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Gotta love the handicap system - Page 3

post #37 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 


I used to play match play with no strokes against 3 people quite a bit better than I was and I won as much money as I lost.

 

Of course I might have been something of an outlier because I always made as many birdies and eagles as they did (which won me plenty of holes)...but threw in many more bogies, double bogies, and triple bogeys than they did (which was no worse in that game than losing by a stroke on the hole).

 

They would have all blown me out of the water in stroke play.

 

No outlier at all.  That's exactly why using full handicaps is a problem with match play and most match play competitions will use some % of handicap. 

post #38 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourputt View Post

The thing is that your situation is opposite of Mules.  A bogey handicapper playing against 3 single digits should at least be able to hold his own, simply because he has more wiggle room for playing better than his cap than they do.  He may not win much, but he won't usually lose a lot either.  

When the situation is reversed, the low capper is at a severe disadvantage with three bogey golfers who could make par (net birdie) on any hole, while there is no way he is going to birdie very many holes for ties.  His chances of actually winning any holes approaches zero when battling 3 players who are each getting 10-12 strokes.  For those stroke holes, at least one of those bogey players is going to get a half just about every time the single digit makes birdie, and he can expect no better than a tie when he makes par.   When he makes bogey, he is virtually guaranteed to lose the hole.  If he doesn't get his wins on the heads up holes, he's going to be out of luck.

I get what you are saying which is why my point was that he should not be giving them anywhere near that many strokes.
post #39 of 43
For most of my clubs major competitions they use a three quarters handicap system. Kind of sucks for us true high cappers because losing 6 shots is a he'll of a bigger "handicap" for me than a 6 handicapper losing one or two shots!

The other thing is getting time to submit supplementary cards because I haven't played in a full qualifier yet this year because of the match play comp I've been in and the fact my course was under 6 foot of water for the best part if 3 months this winter!

Regards

Mailman
post #40 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctorfro View Post
 

Well, for the second year in a row, I played in our club's match play tournament only to run into a double digit handicapper who shot very close to par golf.  Coincidence?  Hmm? Think I'll stick to playing in non-handicap events. I'd rather lose straight up than to give strokes to guys who are just as good, if not better, than me.  

 

Exactly, I haven't played a tournament yet myself but I think I'd rather have virtually no chance of winning in stroke play than lose to some cheating douche in a handicapped event.

post #41 of 43
Thanks all, I'll try for everyone playing to 75% of there handicaps or at a minimum playing to the low handicap which would at least eliminate strokes on par 3's and the least difficult par 4's.
post #42 of 43
I'm playing in a 4BBB knock out comp at the moment and the handicap is worked out at 3/4 of the difference of the lowest hcp to everyone else!

Regards

Mailman
post #43 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by mules567 View Post

Thanks all, I'll try for everyone playing to 75% of there handicaps or at a minimum playing to the low handicap which would at least eliminate strokes on par 3's and the least difficult par 4's.

 

Wheeling off the low handicap is how the USGA system is supposed to work in a match format.  When the system isn't applied as recommended, then it can't be expected to work correctly.  No handicapping system is going to be perfect because all of us have a certain amount of variability in our play.  There are times when we will run into a buzz saw of a player who is having a lifetime round and that handicap system is never going to be able to make that even, nor should it.  When a player is playing his best, he should win, or at least have a chance to do so.  

 

Those who say they'd rather lose straight up than lose to a handicap really aren't really interested in actually competing.  If I went out and shot my lifetime best, yet still had no chance to win because I was playing in a group of scratch golfers, I'd certainly not be enjoying that round as much as I would if that lifetime best gross was adjusted for the competition to an even better net.  The gross score is still the same thing - it's still a lifetime best - but it is also a score which should be very competitive in any properly run handicap competition.  If the competition isn't run by a competent committee, then you take your chances.  I would be looking for a better run club or league.  

 

I was in a tournament club for 22 years, and we didn't tolerate players who manipulated their handicaps.  Our handicap committee was aware and quick to act when they detected anything unusual.  That made all of our competitions fair, flighted stroke play (flights were formed with a spread of 2 or 3 strokes and played at scratch within the flight) or match play (80% of course handicap wheeled off the low handicap).  When implemented correctly as recommended, the system works very well.

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