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Would fade setting on driver make draw easier?

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 

After months of frustration, I've finally learned to draw the ball off the tee (now my stock shot unless there're tall trees immediately to the right of the tee box).  I set up with the just off my left toe with my hands a little forward and the clubface a bit open. Ball generally starts up the right side of the fairway and falls over to the middle.  

 

Since we know the clubface has to be open to start the ball right of the target, I'm wondering if it would actually make more sense to set my driver to an "open" or "fade" setting? 

post #2 of 14

I am not a big believer that the open/closed settings on adjustable drivers make much difference.  Couldn't you simply rotate the shaft in your grip to attain this?

 

I believe the ability to change the loft makes a far greater difference.

post #3 of 14

I use the old Nicklaus-style set.up for draw. Closed stance, shoulders angled slightly to the right, and clubface pointing to center of fairway.

 

I set my Callaway RazrFit driver to the open setting to pick up the equivalent of another degree of loft.

 

Some golf sources say opening the face increases loft, others say opening decreases loft.

 

I talked to a club pro yesterday about face angle and loft change (face angle changes can affect the effective loft of a club). He said the design characteristics of the hosel come into play. On some clubs, like my RazrFit, an open face setting increases loft. In other clubs, an open setting can effectively decreases loft.

post #4 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundandFury View Post

After months of frustration, I've finally learned to draw the ball off the tee (now my stock shot unless there're tall trees immediately to the right of the tee box).  I set up with the just off my left toe with my hands a little forward and the clubface a bit open. Ball generally starts up the right side of the fairway and falls over to the middle.  

 

Since we know the clubface has to be open to start the ball right of the target, I'm wondering if it would actually make more sense to set my driver to an "open" or "fade" setting? 

 

Depends on your swing. Some might need a more open clubface, some might need it squarer. It depends on how you grip the club, how the clubface is set up at address, and how you return the clubface back to the ball. I've seen people set up with a clubface closed, and hit a  ball straight.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by WUTiger View Post

I use the old Nicklaus-style set.up for draw. Closed stance, shoulders angled slightly to the right, and clubface pointing to center of fairway.

 

I set my Callaway RazrFit driver to the open setting to pick up the equivalent of another degree of loft.

 

Some golf sources say opening the face increases loft, others say opening decreases loft.

 

I talked to a club pro yesterday about face angle and loft change (face angle changes can affect the effective loft of a club). He said the design characteristics of the hosel come into play. On some clubs, like my RazrFit, an open face setting increases loft. In other clubs, an open setting can effectively decreases loft.

 


Opening a clubface will increase loft. They say decrease because a slice looks lower than a push. But that's because most slices are hit as a pull slice which would be lower than a push draw. Really got to look at the exact shot shape, and what the clubface is doing.

 

what your hitting there is most likely a pull draw. Not exactly sure the shot shape Jack had, it was a fade, not sure if it was a slight pull fade, or a straight or push fade. But if it was a pull fade, that method makes since he wouldn't have to change his swing, only his set up.

post #5 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post

... what your hitting there is most likely a pull draw. Not exactly sure the shot shape Jack had, it was a fade, not sure if it was a slight pull fade, or a straight or push fade. But if it was a pull fade, that method makes since he wouldn't have to change his swing, only his set up.

 

For my drives, I have a push draw. I align the clubface square toward center of fairway, and have a closed stance. On successful shots, the ball starts out down the right edge of the fairway, and curves back toward center.

 

I fade my irons, and usually my FWs.

 

Nicklaus favored a fade early in his career, but learned to hit a draw when needed.  He suggested having a fade or draw as your main shot helps with consistency. You guessed it - pull fade was his main shot. See PowerPoint diagram below which I adapted from his book.

 

 

JackFadeRV.pptx 63k .pptx file
Edited by WUTiger - 6/23/13 at 2:20pm
post #6 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by WUTiger View Post

 

For my drives, I have a push draw. I align the clubface square toward center of fairway, and have a closed stance. On successful shots, the ball starts out down the right edge of the fairway, and curves back toward center.

 

I fade my irons, and usually my FWs.

 

Nicklaus favored a fade early in his career, but learned to hit a draw when needed.  He suggested having a fade or draw as your main shot helps with consistency. You guessed it - pull fade was his main shot. See PowerPoint diagram below which I adapted from his book.

