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The UFC/MMA/Etc. Thread - Page 12

post #199 of 247

Silva is actually considering a move down to the welterweight division since he doesn't see any "big" fights for him at middle weight and he doesn't want to fight JBJ are light heavyweight. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by clubchamp View Post

I like Hendo a lot and I really hope he wins but he will have to land the H Bomb in the first 3 rounds or he's getting submitted. I think if what Saores said is true it sounds like Silva wants only big pay fights so I'd assume that would be a sign that Silva has plans to retire in the next few years. 

post #200 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post

Silva is actually considering a move down to the welterweight division since he doesn't see any "big" fights for him at middle weight and he doesn't want to fight JBJ are light heavyweight. 

 

I could see that being an option.  He makes the cut to 185 very easily and GSP cuts from almost the same weight Anderson does.

 

I guess that's one way to force the fight with GSP since GSP is obviously scared to fight Anderson. Now that Anderson has fought Sonnen twice, he has no reservations on fighting the wrestling style of GSP.  Like I said before, Anderson would destroy GSP UNLESS....UNLESS, this fight takes too much longer to put together. 

 

Here is the thing.  If Anderson goes to WW to fight GSP, it's a win win for him.  And not so big of a deal for GSP.  Anderson cutting the weight would prove that he wants to challenge GSP.  If he were to lose, then the weight cut would be a huge factor.  If he were to win, he becomes no doubt the best P4P (already is in my eyes). Add his age to that and the fact that he is reaching the end of his career and that just makes it that much better.

 

If GSP wins...not so much a big deal any more because Anderson is older and already peaked out while GSP is just reaching his peak.  And the fact that Anderson had to cut weight to come to him.  If he loses, then that hurts his move to MW, loses him the title, and kills the best P4P talk.

 

Anderson is for sure the benefactor if he moves regardless of the outcome. Just my opinion obviously.  And I am a HUGE GSP fan as well.  The guy has a great attitude and work ethic.  This would be the biggest fight in the UFC in a LONG time

post #201 of 247

I agree, GSP vs Silva would be a superfight - probably a bigger PPV draw than the Brock Lesner fights.  GSP is a good striker, he just likes to get out of fights without too much damage.  Silva has a huge reach advantage which would put GSP in harms way of knees and elbows any time he went for a take down.  I hope it happens. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TN94z View Post

I could see that being an option.  He makes the cut to 185 very easily and GSP cuts from almost the same weight Anderson does.

 

I guess that's one way to force the fight with GSP since GSP is obviously scared to fight Anderson. Now that Anderson has fought Sonnen twice, he has no reservations on fighting the wrestling style of GSP.  Like I said before, Anderson would destroy GSP UNLESS....UNLESS, this fight takes too much longer to put together. 

 

Here is the thing.  If Anderson goes to WW to fight GSP, it's a win win for him.  And not so big of a deal for GSP.  Anderson cutting the weight would prove that he wants to challenge GSP.  If he were to lose, then the weight cut would be a huge factor.  If he were to win, he becomes no doubt the best P4P (already is in my eyes). Add his age to that and the fact that he is reaching the end of his career and that just makes it that much better.

 

If GSP wins...not so much a big deal any more because Anderson is older and already peaked out while GSP is just reaching his peak.  And the fact that Anderson had to cut weight to come to him.  If he loses, then that hurts his move to MW, loses him the title, and kills the best P4P talk.

 

Anderson is for sure the benefactor if he moves regardless of the outcome. Just my opinion obviously.  And I am a HUGE GSP fan as well.  The guy has a great attitude and work ethic.  This would be the biggest fight in the UFC in a LONG time

post #202 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post

I agree, GSP vs Silva would be a superfight - probably a bigger PPV draw than the Brock Lesner fights.  GSP is a good striker, he just likes to get out of fights without too much damage.  Silva has a huge reach advantage which would put GSP in harms way of knees and elbows any time he went for a take down.  I hope it happens. 


You know, I'm glad you said that about GSP.  He has all the tools to be so much better IMO (I know, where do I get off saying that while not being a UFC fighter).  I really believe that Matt Serra hurt GSP.  Every since, he just fights not to lose.  If he would just be more aggressive, he would have a ton more fans.  He seems to be working on it as he talks about working on his KO power and what not.  I hope he starts heading back to the aggressive fight finishing ways of his past.  He is very patient, so he may just be content with waiting until everything comes together.  IMO, he seems to be building himself into a MW fighter which is great.  He has yet to reach his peak,  Anderson fights to now attain too much damage too, but he is still 10 times more aggressive than GSP.

