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Masters Bush League Bullying - Everything I hate about Augusta - Page 8

post #127 of 161

To equate driving slightly over the speed limit to slow play in golf is absurd. Golf is a game which requires a strict adherence to the rules. Would you go over the speed limit if cops were actually pulling people over for going just slightly over the speed limit, instead of there customary 10+ mph over? You see your non adherence to the speed limit is due to the fact you know cops will let you go a certain amount over with out being pulled over. There is no such thing in golf, it is 100% enforced. They gave this kid multiple warnings, and he didn't adjust, so he broked the rules and he got hit with a penalty. 

post #128 of 161

I was at the Monday practice round. He was with Tiger and was very slow during his practice round. Tiger waited for him to finish with his arms crossed on the 10th green before they walked to the 11th tee. I wasn't suprised when I heard about the penalty.

post #129 of 161

its a little absurd to expect that the rules of golf on the PGA tour should be applied differently to a competitor because of his age and/or ethnicity. Kobe Bryant was a teenager when he entered the NBA, imagine the refs bending the rules for him... allowing double dribbles, 10 second half court rule instead of 8... that wouldn't make any sense. Same applies to 14 year old here. 

post #130 of 161

I don't know why this is still an issue. It has been explained ad infinitum and the kid deserved the penalty according to the rules.

 

Now, the ruling on Tiger, that's an issue of a different stripe.e5_innocent.gif

post #131 of 161
Thread Starter 
Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.
post #132 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

You are vindicated, my friend.

----------
 

 

Jack Nicklaus believes that Tiger Woods got the proper ruling at the Masters.

 

On the other hand, he says that hundreds of other players should get slow-play penalties if 14-year-old Chinese phenom Guan Tianlang did.

 

Nicklaus spoke to those and manyother golf-related topics Wednesday at a luncheon celebrating his support and that of his Memorial Tournament for Nationwide Children's Hospital. The event took place at Ohio State's student union, just a block or so from where his father's drugstore used to be and across the street from where Nicklaus lived as a kid.

 

The winner of 18 major professional championships also addressed anchored putters and the upcoming Memorial Tournament and Presidents Cup, both to be played at the Nicklaus-designed Muirfield Village.

post #133 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

First words out of my mouth when I came in the room and my son said Guan got a penalty for slow play were "that's ridiculous". Then as I heard more accounts of exactly how slow he was and how many times he was warned I changed my mind to being more surprised that a guy that young wouldn't do everything possible to speed up after being warned.

 

Jack was the inventor of slow play (hyperbole but not much).

 

Jack has huge business interests in China.

http://www.worldpropertychannel.com/featured-columnists/luxury-living-column-jack-nicklaus-pasadera-country-club-finergy-capital-muirfield-village-the-bears-club-white-lodging-hyatt-place-host-hotels-resorts-5794.php

 

So if he were the judge and the decision was on trial he would have to recuse himself from the case.

post #134 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post

You are vindicated, my friend.

----------
 

 

Jack Nicklaus believes that Tiger Woods got the proper ruling at the Masters.

 

On the other hand, he says that hundreds of other players should get slow-play penalties if 14-year-old Chinese phenom Guan Tianlang did.

 

Nicklaus spoke to those and manyother golf-related topics Wednesday at a luncheon celebrating his support and that of his Memorial Tournament for Nationwide Children's Hospital. The event took place at Ohio State's student union, just a block or so from where his father's drugstore used to be and across the street from where Nicklaus lived as a kid.

 

The winner of 18 major professional championships also addressed anchored putters and the upcoming Memorial Tournament and Presidents Cup, both to be played at the Nicklaus-designed Muirfield Village.

I don't see the word "ridiculous" anywhere in the article.  What he said was, others, including Guan should be penalized for slow play and that I agree with.  Jack is in the golf business so his comments all seem very politically correct these days.   Guan is China's bright golf star, Jack's working with China on some golf projects, makes sense. 

post #135 of 161
Reading through this thread I was under the impression that the word was, "rediculous".
post #136 of 161

To those who think that the slow play penalty was wrong - you are all wrong.  Now let me clarify that.  The penalty was correctly applied because Guan (and only he) was in violation of the tournament's pace of play policy.    The question I have to pose would be:  Is the pace of play policy for the Master's, and for the PGA Tour in general, too lenient?

