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Is the Golf Equipment Business one big scam? - Page 2

post #19 of 108

Its called, "marketing" and every company in the world does it.  TM does seem to be the worst about bragging up their new products and claiming that every year they have forever changed the game of golf.

post #20 of 108

Call it what you want through your own rose or dark colored glasses.

 

The fact is that manufacturers are making easier, lower spin, and higher launching drivers offering more forgiveness. If you don't need or want those attributes and your swing hasn't changed, don't be a "hater" -  stick with the stick that what works for you.

 

Look at 2013 - more slots for  added forgiveness on off center hits (higher ball speed), a bit more ballspeed on center hits, COG that is lower yet more forward for higher launch and less spin, more shafts that are authentic aftermarket shafts, 57-67 g shafts, adjustable lofts of 4 degrees or more (?) as studies indicate too many golfers choose insufficient loft. This gives a golfer a chance to soothe his ego and say "I can still use a 10.5 "loft" driver!" while having it cranked up to their ideal of a more upright lie angle at 12.5 degrees (lol!).

 

If you don't want it, don't buy it. Personally, I suspect if you're saying "it's a scam!" I think you're trying to justify not putting down 3 to 4 bills for that new driver. I don't like that lack of authenticity. Just say, "It's not worth it to me. My driver fits me almost perfectly."


Ya' see, it's that "almost" that has you thinking, "If I had that new driver..."

 

a2_wink.gif

post #21 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by delav View Post

 

Valid point, but ironically enough, I can't believe you're playing a driver from 1998!  

Lol, good observation and I wish I could say that I have resisted temptation but that has more to do with taking 10 years off from golf than anything. I bought it new when it was the "biggest" and best driver on the market and I hit it well all year this year when I started playing regularly again so it stays in the bag. I have hit new drivers and the extra 5-10 yards I get is not worth the price of a new driver plus 150 yards and in is what I need to work on to improve my scores.

post #22 of 108

I think it is a good thing for people who want to get good deals on mainstream or name brand equipment. As long as you do not have to have the latest model, you can just wait and buy something that is still factory new but has been out for a year or two and it will be way less in price than it was originally. They have to do that in order to make way for the newer models, so as long as they keep pushing new equipment every year, they have to blowout what is left over from the latest and greatest of last year or the year before. 

post #23 of 108

I think it is great if you are willing to be patient and love trying different equipment.  It is similar to cell phones and computers.  When I was first searching for an android phone I read and researched them all.  I quickly realized that you have to just jump in on what you like and what technology is available today that you can live with for a few years.  There will ALWAYS be something coming out that is marketed as better.  For example I just recently sold my RAC irons that are considered old.  I will now jump into newer technology and either get a set of PING or Taylormade irons.  I can get the Ping G20s brand new much cheaper now that the G25s have been announced.  Just like you can get an Iphone 4 or Samsung Galaxy s3 reasonably priced that still pack all the technology you will need for a while.  I do think it would be silly to buy new irons every year, but it is nice to know whenever you are ready there will always be choices.  

post #24 of 108

About 2008 I was moving from stiff shafts back to regular, and I ended up replacing everything except my putter. I tried out recent and new iron models from the major OEMs, and it seems like an iron was a production model for about two seasons. Now, it seems you get new models or tweaks on the previous model after about one year.

 

Callaway had a stable iron year back in 2007....

  • X20, X20 Tour, X Forged, Big Bertha

 

In 2012, things got wild...

  • In the men's lines, Callaway has 7 iron models in production.
post #25 of 108

Despite having a low index I'm a real newb when it comes to all the latest equipment specs and such, I have co workers that are high cappers that are absolute almanacs when it comes to what the latest new advancement or breakthrough in golf clubs there is, it really is an awkward discussion cause they know I just wipe them out everytime on the course with my mix and match set and they just don't seem to ever understand you have to swing the darn clubs right in order to get the performance out of them, it's almost like they think new clubs come preloaded with great swings in them already.As far as club manufacturers scamming the public?? I have to say some of the statements and claims these companies make to sell new clubs are definitely promoting their product beyond reasonable return to the customer but how many times do we hear it's how the club is wielded that determines if it really helps the player or not. I also enjoy purchasing these outdated clubs at 25% the original price after the sheen has faded by 2 years in a garage.a2_wink.gif

post #26 of 108

I said it isn't a scam but I have to share this FB post from TayloMade.  Note that it says "better players".  The 17 yards further claim from last years RBZ fairway was with 150mph ball speed, most people don't come close to that with a fairway wood.  The 150 mph is actually written in the fine print.  Anyway here's the post, you can now hit your fairway wood 27 yards further LOL

