Handicap established at a substandard course?

I was playing at my home course this weekend with a friend and the question of the course's condition came up (as it usually does when people play there). It's the local muni and as the sterotype goes the course isn't in the best of condition. Naturally they make up for this with their price structure, it's the cheapest golf around. Truth be told the condition isn't terrible but it does have it's problems. Anyway most of the people who play the course just take it in stride and if they get a terrible lie in the middle of the fairway they move their ball to a more acceptable lie. I've never done this. The purest in me objects to taking license with such a fundamental rule of the game (playing the ball as it lies), but the conditions of the course have had an impact on my handicap. Another local course I like and plan on joining a couple of years in the future is much better maintained and much more representative of what one expects from a golf course. First this other course is much longer. The muni's longest tees measure right at 6000yds. The nicer one's at 7200yds+ (the whites there measure a little over 6300yds). The rating at my muni from the tips is 68.1 116 (par 71). The whites at the other are 70.5 126 (par 72). What I've come to notice is that I shoot similar scores between the two courses the differences in rating and slope not withstanding. That's annoying because I know my handicap would be 2 or 3 strokes lower if I played at this better course as opposed to the muni. Last Friday I played in a 4 man scramble at the nicer course and my game was on (no doubt the lack of pressure from the scramble format didn't hurt). I played with 2 high cappers and an 8, and the 8 and I did the majority of the work for our group. That's not to put the higher handicapped guys down, but that's just the way it worked out. By no means was my game equal to the 8's (and his handicap is generated at an insanely hard local private course and I asked him how he thought he'd fair at a "normal" course like the one we were playing the scramble at), but I was holding my own pretty well compared to him. That really got me wondering about how badly playing the muni is holding my game/handicap back? I've had people say this is a good thing because my handicap is higher as a result, but I don't play for money and I look to my handicap as an overall indicator of my game and use it and my stats as a means of improving and charting my progress. Another problem is that playing "muni" golf like this skews my skill set in one direction. You can't hit high wedge shots into the domed, hard, turtleback, postage stamp greens. Instead you play a lot of bump and run shots or play something that comes up short and then runs up and dies on the green. That's a game that doesn't translate well at today's more "target golf" oriented designs, not to mention more traditional designs like the nicer local course I was at last week. I realize this deficiency and endeavor to play a more rounded game at the muni inspite of the fact that many times I give up strokes because playing that way hurts me. The few times I've played other courses it becomes apparent that a bump and run from the fairway won't play, so I press on inspite of the higher scores I see at the muni. All this just worsens my handicap woes. This weekend a couple of times at the muni my friend was urging me to improve my lie, and I had to agree with his logic. Having just played a nice course a couple of days prior I knew there were no lies like that in the better fairways. No hardpan in the fairway, no clumps of weeds for my ball to nestle between in the fairway, nothing like that. So I'm wondering if I should do as most other people who play the muni do and improve my lie when conditions merit it? Obviously lies in the rough or off the fairway are to be taken as a given, but the ocassional lie in the fairway that is way below standard is something that can be improved to a more acceptable standard by improving your lie in a way that only improves the lie and not the line to the hole. Is this something I should be doing? Should I feel bad about doing it, or is this something that is actually necessary for my game to improve and be more representative of what I'd find at other "normal" courses?

One answer to this problem would be to bite the bullet and go ahead and join the nicer course, but I've got a really sweet deal at the muni that's pretty hard to ignore. I've got full membership privledges which includes unlimited range balls. The nicer course includes range balls too, but right now I get all this for no cash out of pocket. So I'd be going from no cash a month to $125 per month and a $500 initiation fee. As a golfer on a budget this is huge to me. My plan to wait a few years is based on my son getting a little older and finding out if he's still interested in golf. A family membership at the nicer course would be one way for me to maximize the dollar value I'd get from the better course, and waiting a couple of years means I get to bank my current monthly savings.

So what to do?

Golf is no different from any other hobby I've ever had.....that is that it's confined to a certain budget.

Unless I win the lottery, I suspect that will always be the case for me.

One of the reasons I joined somewhere was due to the fact that my son is continuing to show interest in the game and enjoys getting out on the course and playing. It would be cost prohibitive for me to pay full fees for both of us every time we played. A family membership makes this comfortable.


I commend your efforts to play the ball down. Imagine the average handicap if everyone did this.

