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2013 NCAA College Football - Page 25

post #433 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wisguy View Post
 

 

I clearly counted some chickens before they hatched.  What a poor showing.  Regardless of the coach, Wisconsin traditionally has at least one bad game a season.  Yesterday's home loss was that game.  No BCS bowl game for the Badgers.  Probably still a New Years bowl, though.

 

I was shocked, but I was worried when I looked at PSU schedule. PSU has alternated Wins and Losses. They never had back to back losses this season. I don't know, it is a sports thing. I can see the motivation though. No bowl game, high ranked Wisconsin, this is their bowl game. If PSU's QB gets on fire, he is a good QB. PSU has a draft pick at wide out. Wisconsin ran into the perfect storm this weekend. 

post #434 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post
 

 

I was shocked, but I was worried when I looked at PSU schedule. PSU has alternated Wins and Losses. They never had back to back losses this season. I don't know, it is a sports thing. I can see the motivation though. No bowl game, high ranked Wisconsin, this is their bowl game. If PSU's QB gets on fire, he is a good QB. PSU has a draft pick at wide out. Wisconsin ran into the perfect storm this weekend. 

 

Plus they played like shit.  They absolutely deserved to lose......in Camp Randall no less.   :-(

post #435 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
 

 

Plus they played like shit.  They absolutely deserved to lose......in Camp Randall no less.   :-(

 

 

Well if the team across from you play to a very high level, that can make you look like you are playing bad. Football is a two way street. I think Penn State played out of their minds for 60 minutes. It was just one of those games. 

post #436 of 692

 

I keep thinking of this when comparing the BCS to the playoff next year. Let Russel Crowe be the creator of the BCS system :-D. It has created some crazy story lines, and pumped up excitement for November college football. 

 

For all those who want an NFL system, you have no clue how much more passion and excitement there is in NCAA football than their is in the NFL. The rivalries, the crazy BCS, God I love it. 

 

I ask this, what would be more entertaining, discussing who will be number 4, or who should be number 2. Just thinking the argument for either a Missouri and Alabama isn't nearly as appealing as Auburn versus OSU discussion. 

post #437 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post
For all those who want an NFL system, you have no clue how much more passion and excitement there is in NCAA football than their is in the NFL. The rivalries, the crazy BCS, God I love it. 

 

I have to agree. All other league playoffs are ho hum compared.  Even the Final Four tournament isn't as exciting IMO.

 

The controversy of the BCS leads to the discussion and arguments that get people going. 

That and most in the U.S. relate to their schools more. The school you graduated from is a part of you in the U.S. from what I see.  A Buckeye, Seminole and of course The Irish. :-)

 

Up here people barely mention their university or college when asked their background and it's usually nothing more than a line on your resume.

post #438 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augustabound View Post
 

 

I have to agree. All other league playoffs are ho hum compared.  Even the Final Four tournament isn't as exciting IMO.

 

The controversy of the BCS leads to the discussion and arguments that get people going.

That and most in the U.S. relate to their schools more. The school you graduated from is a part of you in the U.S. from what I see.  A Buckeye, Seminole and of course The Irish. :-)

 

Up here people barely mention their university or college when asked their background and it's usually nothing more than a line on your resume.

Unlike other systems EVERY game matters. I barely pay attention to wins and losses in the NFL until it gets close to playoff time and I hope the college regular season games never lose their significance to that level.

 

The drawback for years was that the best two teams might never play each other at all, so it's better now than it used to be. Going to four teams will help eliminate the chance that the third or fourth best team is left out, but it obviously won't eliminate all arguments.

 

With the expansion of conferences and the amount of games played it's becoming very hard to go undefeated so every year it's very likely for there to be several one loss teams that all look like they deserve a shot. Very hard to tell by watching teams from different conferences with no common opponents who is better, and the better team doesn't always win anyway.

 

Margin of victory is also a fairly bad indicator of how good teams are. Too many times a team is lighting up the scoreboard and looking unbeatable, as they roll through one opponent after another, only to look like an entirely different football team when they finally play somebody with a defense that was winning their games by a few points.

 

I don't envy the job of the committee to pick the best four teams. Even this year that would be a very tough call. Is Alabama better than Missouri (or even Auburn)? Probably, but I certainly wouldn't be able to put them ahead of a team that either beat them or had to play an extra game against a division champion.

 

It will be interesting to see what the committee does on those years where 3 or 4 teams from the same conference look like the best teams in the country. Wouldn't be good for football at all to put all of them in a playoff while leaving out major conference champions. The best that could happen would be if the conferences were all fairly equal but unfortunately that's not usually the case.

post #439 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post
 

 

I keep thinking of this when comparing the BCS to the playoff next year. Let Russel Crowe be the creator of the BCS system :-D. It has created some crazy story lines, and pumped up excitement for November college football.