 

I think that it is.  This is one part of the process in which the tournament committee is given a lot of flexibility.  They can set just about any reasonable requirements for pace and for penalty structure (can be graduated from warning, to one stroke, then two strokes).  I feel that it needs to be tightened up with less wiggle room.  If the lead group is out of position by even a couple of minutes they need an immediate warning AND they need to be required to pick up the pace to get back on time.  Then the policy needs to address both position for overall time and position with respect to the group in front of you.  And the policy needs to be very rigid, and strictly enforced.  If my Mens Club could devise a policy to keep a round to 4½ or less for a field of 144 players of abilities from scratch to 36 handicap, all playing in groups of four, then the Tour certainly ought to be able to do it with threesomes and pairs, all of excellent skill.

 

I really believe that a large part of the problem is the amount of money they play for.  When each stroke can add to or subtract from $5000 to $100,000 to the paycheck, then they start over-analyzing each stroke and play starts to drag.  They are no longer playing golf, no longer playing for a score, they are playing for a paycheck and the game's principles become secondary.  They need an incentive to inspire them to get off the snail pace.  A stiff pace of play policy which directly attacks that paycheck might help to get them back on track with playing golf.  One free warning, then one stroke, then two strokes, no debate, no argument.  When there is a realistic threat of losing up to 3 strokes, then you are hitting them where they live, and it's going to actually make an impression. 

post #137 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post

You are vindicated, my friend.

----------
 

 

So Jack Nicklaus is now the expert on slow play penalties? I guess we moved on from Azinger? Funny you picked Nicklaus to back your stance, he wasn't exactly known for running around the golf course either. Perhaps if you would like to find more "experts" to back your position you should get some quotes from other speedy players like Kevin Na or Ben Crane? Or maybe you can interview the players on this list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post

 

I don't see the word "ridiculous" anywhere in the article.  What he said was, others, including Guan should be penalized for slow play and that I agree with.  Jack is in the golf business so his comments all seem very politically correct these days.   Guan is China's bright golf star, Jack's working with China on some golf projects, makes sense. 

 

I, as well, did not find the word ridiculous in that story one time? In fact, his statement saying hundreds of other players deserve slow play penalties is the absolute truth. Unfortunately, the rules are so lenient on the snails on the PGA Tour that that's not going to happen. In fact, its so hard to receive a slow play penalty that ought to show the fact that this kid did deserve what he got. But unfortunately there are people out there that think that the rules should not apply to everyone.

post #138 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

Fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is allowed to be wrong.
post #139 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post


Fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is allowed to be wrong.

 

Being the winner of18 major championships does come with its benefits. a2_wink.gif

post #140 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by chico713 View Post

Jack Nicklaus said today that the Guan slow play ruling was ridiculous. All you rules experts who defended it may be right, but you're also ridiculous. Sorry. Ridiculous.

Fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is allowed to be wrong.


another fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time and what he says carries a lot of weight in the golfing world.

post #141 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post

Fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is allowed to be wrong.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post

another fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time and what he says carries a lot of weight in the golfing world.

I didn't see Jamo's post until I clicked into this thread, but it was basically exactly what I was going to say (so pause to go give Jamo a thumbs-up ...).

 

Rick, you're not wrong.  Many people will take Jack's word for gospel over the given facts.

 

The kid was warned, warned again, warned again, warned again, and I think even warned again, prior to his penalty.  If that isn't fair, then I don't know what is.

post #142 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post


another fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time and what he says carries a lot of weight in the golfing world.

Benefit of the doubt? Sure. But unquestionable correctness? Nope.

Just because Jack says something does not make it necessarily so.
post #143 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post

another fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time and what he says carries a lot of weight in the golfing world.

 

Particularly with those who are too lazy or ignorant to look into the facts of the matter.

 

Can you say with certainty Jack knew the circumstances (all the warnings, never catching up, etc.) behind the penalty before commenting?

post #144 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Martin View Post

another fun fact: Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time and what he says carries a lot of weight in the golfing world.

 

Particularly with those who are too lazy or ignorant to look into the facts of the matter.

 

Can you say with certainty Jack knew the circumstances (all the warnings, never catching up, etc.) behind the penalty before commenting?


what part of my post are you having difficulty with? The greatest golfer? Or that he has a lot of weight to what he says?

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