes to back a course up.

On our course, during busy times (which was pretty much every day between open and about 1 PM) playing through was not given as an option except in very unusual circumstances (like a cart breakdown or similar).  Slow play was simply not an excuse for falling behind, and if a group did fall behind, even by 2 or 3 minutes, they would see a ranger very quickly.  The ranger had a spreadsheet matrix that showed what hole any group was expected to be on for every starting time.  He knew to the minute when each group was supposed to be on what tee, and knew how long each hole was supposed to take them, so he could extrapolate from that when they should be hitting their second shots or approaching the green on a given hole.  If there was a gap in front and they were off pace, he was on them to catch up.

[wmadoty]

You said you were okay with playing through a slow group.  My point is that if you are the 5th group of the day to play through them, the odds are that they have a line waiting behind them.  If we all agreed with your philosophy, they would have no inspiration to improve their pace.  And I'm actually intelligent enough to figure that out for myself, thank you.  Like I said, I worked at a very busy course and saw first hand just how little it takes to back a course up.

On our course, during busy times (which was pretty much every day between open and about 1 PM) playing through was not given as an option except in very unusual circumstances (like a cart breakdown or similar).  Slow play was simply not an excuse for falling behind, and if a group did fall behind, even by 2 or 3 minutes, they would see a ranger very quickly.  The ranger had a spreadsheet matrix that showed what hole any group was expected to be on for every starting time.  He knew to the minute when each group was supposed to be on what tee, and knew how long each hole was supposed to take them, so he could extrapolate from that when they should be hitting their second shots or approaching the green on a given hole.  If there was a gap in front and they were off pace, he was on them to catch up.

I will give you that it is not okay for someone to backup a course for any reason no matter how much money they have spent. I do have an understanding of how easily a course can get backed up and how frustrating it can be to wait to play during a 6-hour round. I have watched my share of pro-ams.

If I were a slow player wanting to play from the 8,000 yard tees I would wait for a slow time. However, if it is not congested, no one should have a problem with someone playing slow from wherever they want. It should not matter to anyone how long someone takes to play a round if they are not holding someone up.

[Dave2512]

If I were a slow player wanting to play from the 8,000 yard tees I would wait for a slow time. However, if it is not congested, no one should have a problem with someone playing slow from wherever they want. It should not matter to anyone how long someone takes to play a round if they are not holding someone up.

Is this even possible? Even at the out of the way rural courses I play there is always more than one person out there. At some point someone is going to catch you and have to either wait or play through.

[GolfMaineiac26]

You said you were okay with playing through a slow group.  My point is that if you are the 5th group of the day to play through them, the odds are that they have a line waiting behind them.  If we all agreed with your philosophy, they would have no inspiration to improve their pace.  And I'm actually intelligent enough to figure that out for myself, thank you.  Like I said, I worked at a very busy course and saw first hand just how little it takes to back a course up.

On our course, during busy times (which was pretty much every day between open and about 1 PM) playing through was not given as an option except in very unusual circumstances (like a cart breakdown or similar).  Slow play was simply not an excuse for falling behind, and if a group did fall behind, even by 2 or 3 minutes, they would see a ranger very quickly.  The ranger had a spreadsheet matrix that showed what hole any group was expected to be on for every starting time.  He knew to the minute when each group was supposed to be on what tee, and knew how long each hole was supposed to take them, so he could extrapolate from that when they should be hitting their second shots or approaching the green on a given hole.  If there was a gap in front and they were off pace, he was on them to catch up.

Maybe he is refering to playing at a lax public golf course, what your describing sounds more like an exclusive country club or a public course that is to strict to even be fun, I mean honestly who wants to golf and have to set the tee, spot where they want their ball to land and commit at address in 60 seconds or less, I for one don't it's folly to expect everyone to keep up with the group in front of them, shit happens, people hit one into a water hazard or the ball takes a bad bounce into a bunker, are they just supposed to pick their ball up and walk to the next hole? That's just my opinion.

[Dave2512]

Maybe he is refering to playing at a lax public golf course, what your describing sounds more like an exclusive country club or a public course that is to strict to even be fun, I mean honestly who wants to golf and have to set the tee, spot where they want their ball to land and commit at address in 60 seconds or less, I for one don't it's folly to expect everyone to keep up with the group in front of them, shit happens, people hit one into a water hazard or the ball takes a bad bounce into a bunker, are they just supposed to pick their ball up and walk to the next hole? That's just my opinion.

It's not.

[GolfMaineiac26]

It's not.

Not what?

[Dave2512]

Not what?

Any of the things you mention. It's a typical public course in this area with policies similar to others. We are both from Denver so familiar with the same courses.

[GolfMaineiac26]

Any of the things you mention. It's a typical public course in this area with policies similar to others. We are both from Denver so familiar with the same courses.

Ah ok I understand now, the courses where I live (the public ones at least) are quite lax, and it is mostly up to individuals to report slow play, and play-through's are commonplace. Everyone respects fellow players.

[Dave2512]

Ah ok I understand now, the courses where I live (the public ones at least) are quite lax, and it is mostly up to individuals to report slow play, and play-through's are commonplace. Everyone respects fellow players.

