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2013 PGA Championship at Oak Hill Discussion Thread - Page 4

post #55 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post


Spitfisher, were you at Firestone last week like I was, or at Oak Hill right now like I am?

If the answer to either is no how can you reasonably compare the rough or tree lines?

BTW there are more trees at Firestone.
Adam Scott is basically no better a driver than Tiger.

Got any stats of Tiger's driving in majors?

post #56 of 369
M
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonarchGolf2010 View Post

Oak Hill is a course that Tiger can win on with his iron play alone.  Think back to Hoy Lake.  The scores will be such that he won't need to make many birdies to stay in contention.  Pars will serve players well.  As for those that say you need to hit driver at Oak Hill, you don't.  The holes that seem like driver holes such as 7, 9, 17, 18, although striping one 320 will set the hole up nicely, the difference between hitting a 6 iron and 4 iron into a green is not great, when it comes to proximity to the hole and birdie average.  So, the difficult holes are played for par, and then some of the easier holes need to be capitalized on, such as 2, 5, 10, 12, 14.  

I think Tiger has a great chance because of his iron play.

Cheers!

Oak Hill isn't like Hoylake at all. Tiger could afford to hit irons at the '06 Open because his stinger 2-irons could roll on the firm fairways as far as his driver could carry. This course will not be playing firm, and finding one or two more fairways per round is not worth the 20-30 yards he'd be giving up to the field by keeping the driver in the bag. Tiger's seventh on the PGA Tour in total driving this season; he can hit the big stick if he wants to. His success will depend on whether he can hit the big stick when he needs to, and that is where he sometimes has problems.

At the 17th hole Saturday at Muirfield, Tiger walked to the tee with a share lead, and with an opportunity to take the lead outright, he played well back on the par five, and Lee Westwood promptly striped one down the fairway. I suspect Tiger was planning to take three iron swings to the green and settle for par, but Lee's drive forced him to play for birdie, and the position he left himself off the tee was not ideal for that. Tiger's fairway medal couldn't carry the cross bunkers, he finished the hole with a bogey, Lee made birdie, and Tiger never came close to the lead again.

There was no reason for him to hit anything other than driver on that hole, but he couldn't pull the trigger, and the consequences of that decision killed any momentum he had built up during the tournament. If Tiger is in contention this weekend, there will be a moment where the conservative play off the tee is not an option. He must pull the trigger, or else he doesn't have a chance.
post #57 of 369
post #58 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilli Dipper View Post

M
Oak Hill isn't like Hoylake at all. Tiger could afford to hit irons at the '06 Open because his stinger 2-irons could roll on the firm fairways as far as his driver could carry. This course will not be playing firm, and finding one or two more fairways per round is not worth the 20-30 yards he'd be giving up to the field by keeping the driver in the bag. Tiger's seventh on the PGA Tour in total driving this season; he can hit the big stick if he wants to. His success will depend on whether he can hit the big stick when he needs to, and that is where he sometimes has problems.

At the 17th hole Saturday at Muirfield, Tiger walked to the tee with a share lead, and with an opportunity to take the lead outright, he played well back on the par five, and Lee Westwood promptly striped one down the fairway. I suspect Tiger was planning to take three iron swings to the green and settle for par, but Lee's drive forced him to play for birdie, and the position he left himself off the tee was not ideal for that. Tiger's fairway medal couldn't carry the cross bunkers, he finished the hole with a bogey, Lee made birdie, and Tiger never came close to the lead again.

There was no reason for him to hit anything other than driver on that hole, but he couldn't pull the trigger, and the consequences of that decision killed any momentum he had built up during the tournament. If Tiger is in contention this weekend, there will be a moment where the conservative play off the tee is not an option. He must pull the trigger, or else he doesn't have a chance.

I'm only speaking from experience.  It is difficult to get to the corners of these Ross greens from any position, whether it be wedge or not.  Having played Oak Hill East in tournament conditions (albeit not major championship conditions), I believe that whoever can make putts from the centers of greens will win the championship.  Drivers are NOT necessary around this place.  out of 14 holes, I hit 3 hybrids off of tees and 3 woods, 8 drivers. That very well could be 4 drivers, 7 three woods for anyone not comfortable.  

 

Judging only from past championships, the winning score will not be a low one, and there won't be many people under par.  Therefore, a fairly conservative strategy playing for par with option birdie with a crisp mid iron and nice putt, will put a player near the top of the leaderboard.

post #59 of 369
Can anyone with institutional knowledge on the club set up advise on the location of the range? I know the course has 2 18's - I just want to know how far you have to hump it to the range once you're there.
post #60 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonarchGolf2010 View Post

I'm only speaking from experience.  It is difficult to get to the corners of these Ross greens from any position, whether it be wedge or not.  Having played Oak Hill East in tournament conditions (albeit not major championship conditions), I believe that whoever can make putts from the centers of greens will win the championship.  Drivers are NOT necessary around this place.  out of 14 holes, I hit 3 hybrids off of tees and 3 woods, 8 drivers. That very well could be 4 drivers, 7 three woods for anyone not comfortable.  

 

Judging only from past championships, the winning score will not be a low one, and there won't be many people under par.  Therefore, a fairly conservative strategy playing for par with option birdie with a crisp mid iron and nice putt, will put a player near the top of the leaderboard.

