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post #19 of 96
Thread Starter 

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

The interesting point is that different people think of different things when they think good.

I do like Clambake's answer. But I don't want to discount anybody else's answer. Please keep them coming.
post #20 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

I really like clambake's answer. I think stresses a lot of common traits for low mid and high handicappers.

In my opinion the major difference between the a +25 handicapper such as yourself and a 12 handicapper such as me is going to execution of shots. A mid handicapper such as myself is probably going to have going to have a better idea of course management than a 25 but ultimately the mid handicapper with be a better ball striker than high handicapper. I think the opposite is true going from mid to low. Once you get to these levels I think the majority of golfers have the same ability to strike the ball well, but the major difference is going to be mental. A low handicapper is more than likely that good because they can keep calm, stick to their strategy, and turn a bad situation into good. As a mid handicapper I'll have my blow up days. Last week I shot a 95 when before that my highest score this season was an 82. You can have every shot in the book but if you don't have the mental game you're stuck.

As far as number ranges
High: +17 and above
Mid: +8 to +16
Low:+7 to -3 or 4
Crazy good: -5 or better

The difference between your average tour player and your local hacker who shoots around scratch is going to be both shot excecution and strategy. The difference between tiger and the rest of the world is that he can intimidate anyone (yes even Phil) and somehow can come through in those clutch spots under extreme pressure.
post #21 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by right handed phil mickelson View Post
high handicappers- 90's+
mid handicappers- 80-90
low handicappers- 75-

anyone in the 76-80 range I consider to be in transition.
transition to what...

and for the record... those that defined it by score are inherently a little _____. I may shoot a 92 one day and a 76 the next... but my index is 8.2, up from last summer's 7.6. Do I soot in the 90's often, no only 1-2 times a year, but it happens... do I always break 80, no but every few rounds I do... I don't think ANYONE shoots within 10 shots on ALL the rounds they play... that's golf.

I agree with those that said...
High - 20+
Mid - 10-20
Low - 9 or less
Amazing and on the verge - +cappers
post #22 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by sosinsurr View Post
Why are + handicaps considered "crazy ass"? Just curious
+ handicaps are better than scratch. The average of their top 50% of scores are below the course rating and thus have to 'give strokes back to the course'. If the course rating is 73.1 and you are a +1, then your 10 best scores of your most recent 20 rounds are about 72, or 1 below the course rating. This is simplifying the formula of course but you get the idea.

Also for all offering their opinion and saying an 8 usually breaks 80, this is unlikely. We must remember that handicap is the average of the 10 best scores of your most recent 20. You could shoot 75-82 10 times and 82-95 10 times and still be an 8 handicap or even lower (simplifying again). I would bet that around a 5 is when people are consistently breaking 80. I'm a 3, although trending lower right now, and i still shoot the occasional 82 or 84.
post #23 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

I understand that + is better than scratch...take a look at mine, I think I would know ;)

I was just asking why he thought a + would be "crazy ass" that's all...everyones got their opinion. I just look at my handicap and don't think "crazy ass", that's all :)
post #24 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

I like clambake's answer but I think it needs some levels in the middle. 5 to 25 is a HUGE range. Based on my own experience, I would say a "good" golfer is probably a mid-handicap, which I would define as 10-20. That would mean you have a good chance of par/bogey golf so you are probably usually putting for birdie or par a good amount of the time. Most likely golfers in that range have one or two blowups that really hurt their score,

High Handicap - +25
Mid/High - 20 - 24
Mid - 14-19
Mid/low - 10-13
Low - single digits
Really good - scratch to 2 or three
Great - better than scratch

Something like that.
post #25 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

forgot to answer part of the question... I consider a good golfer to be below a 12 handicap or so... meaning they probably break 90 a fair bit of the time.

However, I change the standard for women (I'm sure I'll take some sh__ for this), but I consider a woman good if she can break 100 fairly regularly.
post #26 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by thedoxology View Post
You could shoot 75-82 10 times and 82-95 10 times and still be an 8 handicap or even lower (simplifying again). I would bet that around a 5 is when people are consistently breaking 80. I'm a 3, although trending lower right now, and i still shoot the occasional 82 or 84.
yeah... that's why we should pay attention to people's ANTI-HC's.
like me. i'm a 9....but my anti is around 17 now.... i'll have a bunch of rounds in the high 80's... sometimes even low 90's...
but then i'll have those rounds where i'll shoot in the 70's and that's why it's kept me low....especially my home course... i'm usually around 80 there.
post #27 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Good question. I actually would consider someone to be a good golfer if they have 16 handicap or better. The person you can expect to go out and play bogey golf. They can keep the pace of play up, clearly can hit some shots and make some putts.

I would argue the "average" player is a high handicap player. I agree with the 5 category approach and would define as the following.