 

For all those who want an NFL system, you have no clue how much more passion and excitement there is in NCAA football than their is in the NFL. The rivalries, the crazy BCS, God I love it. 

 

I ask this, what would be more entertaining, discussing who will be number 4, or who should be number 2. Just thinking the argument for either a Missouri and Alabama isn't nearly as appealing as Auburn versus OSU discussion.

 

I couldn't disagree more.

How can anybody defend the BCS? The BCS sucks and is derived to reward the high and mighty and the bowl game system. There would be far more long term interest and passion if they had a playoff system that would settle it on the field. And BTW, there is no debate about Ohio State and Auburn until they both play their next games. But then the bottom line is that, if they both win, somebody is going to get screwed out of a chance to play for a National Championship.

 

At least next year there will be four with a shot, but that's not enough either. Every other level of football and every other college sport has a true National Champion, won on the field of battle, not with a stupid poll.

 

I hate the BCS with a passion.

post #440 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by phan52 View Post
 

 

I couldn't disagree more.

How can anybody defend the BCS? The BCS sucks and is derived to reward the high and mighty and the bowl game system. There would be far more long term interest and passion if they had a playoff system that would settle it on the field. And BTW, there is no debate about Ohio State and Auburn until they both play their next games. But then the bottom line is that, if they both win, somebody is going to get screwed out of a chance to play for a National Championship.

 

At least next year there will be four with a shot, but that's not enough either. Every other level of football and every other college sport has a true National Champion, won on the field of battle, not with a stupid poll.

 

I hate the BCS with a passion.

 

It isn't a defense of the BCS, I am just saying it is entertaining. It brings up talking points, drives rivalries that now span between conferences. It is absolutely beautiful chaos. Honestly I am both glad to see it go, and sad to see it go. 

 

BCS was created to find the two top teams in the nation because the coach's poll and the AP poll couldn't agree 100% of the time. So they wanted the two best teams to play each other. Did it fit well with the bowl games, yes. Bowl games would have come along anyways, it was a natural expansion to allow a lot of teams to play each other. I think bowl games are awesome. I think it is great that teams can play other teams they might not, and enjoy new experiences. 

 

Of course four is enough. Do you think a true Champion is crowned in a playoff. That is absurd. All playoffs do is discredit the regular season. all those close games, big wins, great moments for teams, destroyed by a playoff.  Who do you think is more deserving of being called a champion, a 1 loss New England Patriot Team, or the New York Giants. I mean come on, that was the biggest joke. An amazing game, but total BS to think that one game could tell you who the better team is. In college football it is all about who the better team is, not who gets up for one game. Its the reason why 2 or 4 teams is perfect because the difference in the top 4 is marginal. If you bring in 16, now you bring in stupid volatility. It's the reason all other sports have 3-5 game series in their playoffs, it is to kill the total bull shit that is a one game elimination. Anyone who thinks the NFL playoff is a good thing should have their heads checked by a professional psychologist. Four is perfect because it kicks out those who might sneak in and be the dark horse team that shouldn't even be there in the first place. 

post #441 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post
 

 

It isn't a defense of the BCS, I am just saying it is entertaining. It brings up talking points, drives rivalries that now span between conferences. It is absolutely beautiful chaos. Honestly I am both glad to see it go, and sad to see it go.

 

BCS was created to find the two top teams in the nation because the coach's poll and the AP poll couldn't agree 100% of the time. So they wanted the two best teams to play each other. Did it fit well with the bowl games, yes. Bowl games would have come along anyways, it was a natural expansion to allow a lot of teams to play each other. I think bowl games are awesome. I think it is great that teams can play other teams they might not, and enjoy new experiences.

 

Of course four is enough. Do you think a true Champion is crowned in a playoff. That is absurd. All playoffs do is discredit the regular season. all those close games, big wins, great moments for teams, destroyed by a playoff.  Who do you think is more deserving of being called a champion, a 1 loss New England Patriot Team, or the New York Giants. I mean come on, that was the biggest joke. An amazing game, but total BS to think that one game could tell you who the better team is. In college football it is all about who the better team is, not who gets up for one game. Its the reason why 2 or 4 teams is perfect because the difference in the top 4 is marginal. If you bring in 16, now you bring in stupid volatility. It's the reason all other sports have 3-5 game series in their playoffs, it is to kill the total bull shit that is a one game elimination. Anyone who thinks the NFL playoff is a good thing should have their heads checked by a professional psychologist. Four is perfect because it kicks out those who might sneak in and be the dark horse team that shouldn't even be there in the first place.