I will roll mine around if I see that hitting the shot is going to damgage something...good example being rocks. If I'm playing with someone then I'll ask their opinion. If were playing for something then they can decide. If it's an unplayable lie, then so be it. I'm not intentionally damaging my gear or body to hit a shot. Either I move it couple of inches....take a penalty and drop to a safe spot....etc.

I think the biggest difference in playing nicer courses is the quality of the greens. A smooth roll is sublime. We were lucky enough to play The River last weekend.....wow...talk about a nice course. The conditions there beat anything I've played in a while. It does make a difference....in my opinion.

Agreed. Anyone who improves there lie and has a GHIN number is not smart. I do not want to falsify my handicap in anyway. I want it to truely represent my potential and that includes bad breaks.

I hear you. My home course is a 67.9/119 (9 hole w/ a couple different tees for the backside). Condition sounds hauntingly similar to yours. Many times when I've gotten to play better (harder = HCP/slope) courses I've actually found that I play pretty well because of what I feel are usually great lies in the fairway. That said, you're right about needing high wedge shot that I don't get to practice as much. On the flip side I've played with many lower HCP players at my home course who will bump the ball or complain that they're not playing well (or they should be doing better on this easy course). So going from bad/easy conditions to good/hard conditions seems to present a problem for many golfers. I just try to save up to play those better courses and try to savor the experience. Cheers

I too play a lot of muni's in the area that at times have some not-do-good conditions. There are a number of times I look at the lie I have gotten and think to myself "Tiger doesn't have to deal with this...", but play it as it lies anyway. The only time I don't is if there is something severe in the area that would probably be determined to be 'ground under repair' anyway. Examples are rocks on the course (especially in the fairway itself but not part of a harzard of any kind) or deep water runoff crevice (not by design, but caused by severe water runoff after extended rains, etc.) For the most part these are the only times I move my ball and that's just because I do not want to damage my club. Thin lies, wheel ruts and the like are part of the game (unfortunately).

Thanks for all the responses guys!

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I think you're all right. In fact on the better course my play at the muni hasn't held me back, so that supports the notion that it's not hurting my game. Obviously there's a bit of vanity involved with the handicap, but improvement is improvement even if it's on a substandard course. As to the propensity for the bump and run I think I'll continue to play a more rounded game inspite of some scoring dificulties. All in all that too becomes a means of improvement. If nothing else I should be able to deal with adverse lies!

Pkapp23,

If you are truely from the Cincinnati we are blessed with some great cheap public courses. I play the Vineyard, Blueash, Elks Run (not so cheap but the winter rate was great), Sharron Woods, and some others. I generally get good lies in the fairways there and the bunkers (vineyard and blueash) are great. Highly recommend if you like the tighter courses.

The quality of reasonably priced courses in this area is very good. My friends who have lived elsewhere always tell me how lucky we are in Cinci. Check out Stonelick Hills sometime. It's pricey, but also has great winter rates.

Most of the courses with so-so conditions are those such as California, Reeves, Neumann and some of the other highly played courses, especially in the early or late part of golf season (and Fairfield has been bad the last couple times).

I am going to be subbing in a league out there some this year. I played there years ago when it was new and wasn't impressed. But I heard all the issues are resolved. There are some really good courses in the KY too. I really like kenton county, Lassing pointe, and boone links.

I'm boycotting reading the OP till it's broken up into readable paragraphs

Ha!

Yeah that was kind of long and hard to read. Blame my old English profs who expected paragraphs of extrodinary lenght and content. The Clift notes version would read: "Spends far too many words complaining about his course."

I'd continue doing what you're doing. Peculiar lies and whatnot are actually fun to hit out of. If its with friends, sometimes I'll drop an extra ball on a 'nice' lie just to see the difference with the same swing.

On the other hand (unless its a tournament or cash game) I see nothing wrong with the good old foot wedge if your clubs or well being (or both) are in danger.

when i drive my girl to her classes i tend to kill time at a local muni before i have to pick her up... this course is an absolute dogtrack and there are spots where there are hardpan cement hard dirt mixed with a nice chunk of rocks... i refuse to damage my clubs on this crap... its basically like hitting off the cartpath... ive learned to bring my beat up 3i from my old set so i dont have to "pick up"...
my hcp is much better at courses that seem more difficult but the conditions are so much better

I play a 9 hole sometimes that is like that at times. But as was mentioned, its very cheap and still quite a nice course with challenging holes and beautiful scenery.

but, the 18 hole im a member at is one of the most beautiful courses ive seen, with 14 holes with a view of the saltwater bay. And not that much more than the 9.