Wedge Grooves

Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer

Pictures would help in this instance.  Even after 120 rounds, I doubt your wedge is worn out.  Pros change their wedges several times a year but they need sharp grooves.  Most of us dont hit the ball solidly enough to tell much of a difference from new, sharp grooves and somewhat worn grooves.

Originally Posted by birlyshirly

Wedges seem to have become almost a consumable item - lasting only a little longer than a premium ball. I don't get it. I'm not denying that grooves wear - but how much groove do you need? It wasn't THAT long ago that groove volume wasn't the main selling point of a wedge, and good players would continue to game a club that they liked until the grooves were almost worn off the face.

It's still advice that I trust, that it's usually better to use trajectory rather than spin to stop a wedge.

Originally Posted by Righty to Lefty

Grooves do not create spin from the fairway and they actually take away from it slightly because they reduce the amount of clubface that touches the ball.  You only need grooves from the rough and it wet conditions.  The face is on a wedge that is being used in the bunker is losing its ability to have friction with the ball from the fairway and will thus over time spin much less.  Like I said I watched a 64* wedge go from hop and stop with range balls on greenside chips to rolling out 10 feet with a tour ball from 40 yards out within 6 months.  That being said I was practicing a lot and spent a lot of hours in the bunker but the wedge was still getting worn out.

Originally Posted by Righty to Lefty

Grooves do not create spin from the fairway and they actually take away from it slightly because they reduce the amount of clubface that touches the ball.  You only need grooves from the rough and it wet conditions.  The face is on a wedge that is being used in the bunker is losing its ability to have friction with the ball from the fairway and will thus over time spin much less.  Like I said I watched a 64* wedge go from hop and stop with range balls on greenside chips to rolling out 10 feet with a tour ball from 40 yards out within 6 months.  That being said I was practicing a lot and spent a lot of hours in the bunker but the wedge was still getting worn out.

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

Hold it.

Grammar Police.

Time for a grammar stop:

"That being said I was practicing a lot and spent a lot of hours in the bunker but the wedge was still getting worn out."

You seem to indicate that you were practicing a lot in the bunker BUT still the wedge was getting worn out.

??

Did you mean to state:

"That being said I was practicing a lot, and as a result the wedge was getting worn out."

Originally Posted by Shambles

If clubface were the creators of spin, then a club could not be worn out from use, unless you can show a club that actually became concave. In reality, the proof is not necessarily needed from you as we should be able to find them in the experienced bins the world over, or the garage sales. If anything were to wear down a club it would need to be some harder, in the sense of more brittle, material like a stone, pebbles or sand. Even the hardest golf ball has to lose the battle of wear against even the softest steel. It does not even begin to approach the nature of a contest. Further, even if a wedge is used exclusively and constantly in a sand trap, the wear would be at flange and eventually, the leading edge. Think of a shovel used on a construction site. When newly purchased, the leading edge of the shovel resembles the back of a single hump camel. Towards the end of the job the leading edge of the shovel will more closely resemble the back of a two hump camel.

The objection holds true for the argument that grooves wear out from use. If that were true, we would find clubs that showed the grooves bowling out around the sweet spot and that too is simply not the case. What does wear out is the plating on forged irons and that is because the plating is just very tiny bits of metal that have been made to adhere to the surface of the club electrically. Use has a way of breaking up the adhesion from repeated impact at the point of most use, i.e., the sweet spot and the flange. The ball, soft or hard, is very capable of knocking off plating where it most often contacts the club.

All good clubs are capable of serving long after their owners have passed on, be they stainless or forged. They just show their age and use, at which point we create reasons for needing new clubs.

Shambles

Originally Posted by Righty to Lefty

Are you telling me that grooves don't become rounded off as a club is repeatedly beaten about in a bunker and the face doesn't lose friction after thousands of swipes at high speed though sand?  I didn't say that that the face will become deformed but the steel is definitely not left in the same state that it was when it was new.  Loss of the clubs ability to maintain friction between the clubface and ball will have to result in a loss of spin. I mean if you rub baby oil on the face of your wedge I guarantee that you aren't goin to get stick and stop on any shot now matter how much loft you have on the club.  I just got my wedges delivered to me and I plan to play them until there is a hole in the face so I'm sure they will outlive me for sure !!

Originally Posted by Shambles

If clubface were the creators of spin, then a club could not be worn out from use, unless you can show a club that actually became concave. In reality, the proof is not necessarily needed from you as we should be able to find them in the experienced bins the world over, or the garage sales. If anything were to wear down a club it would need to be some harder, in the sense of more brittle, material like a stone, pebbles or sand. Even the hardest golf ball has to lose the battle of wear against even the softest steel. It does not even begin to approach the nature of a contest. Further, even if a wedge is used exclusively and constantly in a sand trap, the wear would be at flange and eventually, the leading edge. Think of a shovel used on a construction site. When newly purchased, the leading edge of the shovel resembles the back of a single hump camel. Towards the end of the job the leading edge of the shovel will more closely resemble the back of a two hump camel.

The objection holds true for the argument that grooves wear out from use. If that were true, we would find clubs that showed the grooves bowling out around the sweet spot and that too is simply not the case. What does wear out is the plating on forged irons and that is because the plating is just very tiny bits of metal that have been made to adhere to the surface of the club electrically. Use has a way of breaking up the adhesion from repeated impact at the point of most use, i.e., the sweet spot and the flange. The ball, soft or hard, is very capable of knocking off plating where it most often contacts the club.

All good clubs are capable of serving long after their owners have passed on, be they stainless or forged. They just show their age and use, at which point we create reasons for needing new clubs.

Shambles

Originally Posted by iacas

That's incorrect. Above about a 5-iron the grooves on all clubs add spin even from clean, dry lies.