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heavy clubs

post #1 of 30
Thread Starter 

are there any heavy sets of irons? iron shafts, stiff, RH, at least D3 swing weight, except the boccieri heavy irons

post #2 of 30

HEAVY? HA!  I make my own that are off the charts. I put a 3 ounce counter weight on my Ping SW scale and end up with F8 reference to match them to each other for SW (I forget the exact figures and the book with it written down is at least 8 feet from where I am sitting. Too far to reach.)

 

I have contact cemented 4 ounces on the back of some Irons (too heavy and ugly)

 

Now I use the pocket back irons. Not for the sales pitch more rearward center of gravity shtick but so I can pour melted lead (2 ounces) into them  and still have a pretty iron.  I can make these as little or as much swing weight as I want.  A tad of silicone caulk seals the deal. (Hogan Apex Edge)

 

Look into pocket back irons to make your own  They are not common and some fill the pocket with polymer, oddly just like they did on  Wilson Reflex irons of 1979-84.  I guess nothing really changes.

 

Of course there is the old faithful lead tape method that you could make ANY IRONS D3 very easy. You would need very little lead tape.

 

From my years of equipment minded golf I have learned that all clubs have basically the same SW as if they are scared to death to deviate but a tiny bit. I suggest a meaningless tiny deviation. D2 to D0 is as meaningless as a fly landing on a club and going for a ride.

post #3 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

HEAVY? HA!  I make my own that are off the charts. I put a 3 ounce counter weight on my Ping SW scale and end up with F8 reference to match them to each other for SW (I forget the exact figures and the book with it written down is at least 8 feet from where I am sitting. Too far to reach.)

I have contact cemented 4 ounces on the back of some Irons (too heavy and ugly)

Now I use the pocket back irons. Not for the sales pitch more rearward center of gravity shtick but so I can pour melted lead (2 ounces) into them  and still have a pretty iron.  I can make these as little or as much swing weight as I want.  A tad of silicone caulk seals the deal. (Hogan Apex Edge)

Look into pocket back irons to make your own  They are not common and some fill the pocket with polymer, oddly just like they did on  Wilson Reflex irons of 1979-84.  I guess nothing really changes.

Of course there is the old faithful lead tape method that you could make ANY IRONS D3 very easy. You would need very little lead tape.

From my years of equipment minded golf I have learned that all clubs have basically the same SW as if they are scared to death to deviate but a tiny bit. I suggest a meaningless tiny deviation. D2 to D0 is as meaningless as a fly landing on a club and going for a ride.


Why would you want a club that heavy?

Not picking, genuinely curious as to your reasoning.
post #4 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in FL View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

HEAVY? HA!  I make my own that are off the charts. I put a 3 ounce counter weight on my Ping SW scale and end up with F8 reference to match them to each other for SW (I forget the exact figures and the book with it written down is at least 8 feet from where I am sitting. Too far to reach.)

I have contact cemented 4 ounces on the back of some Irons (too heavy and ugly)

Now I use the pocket back irons. Not for the sales pitch more rearward center of gravity shtick but so I can pour melted lead (2 ounces) into them  and still have a pretty iron.  I can make these as little or as much swing weight as I want.  A tad of silicone caulk seals the deal. (Hogan Apex Edge)

Look into pocket back irons to make your own  They are not common and some fill the pocket with polymer, oddly just like they did on  Wilson Reflex irons of 1979-84.  I guess nothing really changes.

Of course there is the old faithful lead tape method that you could make ANY IRONS D3 very easy. You would need very little lead tape.

From my years of equipment minded golf I have learned that all clubs have basically the same SW as if they are scared to death to deviate but a tiny bit. I suggest a meaningless tiny deviation. D2 to D0 is as meaningless as a fly landing on a club and going for a ride.


Why would you want a club that heavy?

Not picking, genuinely curious as to your reasoning.

 

I bet those are real pretty though -  real pretty.

post #5 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in FL View Post


Why would you want a club that heavy?
Not picking, genuinely curious as to your reasoning.

Keep in mind that adding 2 ounces to a typical iron head represents only an increase in weight of about 20%  ( http://www.golfsmith.com/product/30076135/snake-eyes-python-xld2-iron-head )  A huge increase in the conformist golf community but not that outlandish when thought about

 

There are several reasons

I am tall

I am strong

A 16 ounce hammer is vastly superior to a 10 ounce hammer or a 20 ounce hammer for driving a 16 penny nail. Weight matters

I prefer a 3 1/2 inch paint brush over all others yet others refuse as it is too big  Personal preference matters.

