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2013 NFL Football - Page 51

post #901 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyredcab View Post

+1

 

The less-than-casual fans in my family who will watch this game simply because it is The Super Bowl, will justifiably find blown calls, that everyone can see where blown but are not reviewable, as further evidence that I should spend less time watching this "stupid" game. "But you can see that he pulled the ball out and was down on the ground with it and he still doesn't get to keep it? Why not? It should be his ball? And what is and what isn't pass interference?"

 



Dont even get me started on pass interference. I look for a flag on every incompletion. If my team is on D I dont breathe until 5 seconds after the play especially on 3rd down. And sometimes we STILL get flagged lol
post #902 of 1006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonTheSavage View Post

I'd rather the NFL deal with the HORRIBLE officiating first and foremost. Whats reviewable and what not?

They deal with situations every off-season that came up the previous year and tweak and refine rules as necessary.  This year, for example, they'll obviously take a look at the reviewability of fumble recoveries.

 

But as far as the "horrible" officiating goes ... how would you propose they address that?  It's easy for us to sit back and nitpick every bad call, and say "refs suck" and everybody agrees, because, well, that's what we do.  But, honestly, does anybody out there think that these guys are not the best, most well-trained people to do this job, and that maybe, just maybe, its an unbelievably difficult job that they all do pretty darn well?

 

There are 22 players on the field and 7 referees, and each of them has about 10-15 things they have to keep their eye on every play.  Isn't kind of ridiculous that we expect them to be 100% correct 100% of the time?

post #903 of 1006
Golfingdad if everything is challengeable it doesn't matter if they are right 100% of the time. The coaches should get 2 challenges and be able to challenge any call. If they get them both right they should be able to keep challenging call until they get one wrong or they don't have a timeout.
post #904 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post

They deal with situations every off-season that came up the previous year and tweak and refine rules as necessary.  This year, for example, they'll obviously take a look at the reviewability of fumble recoveries.

 

But as far as the "horrible" officiating goes ... how would you propose they address that?  It's easy for us to sit back and nitpick every bad call, and say "refs suck" and everybody agrees, because, well, that's what we do.  But, honestly, does anybody out there think that these guys are not the best, most well-trained people to do this job, and that maybe, just maybe, its an unbelievably difficult job that they all do pretty darn well?

 

There are 22 players on the field and 7 referees, and each of them has about 10-15 things they have to keep their eye on every play.  Isn't kind of ridiculous that we expect them to be 100% correct 100% of the time?

 



It's the inconsistency from crew to crew on any given Sunday. In my "humble" opinion something needs to be done. The on field product is suffering. I think it was Hunter Mahan that tweeted Sunday that the NFL should be ashamed of themselves for the officiating. When you got seven guys on the field and a player falls on the plant leg of a punter thats "roughing" first down. But no we get running into the kicker. This isnt new and 7 guys out there got it wrong???

Whats wrong with making these guys full time? In the offseason they could be getting together and going to ref camp or something I dont know but when guys get the rules wrong that bothers me. Ofcourse calls are going to be missed as these are the fastest strongest guys in the world, I have no issue there. I used to think NBA refs were the worst but now the NFL is #1 "in my book." And this is with me knowing the NBA had mobbed up refs LOL.
post #905 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonTheSavage View Post

I'd rather the NFL deal with the HORRIBLE officiating first and foremost. Whats reviewable and what not?

They deal with situations every off-season that came up the previous year and tweak and refine rules as necessary.  This year, for example, they'll obviously take a look at the reviewability of fumble recoveries.

 

But as far as the "horrible" officiating goes ... how would you propose they address that?  It's easy for us to sit back and nitpick every bad call, and say "refs suck" and everybody agrees, because, well, that's what we do.  But, honestly, does anybody out there think that these guys are not the best, most well-trained people to do this job, and that maybe, just maybe, its an unbelievably difficult job that they all do pretty darn well?

 

There are 22 players on the field and 7 referees, and each of them has about 10-15 things they have to keep their eye on every play.  Isn't kind of ridiculous that we expect them to be 100% correct 100% of the time?