 

Again, I'm not saying that Tiger has to hit driver on every hole; he does have to hit the driver with confidence when driver off the tee is the correct play. Merion is similarly a course that only required driver on five or six holes; people were saying that driver was unnecessary at the US Open, but the leaders who emerged turned out to be (with the exception of Mickelson) a who's who of the best all-around drivers of the golf ball in the game today. The statistics would indicate that Tiger is right on that level with the likes of Rose, Mahan, and Day, but we haven't seen that caliber of play from him on the weekend at majors in recent years.

 

Oak Hill may very well be a course that requires a driver on five holes. If he can't put a driver on the fairway at those holes, he's not winning the PGA Championship, regardless of how well he sticks to a safe, conservative strategy on the other thirteen.

post #61 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Infamous 273 View Post

Can anyone with institutional knowledge on the club set up advise on the location of the range? I know the course has 2 18's - I just want to know how far you have to hump it to the range once you're there.

Typically for pro tournaments they actually use one of the fairways on the West course as the range. The normal range is typically used for merchandising tents, etc.

If you're facing the main building from the parking lot, the range they'll be using should be to your right (or west)
post #62 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by tefunk View Post

Typically for pro tournaments they actually use one of the fairways on the West course as the range. The normal range is typically used for merchandising tents, etc.

If you're facing the main building from the parking lot, the range they'll be using should be to your right (or west)

Nice. Thanks man.
post #63 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Infamous 273 View Post

Can anyone with institutional knowledge on the club set up advise on the location of the range? I know the course has 2 18's - I just want to know how far you have to hump it to the range once you're there.

 

This might help. The link has information like hole numbers, yardage, leader boards, concession stands, rest rooms, etc.

 

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/section/pga04

 

post #64 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilli Dipper View Post

Oak Hill isn't like Hoylake at all. Tiger could afford to hit irons at the '06 Open because his stinger 2-irons could roll on the firm fairways as far as his driver could carry. This course will not be playing firm, and finding one or two more fairways per round is not worth the 20-30 yards he'd be giving up to the field by keeping the driver in the bag. Tiger's seventh on the PGA Tour in total driving this season; he can hit the big stick if he wants to. His success will depend on whether he can hit the big stick when he needs to, and that is where he sometimes has problems.

At the 17th hole Saturday at Muirfield, Tiger walked to the tee with a share lead, and with an opportunity to take the lead outright, he played well back on the par five, and Lee Westwood promptly striped one down the fairway. I suspect Tiger was planning to take three iron swings to the green and settle for par, but Lee's drive forced him to play for birdie, and the position he left himself off the tee was not ideal for that. Tiger's fairway medal couldn't carry the cross bunkers, he finished the hole with a bogey, Lee made birdie, and Tiger never came close to the lead again.

There was no reason for him to hit anything other than driver on that hole, but he couldn't pull the trigger, and the consequences of that decision killed any momentum he had built up during the tournament. If Tiger is in contention this weekend, there will be a moment where the conservative play off the tee is not an option. He must pull the trigger, or else he doesn't have a chance.

The 17th hole on Saturday is not why Tiger didn't win the Open.  Tiger didn't win the Open because his putting sucked on Saturday and Sunday.  It had nothing to do with him driving the ball - or being too conservative off the tee.  If Tiger made more putts.  He wins. Plain and simple.

post #65 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beachcomber View Post

The 17th hole on Saturday is not why Tiger didn't win the Open.  Tiger didn't win the Open because his putting sucked on Saturday and Sunday.  It had nothing to do with him driving the ball - or being too conservative off the tee.  If Tiger made more putts.  He wins. Plain and simple.

The 16th on Saturday was bigger for Tiger--huge momentum killer. Westy drained a huge putt and Tiger missed a birdie; he thought he was going to pick up 2 or 3 there. The 2nd shot on 17 was an error which he might not have forced had 16 played out like he thought. So, I agree that those two holes on Saturday kept Tiger out of the final group and made a big difference for him.

Phil still played a round for the ages on Sunday though; Tiger had no control over that.
post #66 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beachcomber View Post

The fancy chatroom... LOL

 

Every time I go in there, I make sure I have my monocle and tophat on.

post #67 of 369

Luckily they all play on the same greens, whoever figures them out the best will be there come Sunday. I am a great fan of Tiger, but maybe he should focus on the things he can control.

post #68 of 369

The media asked him what he thinks of the greens. What is he supposed to say, that they are perfect and he can't wait to putt on these silky pieces of heaven? I don't understand why it is being perceived that he is making excuses when he is just giving his opinion. No matter what he says he gets slack from someone. Just be grateful that we can watch this legendary career unfold in our lifetime.

post #69 of 369

I doubt Rory will need his weekend outfits, the way he's playing he will be watching tennis on TV come Saturday.

post #70 of 369

Dude, put more than one random thought in a post. No need for a new post every sentence.

post #71 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slice of Life View Post

Dude, put more than one random thought in a post. No need for a new post every sentence.

 

Gotta get that post count up to double digits! a3_biggrin.gif

post #72 of 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingnutter View Post

The media asked him what he thinks of the greens. What is he supposed to say, that they are perfect and he can't wait to putt on these silky pieces of heaven? I don't understand why it is being perceived that he is making excuses when he is just giving his opinion. No matter what he says he gets slack from someone. Just be grateful that we can watch this legendary career unfold in our lifetime.

I agree.  He has two options:

 

1. I think the greens are perfect.

Outcome: If he doesn't win by 12 strokes, he had a putting meltdown!

 

2. The greens are a little slow and I hope they're rolled fast and running 11 by Thursday.

Outcome: What a snob, he is already making excuses for not winning!

 

Okay maybe that's an exaggeration but I'm a huge Tiger fan.  So I feel ya here.

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