 

What is wrong with a dark horse? What is wrong with volatility? The BCS doesn't "drive rivalries that now span conferences", it keeps some conference winners from ever being able to prove their mettle on the field. This coming weekend is a perfect example of how ludicrous the BCS is. I am already hearing arguments that the winner of the SEC championship deserves to play over an undefeated Ohio State, even if they win their conference championship game. So just winning won't be enough. So Ohio State, a team that has won 24 straight Division I football games, now has to make a statement to a bunch of people who vote in a subjective poll? Now, THAT'S absurd.

 

And if the Patriots were so good they would have won that SB. At least they had a chance to do it on the field.


Edited by phan52 - 12/2/13 at 2:32pm
post #442 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by phan52 View Post
 

 

I couldn't disagree more.

How can anybody defend the BCS? The BCS sucks and is derived to reward the high and mighty and the bowl game system. There would be far more long term interest and passion if they had a playoff system that would settle it on the field. And BTW, there is no debate about Ohio State and Auburn until they both play their next games. But then the bottom line is that, if they both win, somebody is going to get screwed out of a chance to play for a National Championship.

 

At least next year there will be four with a shot, but that's not enough either. Every other level of football and every other college sport has a true National Champion, won on the field of battle, not with a stupid poll.

 

I hate the BCS with a passion.

I agree that "the BCS sucks" but it's better than it used to be when there was often no chance for the top two ranked teams to play at all. I'm hoping the four team format will be yet another improvement.

 

Beyond that every playoff system I can think of runs into problems like lack of regular season interest, playing too many games, and huge lack of parity (unlike the NFL).

 

The last thing I would want to see is for it to turn into the joke that the high school playoff system has become, where half of the teams make the playoffs. Nothing worse than a 4 seed with a losing record from a weak area playing a 1 seed that's undefeated in the toughest area.

 

P.S. Except when that number 1 seed beats the number 4 seed 60 to 0 but their best player gets hit in the knee and is out for the rest of the playoffs (in a game that never should have happened in the first place).


Edited by MS256 - 12/2/13 at 2:43pm
post #443 of 692

If you have a 16 team play off in NCAA football. It is already hard to go undefeated in college football. Now you ask them to play 4 more games. What if you get a 9-3 team versus an 8-2 team. That is a total joke. It would be a tarnish on anything any good team has done in the regular season. It would be a disgrace to college football, that you can let a 9-3 team have a shot at winning a championship. It might sound elitist, but a champion is an ELITE TEAM, and it needs to have a playoff of ELITE teams. That means top 4, maybe top 8 at max. Then you might allow a 2 loss team to enter, who probably could be a 1 loss or no loss. You go to 16 or more, your just asking for people not to care. 

 

Look at the NCAA basketball. The first three rounds are total crap. The only reason people watch them is because they run brackets and have money betting. 

 

Keep it at 4 teams, keep it elite, and let those who deserve to play, play. Some team is going to have a beef with the system. Too bad. 

post #444 of 692

USC has reportedly hired Steve Sarkisian as the new head coach. I liked Sarkisian as the OC at USC under Carroll, but I'm still not all that excited about this hire as the HC. 

post #445 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post
 

If you have a 16 team play off in NCAA football. It is already hard to go undefeated in college football. Now you ask them to play 4 more games. What if you get a 9-3 team versus an 8-2 team. That is a total joke. It would be a tarnish on anything any good team has done in the regular season. It would be a disgrace to college football, that you can let a 9-3 team have a shot at winning a championship. It might sound elitist, but a champion is an ELITE TEAM, and it needs to have a playoff of ELITE teams. That means top 4, maybe top 8 at max. Then you might allow a 2 loss team to enter, who probably could be a 1 loss or no loss. You go to 16 or more, your just asking for people not to care.

 

Look at the NCAA basketball. The first three rounds are total crap. The only reason people watch them is because they run brackets and have money betting.

 

Keep it at 4 teams, keep it elite, and let those who deserve to play, play. Some team is going to have a beef with the system. Too bad.

 

I never mentioned a 16 team playoff. But 8 is a manageable number and you would NOT have any multiple loss teams playing each other. There are at least ten teams right now in Division I that I can think of that are undefeated or have one loss, and that doesn't even include a team from the tough PAC12. It WOULD be elite, and it would crown a worthy champion.

 

As far as NCAA basketball is concerned, what has been more exciting that what Butler has done the last couple of years? Hell, a couple of years ago they were a three point shot away from winning the whole thing in one of the more exciting games in Final Four history. It turns out the only thing that made them a dark horse were the subjective polls that only cater to the big name (read: big money) conferences.

post #446 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by phan52 View Post
 

 

I never mentioned a 16 team playoff. But 8 is a manageable number and you would NOT have any multiple loss teams playing each other. There are at least ten teams right now in Division I that I can think of that are undefeated or have one loss, and that doesn't even include a team from the tough PAC12. It WOULD be elite, and it would crown a worthy champion.

