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evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis - Page 2

post #19 of 71
2/13/10 at 3:36am

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Could you send out a "demo" analysis to show us what we'd be getting (and also demonstrate the proper camera positions, etc.)?
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post #20 of 71
2/13/10 at 4:05am
Thread Starter 

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Originally Posted by Alex B View Post
Could you send out a "demo" analysis to show us what we'd be getting (and also demonstrate the proper camera positions, etc.)?
Camera positions will be covered in an article (they're pretty basic - down the line, face on, from hip height... and down the line should be between the ball and the stance line - there you go) on the site, and I think we'll have an example video. That's a good suggestion. Perhaps someone here can supply a couple of good high-speed swings for analysis? Whaddya say? Anyone? PM me if you're interested.
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post #21 of 71
2/13/10 at 10:04am

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Looking forward to see how this works out. I would give you a video in 300fps, but all we have here now is snow...
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post #22 of 71
2/13/10 at 2:40pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

I have digital camera with limited video capabilities. With this be sufficient to get the job done?
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post #23 of 71
2/13/10 at 5:03pm
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Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Originally Posted by keb View Post
I have digital camera with limited video capabilities. With this be sufficient to get the job done?
In some ways we're limited by the quality of the video we receive, but even a basic 30 FPS video can reveal certain things about a swing, and that capability has existed for years and years. Your camera's probably better than you think - the key is just recording swings in as much light as possible to get a higher shutter speed.
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post #24 of 71
2/13/10 at 5:57pm
Thread Starter 

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Guys - we need a video pronto. If you want basically a free analysis - a $70 to $80 value - get in touch with me ASAP. If we have multiple choices, great. We'll choose the best one (and "best" may not just be image quality).
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post #25 of 71
2/14/10 at 4:02pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Thanks - we are all set with a video for an example analysis - we will have something posted as soon as I have it done and you will get a great idea how evolvr will work and what kind of analysis you can expect when you sign up!

Dave
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post #26 of 71
2/14/10 at 4:41pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Been doing some reading on fps. From what I've read, some video software and formats render the recorded video into fewer fps. For example, I've read that the AVI format only provides 15 fps. Some guidance on video software and video formats might be helpful. I've noticed that some video cameras only work with certain software, etc.
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post #27 of 71
2/14/10 at 6:00pm
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Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Originally Posted by uttexas View Post
For example, I've read that the AVI format only provides 15 fps.
That's not true. It may have been spec when the thing was first introduced, but FPS isn't hard coded into AVI like that. The first two AVIs on my computer were 23.98 (24p) and 60 FPS (59.97).

Originally Posted by uttexas View Post
Some guidance on video software and video formats might be helpful. I've noticed that some video cameras only work with certain software, etc.
I'm not sure what you mean... V1 can take pretty much anything. If a modern video camera shoots it, V1 can pretty much read it. And, worst case, QuickTime can read it and export it in a format V1 can read. We'll be able to take pretty much anything.
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post #28 of 71
2/14/10 at 6:13pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

I was wrong, been reading about FPS/video cameras etc for the past couple of hours. The best fps I can do with my camera (3 years old) is 320 X 240 at 60 fps.
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post #29 of 71
2/14/10 at 6:51pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

I'm wondering which is better. 512x384 @ 300FPS or 1920x1080 @ 60FPS.

Don't have any recordings at 60FPS, but I'll give it a try when the season arrives. 300 FPS sounds obvious, but most of the swing is not that fast, and we look most at body positions and club angles, which can be seen on a 60FPS too. The higher resolution makes details easier to see, but the higher fps shows you every part of the swing.

I think 512x384 works well enough. Good lighting is important to enhance the details. I've shot some videos of myself which are too dark and some in broad daylight. The latter gives much better results.
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post #30 of 71
2/14/10 at 6:58pm
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Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Originally Posted by Zeph View Post
I'm wondering which is better. 512x384 @ 300FPS or 1920x1080 @ 60FPS.
Part of the language from the site says:

- Get as high a frame rate as possible.
- Shoot video in as well lit an area as possible. If you're a silhouette, it'll be tough to see parts of your swing. Also, more light = faster shutter speed and less blurring.
- As long as the resolution is about 400 x 300 or more, it should be plenty. Always choose higher frame rates before higher resolution until you get near the 400 x 300 threshold.

Originally Posted by Zeph View Post
I think 512x384 works well enough. Good lighting is important to enhance the details. I've shot some videos of myself which are too dark and some in broad daylight. The latter gives much better results.
You would be right. 512 x 384 is good. What camera, btw? One of the Casios?
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post #31 of 71
2/14/10 at 10:15pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Yep, the Casio EX-F1. I wanted a DSLR camera, but didn't find the courage to buy one. Then I saw this article about the EX-F1, sporting the high frame rates, and I was sold, perfect for filming my swing. It is not a DSLR, but is comparable in picture quality to one. The video specs of course way better.
I used a Sony video camera before, but it only had 30 fps. It is interesting to see the positions of the club during the downswing. Here is where good lighting is important. With it, you can see the angle of the clubface all the way, angle of the hips, wrist, etc.

It got 432x192 @ 600 fps too, but the difference from 300 is not too big, so the extra resolution is better.
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post #32 of 71
2/14/10 at 11:56pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

just purchased a new kodak zx1 for under $90. The zx-1 is basically the sport version of the zi6. The only thing it doesn't have that the zi6 does-- macro mode (which you don't need for the golf swing)
The EX-F1 is an awesome camera--great for super slomo
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post #33 of 71
2/15/10 at 12:48am

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

I actually use the Casio EX-F1 for most of my instruction. I have the much smaller EX-FC100 as well and use it when I need something that doesn't take up a lot of space or want to shoot high speed indoors. Both are really great for golf (10 second timer delay is a nice feature when using high speed). I have used a Kodak from time to time as well and that did a very nice job with the 60 fps setting.

Dave
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post #34 of 71
2/16/10 at 4:46pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Just tying up a few details re: evolvr and the demo analysis. All else is ready to go and we should be live with evolvr today or tomorrow!

Dave
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post #35 of 71
2/16/10 at 5:05pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Originally Posted by iacas View Post
As long as the resolution is about 400 x 300 or more, it should be plenty. Always choose higher frame rates before higher resolution until you get near the 400 x 300 threshold.
Rats, I had the option to purchase a Sanyo Xacti HD1000 cheaply (£100) second hand which can do 300fps at 448 x 336 for 10 seconds but turned it down and yesterday shelled out for a ZX1 for the 60 fps after a thread a while ago where I asked a very similar question...

http://thesandtrap.com/forum/threads...ng-Check/page2
"For swing analysis, the detail of HD is fine and 60 FPS is also fine. 300 FPS can be overkill, and the clarity gained by 720p video more than offsets the gains of 300 FPS over 60"

I'm assuming although it isn't 300fps, the ZX1 will still be ok and more than good enough for this?
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post #36 of 71
2/16/10 at 5:24pm

Re: evolvr is Coming - Online Swing Analysis

Dave - Can you give me a range of what the SnT day clinics runs? I'd like to do either one of the full day clinics or evolvr and wanted to compare prices.

Thanks
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