I wish that was the case here and some of it is probably ignorance but a lot of it, at least what I see, stubbornness. As related to the correct tees question while I agree if someone can keep pace and make their way around the course keeping pace then go for it. But that is rarely the case and nobody is going to take more strokes playing closer to the green. In fact that is usually the push back. Guys think that moving up will somehow unlock the golf secret for them and make it too easy thus not as enjoyable. But I'd wager that the guy struggling to break 90 from 6500 isn't going to start regularly breaking 80 or anything just shaving 500 yards. It's poor ball striking that balloons their scores. A couple yards here and there isn't going to fix their swing.

There a hundreds of these threads on here so not surprised there is a "new" one. Comes up a lot.

[turtleback]

No particular reason, just seemed a reasonable number to me.    What would you pick ?

I would pick not having  magic number at all.

I like handicap ranges better than scores just because it's a better indication of what you really do. I suppose you could use your average strokes over par if you know what that really is.

A course I play makes recommendations based on handicap.

0-4 Gold 7435 yards

5-11 Black 6950 yards

12-17 Blue 6589 yards

18-30 White 6032 yards

31+ Silver 5305 yards (these are the reds rated for men)

I often play blue tees there. The longest par 4 from the blues is 442 yards. That is definitely at the max end of what I can hack.

I tend to look at the hole by hole distances,  If there are more than 1 or 2 par 4 holes I cannot reach with 2 solid shots (yup I am one of those inconsistent guys, so 2 solid shots is not a given, in practice) then I probably won't play those tees.  OR a par 3 I cannot reach.  I can be comfortable playing a 6700 yard track and I can be miserable playing a 6300 yard track, depending on distance allocation among the holes. I'd rather play a 380 yard par 4 and a 185 yard par 3 than a 420 yard par 4 and a 125 par 3 even though the latter is less distance.  And I extend that approach to the who "which tee" decision.  Generally that lands me at tees which are 6000-6400.

[Dave2512]

I tend to look at the hole by hole distances,  If there are more than 1 or 2 par 4 holes I cannot reach with 2 solid shots (yup I am one of those inconsistent guys, so 2 solid shots is not a given, in practice) then I probably won't play those tees.  OR a par 3 I cannot reach.  I can be comfortable playing a 6700 yard track and I can be miserable playing a 6300 yard track, depending on distance allocation among the holes. I'd rather play a 380 yard par 4 and a 185 yard par 3 than a 420 yard par 4 and a 125 par 3 even though the latter is less distance.  And I extend that approach to the who "which tee" decision.  Generally that lands me at tees which are 6000-6400.

Same because total yardage can be deceiving, especially on par 71 courses. The 5th par 3 can make a course look shorter than it plays if the par 4's are long.

[dave s]

Here some info on how to 'right-size' courses based on distance:

Avg. drive - Recommended Tees
300 yards - 7,150-7,400 yards
275 yards - 6,700-6,900 yards
250 yards - 6,200-6,400 yards
225 yards - 5,800-6,000 yards
200 yards - 5,200-5,400 yards
175 yards - 4,400-4,600 yards
150 yards - 3,500-3,700 yards
125 yards - 2,800-3,000 yards
100 yards - 2,100-2,300 yards

Some info on the 'tee it forward' idea:  http://www.pga.com/pga-and-usga-step-new-sets-tees-in-nationwide-tee-it-forward-initiative

Why these ideas make sense to me:  PGA tour players tee off on a 460 yard par-4 and hit driver, (3-wood, maybe?) and a short iron, maybe even wedge into the green.  Your question should be, 'what length hole can I hit driver 8i - wedge onto the green and have chance at birdie, par or bogey at worst?  If that number is 320, then you should be looking at the tee boxes where par 4s range from 300-360 yards.

I hit my driver (complete bombs!) 230, usually less.  I look for the tee boxes where a course plays 5800-6200 max and usually feel challenged but not over matched by the length of a course.  There will be an occasional 3-shot par 4 and a lengthy par-3s that might be tough to negotiate, but overall I do not feel like the course is beating me up.  If I play well on a course this length, I'll shoot mid-80s.  If I'm stinking up the place maybe as high as 95.

Playing tees that fit your game is a great way to actually enjoy the game.  It's supposed to be fun, not work!!!

dave

[No Mulligans]

I play on a short 9 hole course with these distances per hole:  150, 135, 395, 175, 350, 248, 220, 198, 320.  Being that my best drives are about 230 and I average more like 210, this course really fits me as I can reach all the holes in regulation.  It's fun to play there for me.

[dkolo]

I play on a short 9 hole course with these distances per hole:  150, 135, 395, 175, 350, 248, 220, 198, 320.  Being that my best drives are about 230 and I average more like 210, this course really fits me as I can reach all the holes in regulation.  It's fun to play there for me.

I have an executive par-31 course similar to that near me. If it weren't more expensive than 9 holes at a nicer full-length par-36 course just as far away, I'd play there more often. This one is very claustrophobic with a ton of trees and the driving range is short irons only, which I feel is almost intentionally designed to keep you from bringing your A-game to kick the course's butt, haha.