 

As far as NCAA basketball is concerned, what has been more exciting that what Butler has done the last couple of years? Hell, a couple of years ago they were a three point shot away from winning the whole thing in one of the more exciting games in Final Four history. It turns out the only thing that made them a dark horse were the subjective polls that only cater to the big name (read: big money) conferences.

 

Gotta agree, if you're gonna have a true playoff system, I'd like to see 8.  Now it's wide open.....there are some damn good teams in the 5-8 spot that could just as easily win it as the top 4.

post #447 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
 

 

Gotta agree, if you're gonna have a true playoff system, I'd like to see 8.  Now it's wide open.....there are some damn good teams in the 5-8 spot that could just as easily win it as the top 4.

8 is a good number.

 

Just whatever you do don't let that 8 turn into 16 and then 32 and then 64. Once a playoff starts the increase in teams is always never ending because everybody wants a piece of the pie and coaches want to be able to say they made the playoffs for job security. This isn't basketball and football is not a sport where one or two elite players on a Cinderella team can carry a team.

 

If they go to 8 it they should also eliminate a regular season game. The pros play too many games (look at the injury list) and these aren't pros.

post #448 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by phan52 View Post

I couldn't disagree more.
How can anybody defend the BCS. Every other level of football and every other college sport has a true National Champion, won on the field of battle, not with a stupid poll.

I hate the BCS with a passion.

And saevel and I say who cares? (Or at least that's what I say and I think what he's saying.) Crowning a "true champion" is one goal of a football season. I think it's not the only goal, and not even close to the biggest goal. College football has over 100 years of tradition and history that has nothing to do with a seeded playoff. Rivalries, conferences, and bowls are what college football is really all about.

The BCS is imperfect, but it does make football interesting. IMO a playoff would make the regular season much less interesting.
post #449 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by k-troop View Post


And saevel and I say who cares? (Or at least that's what I say and I think what he's saying.) Crowning a "true champion" is one goal of a football season. I think it's not the only goal, and not even close to the biggest goal. College football has over 100 years of tradition and history that has nothing to do with a seeded playoff. Rivalries, conferences, and bowls are what college football is really all about.

The BCS is imperfect, but it does make football interesting. IMO a playoff would make the regular season much less interesting.

 

I and a I think a lot of people will disagree with you that a playoff isn't for the better in regards to NCAA football.

 

I don't think it dampens the regular season, just as I don't think the NCAA tourney in basketball lessens the regular season.  You still have to make it to the playoffs via the regular season to advance thus making the regular season important.  Having a playoff also helps eliminate the thought that someone who went undefeated with a sub-par schedule won the NC over someone with a much tougher 1-loss schedule.  I also want to say that I am not alluding to that being the case this year.  And although I have stated that I don't think a 4 team playoff is the best answer in the long run it is definitely better than what we have now..

 

I would have loved to have seen the playoff system initiated this year.  How could you not be excited about it?

 

Alabama #4 vs FSU #1

 

Auburn #2 vs Ohio State#2

 

And the winners face for the NC.

 

That would have been some awesome football and the winner could claim that they won it outright by facing 2 of the best 4 teams in the country.

post #450 of 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by SloverUT View Post

I and a I think a lot of people will disagree with you that a playoff isn't for the better in regards to NCAA football.

I don't think it dampens the regular season, just as I don't think the NCAA tourney in basketball lessens the regular season.  You still have to make it to the playoffs via the regular season to advance thus making the regular season important.  Having a playoff also helps eliminate the thought that someone who went undefeated with a sub-par schedule won the NC over someone with a much tougher 1-loss schedule.  I also want to say that I am not alluding to that being the case this year.  And although I have stated that I don't think a 4 team playoff is the best answer in the long run it is definitely better than what we have now..

I would have loved to have seen the playoff system initiated this year.  How could you not be excited about it?

Alabama #4 vs FSU #1

Auburn #2 vs Ohio State#2

And the winners face for the NC.

That would have been some awesome football and the winner could claim that they won it outright by facing 2 of the best 4 teams in the country.
And, hypothetically, Bama beats Auburn in the title game. Now what? They're "champions" cuz their win was in January and Auburns was in December?

I'm with Saevel and k-troop in the (minority) group that doesn't think that a playoff is necessarily better, by any means. It would, no doubt, be exciting, but it would also, no doubt, take away some excitement from the regular season games. Neither way is better, they're just different.
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