 

 

JackFadeRV.pptx 63k .pptx file

 

If your aiming right, then your hitting a straight draw or pull draw. The words pull, push, straight are all relative to your target line. Since you aim closed, its not a push just because it goes right of center, it must be a push relative to your body alignment.

post #7 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post

If your aiming right, then your hitting a straight draw or pull draw. The words pull, push, straight are all relative to your target line. Since you aim closed, its not a push just because it goes right of center, it must be a push relative to your body alignment.

 

It's a push draw - Blue Path G - in Ball Flight for Right-Handed Golfers.

Clubface alignment is square, with swing path going to right. Ball draws back toward center.

 

Check here: http://thesandtrap.com/a/big-list-of-golf-terminology


Edited by WUTiger - 6/23/13 at 11:31pm
post #8 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundandFury View Post

After months of frustration, I've finally learned to draw the ball off the tee (now my stock shot unless there're tall trees immediately to the right of the tee box).  I set up with the just off my left toe with my hands a little forward and the clubface a bit open. Ball generally starts up the right side of the fairway and falls over to the middle.  

 

Since we know the clubface has to be open to start the ball right of the target, I'm wondering if it would actually make more sense to set my driver to an "open" or "fade" setting? 

No.

post #9 of 14
Wutiger, I think saevel (and most others) are describing the ball flight in relation to the body alignments, not the target.

Jack Nicklaus actually hit a push fade, he just aligned far enough left so he could still end up on target.
post #10 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundandFury View Post
 I'm wondering if it would actually make more sense to set my driver to an "open" or "fade" setting? 

Surely the best way to find out is to try it.

One half hour  range session is worth a thousand replies here. Only you can see and feel the way the ball comes off the clubface.

post #11 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by WUTiger View Post

 

It's a push draw - Blue Path G - in Ball Flight for Right-Handed Golfers.

Clubface alignment is square, with swing path going to right. Ball draws back toward center.

 

Check here: http://thesandtrap.com/a/big-list-of-golf-terminology

 

doesn't matter if you show me that chart, i know the chart. The problem is your not moving your angles, your basically saying, ok push is always right of the center of the fairway. That's wrong. A push is to the right of ware your lining up to the golf ball.

 

Basically if you aim, lets say 15 yards right of center, to the right edge of the fairway. Your aiming about 3-5 degrees right, depending on how far you hit the ball. This means you shifted your "E" path 3-5 degrees right. Meaning if you were to hit a straight ball it would go to the right edge of the fairway. So if your hitting a ball that starts down the right side and curves to the center, your basically hitting a straight to pull draw. Because your hitting down now an adjusted "E" path, with a curve. So its a straight to pull draw.

 

Pushes are anything to the right of your target line set up by your body alignment. Were the ball goes, depends on the swing path and clubface angle.

 

So if i aimed down the right side and hit a push fade, my ball should end up down the right side because it pushed out right and curved back to were i was aiming. That's why "G" and "C" end up near "E". If your saying your ball curves towards the center, that mean's it bypasses "E", and goes further left. Either then its a hook, or a straight to pull Draw.

post #12 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by saevel25 View Post

 

doesn't matter if you show me that chart, i know the chart. The problem is your not moving your angles, your basically saying, ok push is always right of the center of the fairway. That's wrong. A push is to the right of ware your lining up to the golf ball.

 

Basically if you aim, lets say 15 yards right of center, to the right edge of the fairway. Your aiming about 3-5 degrees right, depending on how far you hit the ball. This means you shifted your "E" path 3-5 degrees right. Meaning if you were to hit a straight ball it would go to the right edge of the fairway. So if your hitting a ball that starts down the right side and curves to the center, your basically hitting a straight to pull draw. Because your hitting down now an adjusted "E" path, with a curve. So its a straight to pull draw.

 

Pushes are anything to the right of your target line set up by your body alignment. Were the ball goes, depends on the swing path and clubface angle.

 

So if i aimed down the right side and hit a push fade, my ball should end up down the right side because it pushed out right and curved back to were i was aiming. That's why "G" and "C" end up near "E". If your saying your ball curves towards the center, that mean's it bypasses "E", and goes further left. Either then its a hook, or a straight to pull Draw.

 

I think you mean draw.  If you aimed down the right side and hit a push fade, you would be in the trees.

post #13 of 14

yep, draw, thanks for catching that

post #14 of 14

WU Tiger that chart is showing the ball flights with the body alignment square to the target line.

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