I am open to the possibility that my senses are dull for delicate things and the weight allows feel. I do not handle ping pong balls well but could play with a golf ball all day and never drop it. natural abilities matter.

The weight allows me to feel the club head at the end of the back swing, and down swing.

The weight dampens the herky jerkys

The weight produces more consistent speed and resulting distances

The weight drives through the rough with little problem

There are probably many more.

 

I am actually thinking of trying a ladies steel shaft to get even more head feel during the swing. I have tried 4oz  or about a 40% increase but did not like it.

 

There is a reason why little girls are gymnasts. They match the action requirements. The requirements are not changed to match the physical abilities of the person. In golf we can match the equipment to the person. There is no reason why non standard people must try to conform to standard equipment.

 

And yes sean miller they "are real pretty though - real pretty"  Let me see, what was I saying about the conformist golf community.....  I wonder of Gene Sarazens newly invented sand wedge that he made  from soldering globs on  a wedge would be to gene millers visual approval? By the way he won the Brittish Open in 1932 using his not so pretty club.

post #6 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

Keep in mind that adding 2 ounces to a typical iron head represents only an increase in weight of about 20%  ( http://www.golfsmith.com/product/30076135/snake-eyes-python-xld2-iron-head )  A huge increase in the conformist golf community but not that outlandish when thought about

There are several reasons
I am tall
I am strong
A 16 ounce hammer is vastly superior to a 10 ounce hammer or a 20 ounce hammer for driving a 16 penny nail. Weight matters
I prefer a 3 1/2 inch paint brush over all others yet others refuse as it is too big  Personal preference matters.
I am open to the possibility that my senses are dull for delicate things and the weight allows feel. I do not handle ping pong balls well but could play with a golf ball all day and never drop it. natural abilities matter.
The weight allows me to feel the club head at the end of the back swing, and down swing.
The weight dampens the herky jerkys
The weight produces more consistent speed and resulting distances
The weight drives through the rough with little problem
There are probably many more.

I am actually thinking of trying a ladies steel shaft to get even more head feel during the swing. I have tried 4oz  or about a 40% increase but did not like it.

There is a reason why little girls are gymnasts. They match the action requirements. The requirements are not changed to match the physical abilities of the person. In golf we can match the equipment to the person. There is no reason why non standard people must try to conform to standard equipment.

And yes sean miller they "are real pretty though - real pretty"  Let me see, what was I saying about the conformist golf community.....  I wonder of Gene Sarazens newly invented sand wedge that he made  from soldering globs on  a wedge would be to gene millers visual approval? By the way he won the Brittish Open in 1932 using his not so pretty club.

Interesting.

Thks for the response.
post #7 of 30

I don't about all of Jon's reasons, but I've noticed in my relatively short time golfing that I really do better when I can feel the club head.  At 6'4" and 275 pounds, swinging a club with D0/D1 swing weight doesn't really feel like much at my swing speed.

post #8 of 30

I definitely need a heaver club, iron-wise. you can really feel like you're powering through when you're swinging.. and in my head, I feel like I just launch it like a boss.

 

Those light irons just feel so weak and cheap.

post #9 of 30

Heavy irons with a standard swing weight or regular weight irons with a light shaft and high swing weight? Whenever I pick up gear aimed at beginners it feels like the latter.

post #10 of 30

These clubs have really nice weight to it. Thor's hammer.

1000

post #11 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goonsidious View Post

These clubs have really nice weight to it. Thor's hammer.

1000

 

 

I've swung similar irons and they would certainly give one confidence to go after a ball in the rough.

post #12 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulle73 View Post

are there any heavy sets of irons? iron shafts, stiff, RH, at least D3 swing weight, except the boccieri heavy irons

Swingweight has very little to do with total weight.  2 grams added to the head of the club is one swingweight point. Total weight is what you are after and I haven't seen a better way to manipulate total weight and swingweight than TourLock/Opti Vibe weights.  The OV weights go down inside the shaft and can easily give 10-15 added swingweight points inserted at the right depth.  The the Tour Lock weights go at the butt end of the club and provide balance to the club. 