 

 

1000

post #27 of 108

I think this is a little off topic from the OP's question but,

 

I like shinny new golf equipment as much as the next guy, but assuming your clubs are fitted.....if you want more yards, hit it straighter, etc.  the average golfer would probably get better results spending the $300 on lessons.

 

We have a club demo day at our club every year.  People line up whaling away at the latest stuff.  They nail a couple in a row and the next thing you know they're spending $300 dollars, sometimes more, on a new driver.  I play with them a couple of weeks later, the newness has worn off, and it's the same swing with the ball doing the same things it did with the old driver.

 

I'm not trying to down play technology or equipment, it definitely can help, and you do need to be properly fitted, but when talking about improving your game, I don't think the most bang for your buck will be found in a golf store....especially at today's prices.

post #28 of 108

Hey, without all of that expensive R&D we never would have found out that white clubheads hit the ball better than clubheads of other colors.
 

post #29 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dormie1360 View Post

I think this is a little off topic from the OP's question but,

 

I like shinny new golf equipment as much as the next guy, but assuming your clubs are fitted.....if you want more yards, hit it straighter, etc.  the average golfer would probably get better results spending the $300 on lessons.

 

We have a club demo day at our club every year.  People line up whaling away at the latest stuff.  They nail a couple in a row and the next thing you know they're spending $300 dollars, sometimes more, on a new driver.  I play with them a couple of weeks later, the newness has worn off, and it's the same swing with the ball doing the same things it did with the old driver.

 

I'm not trying to down play technology or equipment, it definitely can help, and you do need to be properly fitted, but when talking about improving your game, I don't think the most bang for your buck will be found in a golf store....especially at today's prices.

I'm not so sure there is a scam going on. They are delivering newer technology every year (or 4 months in the case with TM). Although it idoes seem a bit ridiculous.

 

 But, I agree with the lessons. Earlier this winter I decided to try something this coming year. Everytime I have the urge to buy a new club, I am putting that money into a lesson account. Everytime I get enough for a lesson, I take one. Something tells me that I will enjoy my old clubs much more by the end of next summer. I may even find that "17 yards" with my old stuff.

post #30 of 108

The word "scam" replies a fraudulent deal. How so?

 

Yet, I do understand where R Martin of OP is coming from and here is why.  About 5 months ago, after being off for 1.5 years of playing golf, I went to see if I could use current technology to enhance my game. After about 30 minutes of testing various drivers from different companies on their launch monitor (not Trackman or Flight Scope), the tech/sales person shrug his shoulders and gave back my driver and said "there isn't much performance difference between yours and new clubs, so just keep it but change the grip." My driver is Tour Burner TP, 10.5* with Diamana 65 I think I got it in 2008. So, I thanked him and kept playing my driver, still. The point is that if you do not test and compare resulting difference in value, why should you change? Unless the golf companies have purposely mislead you into buying their product, then it would be a scam.

 

Author of "Can't Buy My Love" Jill Kilbourne offers nothing less than a new understanding of a ubiquitous phenomenon in our culture. The average American is exposed to over 3,000 advertisements a day and watches three years' worth of television ads over the course of a lifetime. Kilbourne paints a gripping portrait of how this barrage of advertising drastically affects us. So, the golf industry and others know that the marketing plays huge role in our purchases and the companies use it to their advantage to produce profit.

As far as comparing the golf clubs to Smart phones, computers and automobiles are not whole correct, IMHO. There exists rules and guidelines set by USGA and R&A to limit and curtail the technology enhancements to serve the best interests in golf, no? Whereas electronic and auto technologies have different rules and governance hence it grows safer, faster and is BIG differences in each new model per se.
 