Beginner (less than 2 years exp.) = 20+
High-Handicap (Average) = 16-20
Mid-Handicap = 8-16
Low-Handicap = 4-8
Playa = < 4

From my experience having been as low as a 3. It was extremely hard to get from 5 to 3. It was actually pretty easy to get from 15 to 5. I can't even fathom getting to scratch or better. A 5 handicap player probably mishits 1 out of every 15-20 swings. The scratch or bettter player mishits 1 out of every 100 swings. The scratch or better player can play the same shot 4 different ways and see a similar result. The 5 handicap probably has 2 different plays, but is only really confident with 1. The scratch player RARELY misses inside 5 feet. The 5 handicap is probably 80-85%

This is how it was 10 years ago at least, perhaps equipment has changed how it is a bit.
post #28 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

20+ = high handicap
10-20 = mid handicap
1-10 = low handicap

i define myself squarely as a mid-handicap - my typical round is 12-15 over par. maybe every two dozen rounds, i'll have some kind of horrible blow-up round and break 90. about as often, i'll have a really good round and shoot something like 78.

of the people i personally have played with, there are only a handful that i can honestly say are better than me. and i'm not saying that like i think i'm good - i'm saying it a lot more with the idea of "everyone around here is just a weekend golfer, there simply AREN'T many good golfers." i can name three people off the top of my head who i know would beat me, and two others who would give me a run for my money. then i could name you a dozen or more that i'm totally confident i could stomp.
post #29 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by sosinsurr View Post
I understand that + is better than scratch...take a look at mine, I think I would know ;)

I was just asking why he thought a + would be "crazy ass" that's all...everyones got their opinion. I just look at my handicap and don't think "crazy ass", that's all :)
didnt' see your hdcp, very impressive. but you have to admit that 98% of golfers would say if you're a + you are 'crazy ass' (that term is getting more ridiculous every time i type it). I played with a bunch of + golfers growing up so it's relatively normal for me, but for people that aren't used to players going that low it's quite a shock to see a golfer make very few mistakes.

I hope to be a 'crazy ass' golfer sooner than later.
post #30 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by thedoxology View Post
but you have to admit that 98% of golfers would say if you're a + you are 'crazy ass' (that term is getting more ridiculous every time i type it).

I hope to be a 'crazy ass' golfer sooner than later.
I love this term. My new goal is to be a 'crazy ass' golfer!
post #31 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by TitleistWI View Post
High=20+
Mid=10-20
Low=under 10
IMO, someone is a "good" golfer if they can break 100 on a regular basis.
Your numbers are right on to me. People who consider low 80s players, not so good mystify me and are not in touch withe the mainstream skill levels in golf. 90 is actually a decent score on a regulation course of 6500 yards playing strict rules of golf. Few souls who have played or now play can do it once, much less regularly.
post #32 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Of course, it's all relative, but I would call a low handicapper someone who plays off less than 5. And by that I mean someone who plays under a handicap system where this means that they would virtually always break 80 and frequently shoot par and break par once every 7 or 8 rounds.
post #33 of 96

Re: how do "you" define high, low, mid handicap golfers?

Originally Posted by thedoxology View Post
didnt' see your hdcp, very impressive. but you have to admit that 98% of golfers would say if you're a + you are 'crazy ass' (that term is getting more ridiculous every time i type it). I played with a bunch of + golfers growing up so it's relatively normal for me, but for people that aren't used to players going that low it's quite a shock to see a golfer make very few mistakes.

I hope to be a 'crazy ass' golfer sooner than later.
Yeah its normal for me too cause I still grow up with + handicaps, that's why "crazy ass" seems so different to me
post #34 of 96

The Handicap Caste System

This is a pretty worthless post but I thought it might be an interesting discussion. You hear the terms, low, mid, and high handicapper all the time. What actual handicap numbers do you believe fall into these ranges?

To me:

Low Handicapper: Anything single digit or below.
Mid Handicapper: 10-19
High Handicapper: 20+

One thing I find interesting about that for say the Mid handicapper there's not a whole lot of difference between say a 10 and a 19. Both can generally strike the ball pretty well. The biggest difference seems to be with consistency and getting out of trouble.

However with a high handicapper, there's a huge difference between say a 20or 21 and a 36. When I was in the low 20's, I'd say I had good strikes with my driver about 60% of the time. A 36 handicap can have a perpetual slice with his driver and never hit it straight. It's almost as if we need a fourth category.

What do you think?
post #35 of 96
Thread Starter 

Re: The Handicap Caste System

I posted this same question a few months back. Here is the thread. There are some very interesting responses, and one in particular that explains why the number shouldn't nessariliy be used as the sole determining factor.

http://www.thesandtrap.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22531

post #16 from Clambake
Originally Posted by Clambake View Post
I'll try a slightly different take on the answers:

High Handicap - Missing most swing fundamentals, and doesn't understand much about the swing. Occasionally gets a par or a very rare birdie, but mostly just tries to get the ball around the course without too much trouble. Tough courses won't be much fun. Index is probably >25 or so

Mid Handicap - Has some decent fundamentals, but still has some fundamental flaws in swing that reach up and bite hard. Doesn't quite understand the swing enough, though, to diagnose those problems and fix on course. Gets a number of pars and knocks in the occasional birdie. Has a number of blow up holes each round, though. Can place their shots just enough that they're starting to see the course strategy, but not consistent enough to take advantage. Index range is pretty wide, probably about 5 or 6 up to 25.

Low Handicap - Pretty solid fundamentals, with only an occasional problem that causes a wild shot, but skilled enough to limit the damage and rarely more than one blow up hole if any. Understands a lot of the swing and can diagnose enough on course to keep things on track. Understands course management, and has just enough game to look strategically at shots and execute what is needed most of the time. Can play any course in the world and enjoy it for how the designer intended. Index is around a 0 to a 5 or 6.

Scary Good - Repeatable swing with predictable shot shape. Can shape shots as needed. So consistent that course strategy is the major factor between scoring well. Bad luck is probably the biggest contributor to having a bad hole due to a funny bounce. Score is probably influenced the most by the putter - some days they just don't go in and he shoots even par, while some days everything goes in and shoots a 66. Index is +.
post #36 of 96

Re: The Handicap Caste System

I certainly fall smack dab in the middle of the mid Handicapper discription. My only disagreement would be with the range. I'd say it's higher than a 5 or 6.
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