 

Add 2 more refs who do nothing but sit in a booth and watch the game feed on monitors.  Give them a direct link to the referee to stop play when they see a bad call, or a penalty which should have been called.  Those two see the same feed we do at home, and would hopefully catch 99% of those obvious blown calls.  The NFL can afford to pay them, but I don't think that they can afford to continue to ignore the problem.

post #906 of 1006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakester23 View Post

Golfingdad if everything is challengeable it doesn't matter if they are right 100% of the time. The coaches should get 2 challenges and be able to challenge any call. If they get them both right they should be able to keep challenging call until they get one wrong or they don't have a timeout.

I believe that all of the things that aren't challengable currently are so because of a particular reason.  They may be wrong, (like, I think, in the case of the unchallengable fumble) but they have their reason.  They don't have calls that are unchallengable "just cuz."

 

Regardless ... this isn't what I'm talking about, this is a rules thing, and not a "the refs suck" thing.  I'm mainly talking about how to make the refereeing better.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonTheSavage View Post
 
It's the inconsistency from crew to crew on any given Sunday. In my "humble" opinion something needs to be done. The on field product is suffering. I think it was Hunter Mahan that tweeted Sunday that the NFL should be ashamed of themselves for the officiating. When you got seven guys on the field and a player falls on the plant leg of a punter thats "roughing" first down. But no we get running into the kicker. This isnt new and 7 guys out there got it wrong???

Whats wrong with making these guys full time? In the offseason they could be getting together and going to ref camp or something I dont know but when guys get the rules wrong that bothers me. Ofcourse calls are going to be missed as these are the fastest strongest guys in the world, I have no issue there. I used to think NBA refs were the worst but now the NFL is #1 "in my book." And this is with me knowing the NBA had mobbed up refs LOL.

OK, I've heard this one several times before.  The NFL is, apparently, the only major sport with part time referees.  Again, another good sounding talking point, but the NFL is also the only league with 1 game per week for 17 weeks.  The other major sports are 2,3 or 6 games a week, so obviously they are pretty much required to be full time.  And I could be wrong about this, but I'm pretty sure even those guys have other jobs in the offseason.

 

Even if they did have off season camps or seminars, it's not like most of the bad calls are due to lack of knowledge of the rules, they're all just judgment calls.  (With the possible exception of the roughing the punter call last weekend.)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourputt View Post
 

Add 2 more refs who do nothing but sit in a booth and watch the game feed on monitors.  Give them a direct link to the referee to stop play when they see a bad call, or a penalty which should have been called.  Those two see the same feed we do at home, and would hopefully catch 99% of those obvious blown calls.  The NFL can afford to pay them, but I don't think that they can afford to continue to ignore the problem.

OK, I'd be on board with this.  I already think college does it better with the booth reviews.  And I do think that there are also SOME penalty calls that should be reviewable.  Holding?  No way.  Pass interference?  Probably still way too grey area.  But things like the Chargers illegal procedure against KC, the roughing the punter and the fumble recovery last week, and penalties that aren't really judgment calls (like intentional grounding), all of that stuff could be added to the list of things that replay refs can help with.

post #907 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourputt View Post
 

Add 2 more refs who do nothing but sit in a booth and watch the game feed on monitors.  Give them a direct link to the referee to stop play when they see a bad call, or a penalty which should have been called.  Those two see the same feed we do at home, and would hopefully catch 99% of those obvious blown calls.  The NFL can afford to pay them, but I don't think that they can afford to continue to ignore the problem.

OK, I'd be on board with this.  I already think college does it better with the booth reviews.  And I do think that there are also SOME penalty calls that should be reviewable.  Holding?  No way.  Pass interference?  Probably still way too grey area.  But things like the Chargers illegal procedure against KC, the roughing the punter and the fumble recovery last week, and penalties that aren't really judgment calls (like intentional grounding), all of that stuff could be added to the list of things that replay refs can help with.

 

I've seen any number of pass interference non calls which should have been called.  Every game a DB gets away with grabbing the receiver's arm on the side away from the ref, forcing  the receiver to go for the ball one handed.  Those are the types of calls that would be reversible if I had my way.  

post #908 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 

They deal with situations every off-season that came up the previous year and tweak and refine rules as necessary.  This year, for example, they'll obviously take a look at the reviewability of fumble recoveries.