 

I used to play high level baseball and so I love heavy total weight and swingweight and this is the best way to add both. I have had the weights in my clubs for almost a year now and I can tell you that I will never play a set of golf clubs without them.  I believe that a golfer should swing the heaviest clubs that don't show a dramatic drop off in swinspeed.  I also feel that outside of the proper shaft flex that total weight is the second most import factor to a golf club.  If you don't feel the clubhead tracking around you then the club will be manipulated instead of allowed to track its preset arch toward the target.  Major League baseball players never swing the lightest bat....they swing the heaviest possible bat because they know that bat will not be as punishing when you miss the sweetspot and it will maximize the use of large muscle groups to generate speed and power.

post #13 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

HEAVY? HA!  I make my own that are off the charts. I put a 3 ounce counter weight on my Ping SW scale and end up with F8 reference to match them to each other for SW (I forget the exact figures and the book with it written down is at least 8 feet from where I am sitting. Too far to reach.)

 

I have contact cemented 4 ounces on the back of some Irons (too heavy and ugly)

 

Now I use the pocket back irons. Not for the sales pitch more rearward center of gravity shtick but so I can pour melted lead (2 ounces) into them  and still have a pretty iron.  I can make these as little or as much swing weight as I want.  A tad of silicone caulk seals the deal. (Hogan Apex Edge)

 

Look into pocket back irons to make your own  They are not common and some fill the pocket with polymer, oddly just like they did on  Wilson Reflex irons of 1979-84.  I guess nothing really changes.

 

Of course there is the old faithful lead tape method that you could make ANY IRONS D3 very easy. You would need very little lead tape.

 

From my years of equipment minded golf I have learned that all clubs have basically the same SW as if they are scared to death to deviate but a tiny bit. I suggest a meaningless tiny deviation. D2 to D0 is as meaningless as a fly landing on a club and going for a ride.

I am definately tracking with you on this for sure because my irons are in the F8 swingweight range. I have 75 gram internal weights in the shafts with 40 gram counterweights in the butt end. I also have a few grams of tungsten powder down the shaft near the clubhead and they are almost perfect. 

 

Other than lead tape is there any other way to get weight in the toe of the clubs(I'm talkin like 15 grams and not be noticeable from address?)  I know that James Patrick does a tungsten application but I can't seem to get on the list to have him work on my clubs.  Tungsten plugs in the toe are the same thing that Ping does and the toe of the club is what I feel for when I am swinging the club so I want to magnify it a bit but I can't come up with any way to get enough weight in the toe to satisfy me.  Do you know of any other method? I am desperate for a solution.  Pings just don't feel as good as Miura's at impact so switching irons isn't an option. 

post #14 of 30

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Righty to Lefty View Post

I am definately tracking with you on this for sure because my irons are in the F8 swingweight range. I have 75 gram internal weights in the shafts with 40 gram counterweights in the butt end. I also have a few grams of tungsten powder down the shaft near the clubhead and they are almost perfect. 

 

Other than lead tape is there any other way to get weight in the toe of the clubs(I'm talkin like 15 grams and not be noticeable from address?)  I know that James Patrick does a tungsten application but I can't seem to get on the list to have him work on my clubs.  Tungsten plugs in the toe are the same thing that Ping does and the toe of the club is what I feel for when I am swinging the club so I want to magnify it a bit but I can't come up with any way to get enough weight in the toe to satisfy me.  Do you know of any other method? I am desperate for a solution.  Pings just don't feel as good as Miura's at impact so switching irons isn't an option. 

 

 I don't know the design of your clubs, blade or cavity. I also take note of the dislike of lead tape so I say this thinking it is really  unacceptable.  Stick on wheel weights.  You can get substantial weight via glue/stick on wheel weights. (Auto parts store) If nothing else to determine that you have solved or not solve the issue and work out how much weight.  I have also been frustrated but that nose dived when I discovered Hogan Apex Edge. The pocket allows me to pour in lead and distribute it as I see fit. Clear silicon caulk seals it.  I have seen some irons lately that are hollow. I bet I could drill a hole fill with lead and reseal. My Hogans are just fine and prevent me from going down that path right now. In the future when these are cheaper on the used market I may try experiments with these hollow variations.