 

But yeah...that would be a rare PPV buy for me!

post #203 of 247

Looks like they canceled UFC 151. Henderson has a partial ligament tear in his knee, and the only person willing to fight John Jones on short notice is Chael Sonnen. Greg Jackson has advised Jones not to fight Sonnen, and Dana had to cancel the entire show... booo!

post #204 of 247

Bad move on Jones part imo.  While Sonnen doesn't deserve a title shot you don't tell Dana no, and force him to cancel an entire event.  At some point Jones will need a favor from Dana and he's going to be denied.  Sonnen / Jones would have generated plenty of PPV buys and allowed White to keep the event scheduled.  With Henderson out, not sure who Jones will face next since he's already stated he's not interested in Machida, Sonnen or Evans again and no one else is deserving. 

post #205 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post

Bad move on Jones part imo.  While Sonnen doesn't deserve a title shot you don't tell Dana no, and force him to cancel an entire event.  At some point Jones will need a favor from Dana and he's going to be denied.  Sonnen / Jones would have generated plenty of PPV buys and allowed White to keep the event scheduled.  With Henderson out, not sure who Jones will face next since he's already stated he's not interested in Machida, Sonnen or Evans again and no one else is deserving. 

I wouldn't fight Sonnen, he's to toughest guy you don't get credit for beating. Sonnen has a good chance to grind you down and get the victory, but if you beat him its like so what, you beat Chael. Your right though Dana is not to happy. He seems to hotter with Greg Jackson other then Bones Jones. I think they've already agreed on the next fight though, Jones vs Machida Sep, 22.

post #206 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo Slice View Post

I wouldn't fight Sonnen, he's to toughest guy you don't get credit for beating. Sonnen has a good chance to grind you down and get the victory, but if you beat him its like so what, you beat Chael. Your right though Dana is not to happy. He seems to hotter with Greg Jackson other then Bones Jones. I think they've already agreed on the next fight though, Jones vs Machida Sep, 22.

I agree Sonnen is tough and could grind Jones down but I would still probably have said Jones would win that fight. Unfortunately I now think very little of Jones and I've always hated Greg Jackson mainly because his fighters are only good for a nap. Dana has said multiple times that he hates how Jackson's fighters fight for rounds not wins but telling Jones not to take the fight just put it over the top. Machida Vs Jones is on for the 22nd but Dana pretty much made it clear if Jones turned down that fight he was gone and he also said that is was not in Jones best interest to turn down the Sonnen fight. Dana also said in the press conference that Jones is not liked by a lot of the other fighters and now he just cost some guys a pay check. I'm guessing IF Jones loses to Machida it will be a LONG time till he gets another chance to get the belt back.

post #207 of 247
Thread Starter 

One thing I really disappointed about is how Dana decided to openly blame Jones for the show's cancellation. 

 

We all know that Dana likes to swear. Fine, no bigs. But this just shows the worst lack of professionalism on Dana's part.

 

He's the one responsible for making the show happen, not Jones. It was definitely a bitch move by Jones, but he is entitled to it.

 

Jones came out looking like a wimp, but Dana came out looking like a spoiled little brat. Plus, he most likely lost the trust of his fighters. Now they all know Dana does not have their back.

post #208 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapanda View Post

One thing I really disappointed about is how Dana decided to openly blame Jones for the show's cancellation. 

 

We all know that Dana likes to swear. Fine, no bigs. But this just shows the worst lack of professionalism on Dana's part.

 

He's the one responsible for making the show happen, not Jones. It was definitely a bitch move by Jones, but he is entitled to it.

 

Jones came out looking like a wimp, but Dana came out looking like a spoiled little brat. Plus, he most likely lost the trust of his fighters. Now they all know Dana does not have their back.

Dana was relying too much on the title fight and should have had a decent co main event for this card. I don't really have a problem with Dana pinning it on Jones since he did find a suitable replacement that would have drew a lot of ppv buys. Jones turning that down is weak and he stands to lose some money because he won't get near the ppv buys with Belfort so his percentage will be a lot lower. I will say I think Jackson told Jones to say no to stick it Dana for all the negative things Dana has said about Jackson.

post #209 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by clubchamp View Post

Dana was relying too much on the title fight and should have had a decent co main event for this card. I don't really have a problem with Dana pinning it on Jones since he did find a suitable replacement that would have drew a lot of ppv buys. Jones turning that down is weak and he stands to lose some money because he won't get near the ppv buys with Belfort so his percentage will be a lot lower. I will say I think Jackson told Jones to say no to stick it Dana for all the negative things Dana has said about Jackson.

 

Even that being the case, Jones is not responsible for anything but his own performance in a fight. Making sure events happen is Dana's responsibility. If Dana wasn't able to get everyone on board, that's Dana's problem.

 

And I don't think men of business would be so petty as to reject a fight and cut off their own nose just to spite someone else.

post #210 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapanda View Post

 

Even that being the case, Jones is not responsible for anything but his own performance in a fight. Making sure events happen is Dana's responsibility. If Dana wasn't able to get everyone on board, that's Dana's problem.

 

And I don't think men of business would be so petty as to reject a fight and cut off their own nose just to spite someone else.