So, this brings me back to the question I posted on FB Sandtrap: Has golf driver technology reached its limits?

post #31 of 108

It reminds me of the man who heard that a gizmo would save 25% of the fuel his car used, so he bought four.

post #32 of 108

I think that separating the 'real' improvements in club design from the 'fake' ones is tricky, and ultimately comes down to opinion. If you think it works for you, then it's already working before you even hit the ball.

 

Personally, I game a 20 yr old 3 wood that I hit farther than my son's modern 3w, old school blades (with just moderate modern sole architecture), blade putter, and a modern driver. I think the driver is the club where the most significant changes have been made.

post #33 of 108

OEMs and Marketing.

 

Some of it is hype; Other claims are real.

 

IOW, they have made improvements but whether you see them depends on you as a golfer.

 

As to hype, TM claims it now has a 1.8 mm thick face -- which is very thin. I took a look at an article I wrote on Jesse Ortiz at Bobby Jones Golf - he had 1.8 mm faces on his clubs ... 5 years ago!

 

Jesse now has face thickness at 1.4 mm on several of his clubs using brazing on fairways and hybrids and cup faces on the drivers. TM is technologically behind, in some aspects only, a small manufacturer who has some great ideas. Maybe TM doesn't want a thin face due to potential warranty issues ... I don't know. Tour Edge, Callaway, and Adams have used or once used cup faces for several years. Callaway has moved away from forged composite in their new drivers, as did Ortiz at Bobby Jones - they've gone to all titanium.

 

The Major OEMs make their hype sound as if they are beyond everyone else. But in several cases, they are merely playing catch up... and in other cases, their advances are not advances, and they have changed.

post #34 of 108

I don't understand why we get upset about Marketing, but we do.  It is their business to sell us clubs.  If you think about it from their side, they have to come up with a way to get us to buy new clubs when our old clubs could last 30 years.  They could not survive on new users alone.  They make the clubs to last, except the grips.  So the only way to get us to buy is to come up with improvements.  It is this way in most businesses where the product is not disposable or consumed.

 

Marketing folks will take certain, ah, liberties with information.  But most of the folks on this site are educated golf consumers and can tell what is hype and what it real.  If not, then they can ask here and get answers from someone who has experience with the item or information. 

 

I try not to buy new equipment to keep the costs down and will get previous models that performed well.

post #35 of 108

Yeah, I have never bought new upper eschelon equipment, ever. I go for new but discontinued equipment from the 'overlooked' manufacturers, and I have probably saved thousands over the years. $899 for a set of irons IMO is absolutely absurd.

post #36 of 108

People get upset with marketing because they always dangle the carrot promising it's the biggest and tastiest only to replace it after you buy it with a bigger and tastier carrot. 

 

People talk about investing in cars, electronics and golf equipment, which in itself is a fallacy.  The car you're driving (unless it's a classic) is far from an investment, it will likely never be worth more than you paid for it, same with that LED or Plasma 70" big screen and that shiny new TM driver.   When people buy items like this and refer to it as an investment, it implies they expect some payback on it, and when that doesn't happen, they resent those that led them to believe it would. 

 

Applying common sense to marketing takes great restraint as we all want a driver that hits the ball 15 yards longer.  Common sense would tell us that if the marketing was correct we'd all drive the ball 500 yards.  Despite that, we still get excited when the sales guy in the golf store tells us the simulator is reporting we're hitting the new driver longer than our old one. 

 

Unrelated to golf:  I bought my son new basketball shoes at the mall yesterday, he was convinced with these new shoes he'd run faster and jump higher than he could in his old ones.  At some point he'll realize he isn't jumping any higher or running any faster but by that point there will be a new pair he wants.  He's already a victim of marketing and just doesn't know it. 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post

I don't understand why we get upset about Marketing, but we do.  It is their business to sell us clubs.  If you think about it from their side, they have to come up with a way to get us to buy new clubs when our old clubs could last 30 years.  They could not survive on new users alone.  They make the clubs to last, except the grips.  So the only way to get us to buy is to come up with improvements.  It is this way in most businesses where the product is not disposable or consumed.

 

Marketing folks will take certain, ah, liberties with information.  But most of the folks on this site are educated golf consumers and can tell what is hype and what it real.  If not, then they can ask here and get answers from someone who has experience with the item or information. 

 

I try not to buy new equipment to keep the costs down and will get previous models that performed well.

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