 

1000

1000


Edited by Jon Robert - 8/4/12 at 11:50am
post #15 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

 

 I don't know the design of your clubs, blade or cavity. I also take note of the dislike of lead tape so I say this thinking it is really  unacceptable.  Stick on wheel weights.  You can get substantial weight via glue/stick on wheel weights. (Auto parts store) If nothing else to determine that you have solved or not solve the issue and work out how much weight.  I have also been frustrated but that nose dived when I discovered Hogan Apex Edge. The pocket allows me to pour in lead and distribute it as I see fit. Clear silicon caulk seals it.  I have seen some irons lately that are hollow. I bet I could drill a hole fill with lead and reseal. My Hogans are just fine and prevent me from going down that path right now. In the future when these are cheaper on the used market I may try experiments with these hollow variations.

 

1000

1000

I play the Miura Left handed Cavity backs and I'll try and post a pic of one  but it is the only cavity back offered in Lefty.  I never thought of the wheel weights to find out what weight that I will need but thanks bigtime for that suggestion.  Most people never every mention the total weight of their clubs and I find it to be so so important. I'm much stronger than any female golfer but there isn't much of a difference in our off the rack golf clubs aside of shaft flex and grip size.  If we were gonna play baseball though I bet he bat that I pick up and she picks up to swing are way way different but golfer's never pay any attention to total weight  or even heavier swingweights for that matter. I must be aware of the clubhead tracking around me or my swing goes down the drain.  Thanks again for the wheel weight suggestion. 

 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRep7QwM9xuA9IGo3TVn0JuGz5j7jn7Tmtjq80a5iwPRFESpgdR-3Uf-0DJbw

post #16 of 30
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Robert View Post

 

 I don't know the design of your clubs, blade or cavity. I also take note of the dislike of lead tape so I say this thinking it is really  unacceptable.  Stick on wheel weights.  You can get substantial weight via glue/stick on wheel weights. (Auto parts store) If nothing else to determine that you have solved or not solve the issue and work out how much weight.  I have also been frustrated but that nose dived when I discovered Hogan Apex Edge. The pocket allows me to pour in lead and distribute it as I see fit. Clear silicon caulk seals it.  I have seen some irons lately that are hollow. I bet I could drill a hole fill with lead and reseal. My Hogans are just fine and prevent me from going down that path right now. In the future when these are cheaper on the used market I may try experiments with these hollow variations.

 

1000

1000

how do you add weight to the back of the club? can you explain it in detail?

post #17 of 30

The 2 club pictures show clubs with hollow pocket design. I have never actually seen inside the Taylormande but it may be space free of plastic, rubber etc.

 

1) I place the club in a vise making sure the scoring lines are level to a spirit level. (level to gravity and not the vice)  another person may want to tilt it one way or another so the liquid lead will favor the toe or heal. Mine is level. 

2) I take a  scale of some sort to weigh out the lead. I am using 2 ounces and this will fill the club pocket about 1/3 full thus it stands to reason that if I filled the Hogan Apex Edge full I would have added about 6 ounces. (I did do that but it was too much) Obviously the more accurate the scale the more perfect the result but a cheap small 1# kitchen scale will work

I have collected lead over the years from plumbing sewer pipes, wheel weights etc.

3) I have an actual lead ladle but a metal kitchen ladle can suffice. I use an ordinary propane torch that is sold in every store. I melt the lead and then move the flame under the ladle to keep it molten as I pour.

4) I pour in the lead, turn off the torch set aside and about that time the lead has solidified. I remove from the vice and dunk it in water. I cool it so any heat does not soften the epoxy holding the head to shaft.

5) Dry it out with a hair dryer or whatever. I place clear silicon caulk in the remaining 2/3 of the pocket and smooth with my finger and let dry.  You would never notice the weighting unless looking carefully.

The entire process takes about 5-10 minutes per club. But a first timer should take their time as there is no reason to rush anything except the heating pouring combination.

 

I have removed the lead to experiment several times. I use a drill and bit to drill holes in the lead at an angle that is allowed to do it.. This provides reliefs and voids to allow movement when I pry the lead out with a narrow screw driver.

 

For flat back clubs I have contact cemented lead to the back. The contact cement is a bear to remove if removing the lead. I have tried to burn it off and high speed wire wheel it off. I learned to soak them overnight with GOOP waterless hand cleaner globbed on the cement. The cement softens into yuck and then wipes off.  I don't remember now 15 years later but I think I glued about 6 or 8 ounces to the backs to experiment.

post #18 of 30

If you remove wheel weights forever try GOOP waterless handcleaner globs to soak overnight to remove evidence of glue.

 

note:  OBVIOUSLY MOLTEN LEAD AT HUNDREDS OF DEGREES REQUIERES SAFETY GLASSES / PROCEEDURES.

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