Did Dana not put the event together? Did he not find a suitable replacement on short notice? Dana did his job just fine and Jones is a fighter that didn't want to fight so I'd say Jones would be responsible. Maybe Jackson isn't being petty but why would you tell Jones not to fight Chael oh wait that's right Chael is too dangerous to take on short notice. It's probably Chaels one punch KO power oh wait he hasn't knocked anyone out in a long time, maybe it's Chaels size and reach advantage no that certainly isn't it, I got it Chaels superior wrestling which could be a factor but Jones is perfect on TDD and is a pretty solid wrestler himself. I like Chael but there was no reason for Jones to turn down that fight other than he is just being difficult. 

post #211 of 247

Maybe there should be a change in the contracts. The possible replacement for a title fight should be determined when the contract is written. The possible replacement should also train as if he is going to fight. You would have to agree on the possible replacement before you even signed the contract.

post #212 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by clubchamp View Post

Did Dana not put the event together? Did he not find a suitable replacement on short notice? Dana did his job just fine and Jones is a fighter that didn't want to fight so I'd say Jones would be responsible. Maybe Jackson isn't being petty but why would you tell Jones not to fight Chael oh wait that's right Chael is too dangerous to take on short notice. It's probably Chaels one punch KO power oh wait he hasn't knocked anyone out in a long time, maybe it's Chaels size and reach advantage no that certainly isn't it, I got it Chaels superior wrestling which could be a factor but Jones is perfect on TDD and is a pretty solid wrestler himself. I like Chael but there was no reason for Jones to turn down that fight other than he is just being difficult. 

Dana obviously did NOT put the event together... he cancelled it! I know what you're trying to say, but it doesn't hold. Putting the event together inherently means getting fighters willing to fight on board. He did not do that. Jones played his part, but ultimately Dana is responsible for it.

 

Don't take this as me saying that Jones decision was the best one. He shouldn't be blamed for what he is not responsible for, however. One tangible consequence of Dana's action is that his fighters (even if just Jones) will trust him less. On the other hand, I can't see what was particularly positive about his decision.

post #213 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo Slice View Post

Maybe there should be a change in the contracts. The possible replacement for a title fight should be determined when the contract is written. The possible replacement should also train as if he is going to fight. You would have to agree on the possible replacement before you even signed the contract.

 

They tend to always be training anyway, but in different cycles. It kind of messes things up unnecessarily if you're going to break your cycle just on the off chance that you are called to fight.

post #214 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapanda View Post

 

They tend to always be training anyway, but in different cycles. It kind of messes things up unnecessarily if you're going to break your cycle just on the off chance that you are called to fight.

I agree It would be strange for one fighter to hold a 6-8 week training camp in preparations for a fight, that he most likely will not be in. If the event doesn't happen, that could be the case for many other fighters that where on that card. Some of the fights will still happen and some wont, and if and when they do happen the timing is thrown off already. Having one predetermined guy train as a sub for the main event sounds like a good idea to me lol. It doesn't have to be the next in line for a shot but somebody a little lower down on the list that would still make an interesting fight. I would sure train for the small chance I might get a shot at the title. Give the alternate some incentive for taking the chance, like a desired opponent in his next fight if this one doesn't happen. You cant just cancel events, especially a pay per view. There needs to be an agreement on who the possible replacement/s might be weather he trains a full camp or not. Pay per view main events only.

 

Or make the complete card more sustainable, and worthy of pay per view, even if the main event doesn't happen. Is that possible, that might not be possible?

 

When Dana asked Chael if he would fight Jones on that date. He said he would fly down and fight him tomorrow lol.

post #215 of 247
Thread Starter 

Just on a simple matter of principle, blaming Jones for UFC 151 being cancelled was obviously wrong. But this article really drives the message home, within the context of fight promotion

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1311586-ufc-151-fallout-fighters-dont-cancel-entire-fight-cards-promoters-do

post #216 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapanda View Post

Just on a simple matter of principle, blaming Jones for UFC 151 being cancelled was obviously wrong. But this article really drives the message home, within the context of fight promotion

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1311586-ufc-151-fallout-fighters-dont-cancel-entire-fight-cards-promoters-do

I'm still not sure how you are seeing it as wrong? The promoter found a suitable replacement on short notice and the champion said no to the fight. The poor card falls on Dana but Jones not fighting falls on Jones which is what killed 151. The guy that wrote that article fails to realize that there is only so many big ppv draws so it's impossible for Dana to not have 2 or 3 cards a year that rely heavily on the main event. If anyone can give me one legitimate reason why Jones bailed on the fight with Sonnen I might see the point but until then it is Jones who cancelled 151. The other point that Jones defenders never seem to bring up is he is the first champion to ever turn down a fight with a replacement. So if you are Dana you found a replacement and based on history he had no reason to think Jones would say no to the fight. Basically every other time this happened the promoter fixed without a problem the one time the promoter couldn't fix it was because Jon Jones refused to fight.

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