 

But as far as the "horrible" officiating goes ... how would you propose they address that?  It's easy for us to sit back and nitpick every bad call, and say "refs suck" and everybody agrees, because, well, that's what we do.  But, honestly, does anybody out there think that these guys are not the best, most well-trained people to do this job, and that maybe, just maybe, its an unbelievably difficult job that they all do pretty darn well?

 

There are 22 players on the field and 7 referees, and each of them has about 10-15 things they have to keep their eye on every play.  Isn't kind of ridiculous that we expect them to be 100% correct 100% of the time?

I think they do a really good job of taking a look every offseason to see what to improve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 

They deal with situations every off-season that came up the previous year and tweak and refine rules as necessary.  This year, for example, they'll obviously take a look at the reviewability of fumble recoveries.

 

I think one of the proposals is to make officiating a full time job.  Right now these guys are part-timers.  I don't really get how that will change anything because its not like there are games during the offseason, but that's one thing that's been proposed to try to make them better

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourputt View Post
 

 

Add 2 more refs who do nothing but sit in a booth and watch the game feed on monitors.  Give them a direct link to the referee to stop play when they see a bad call, or a penalty which should have been called.  Those two see the same feed we do at home, and would hopefully catch 99% of those obvious blown calls.  The NFL can afford to pay them, but I don't think that they can afford to continue to ignore the problem.

 

This is where replay has to go.  Everything reviewable (well, almost, golfingdad makes good points about holding and such) by an additional ref sitting up in the booth.  No challenges.  Review ever play without stopping the play.  If the guy upstairs thinks something is wrong, he just makes the call.  No need for the guys on the field to take the time to check.

 

I'm really disappointed that baseball is going to the replay with manager's challenges.  I'm a traditionalist and sort of like the human error part of the game, but if we're going reply just have an eye in the sky.  Its stupid to add the challenges.

post #909 of 1006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsc123 View Post
 

I'm really disappointed that baseball is going to the replay with manager's challenges.  I'm a traditionalist and sort of like the human error part of the game, but if we're going reply just have an eye in the sky.  Its stupid to add the challenges.

I kind of agree with you on this ... although I do think they are not playing up the biggest and best part of this whole thing:  We're never again going to see a manager come waddling out of the dugout to argue bad calls.  They either challenge it or they stay put and stay quiet.  Obviously there will still be the knock down drag outs you see after a guy gets tossed for mouthing off over balls and strikes, but the arguments over bad calls on the field will be a thing of the past.

 

Sorry, I know ... :offtopic:

post #910 of 1006
Thread Starter 

Not to beat the dead horse, but they released the audio of the Sherman/Crabtree exchange right after the game.  Probably not nearly as inappropriate as most would have guessed.  For that matter, not really inappropriate at all.  The timing was suspect, obviously, and the stuff he said on air afterwards was still uncalled for, but that on field exchange ... probably not what you thought.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/did-richard-sherman-michael-crabtree-now-know-thanks-160656745--nfl.html?vp=1

 

P.S.  They're still not giving the linebacker enough credit on that play.  Had he not been there to intercept it, the ball falls incomplete and its simply 2nd down.

 

P.P.S.  Who else is excited about Rice v. Deion in the Pro Bowl?!?!?!?  Yeah, me neither.

post #911 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 

P.P.S.  Who else is excited about Rice v. Deion in the Pro Bowl?!?!?!?  Yeah, me neither.

I have no idea why they insist on playing the pro bowl. Nobody cares. This Deion vs Rice thing I hope is a last ditch effort before the give it up.

post #912 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by mchepp View Post
 

I have no idea why they insist on playing the pro bowl. Nobody cares. This Deion vs Rice thing I hope is a last ditch effort before the give it up.

 

Not to mention all the crazy clock rules they are going to try out during the Pro Bowl this year. Generally speaking, I'm not a big fan of any all star games, regardless of the sport. Despite the NFL being the most popular sport in America, it probably has the worst all-star game.

post #913 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by geauxforbroke View Post
 

 

Not to mention all the crazy clock rules they are going to try out during the Pro Bowl this year. Generally speaking, I'm not a big fan of any all star games, regardless of the sport. Despite the NFL being the most popular sport in America, it probably has the worst all-star game.


Yeah, football wasn't meant to be played without any hitting. I seldom watch the game but last year I must not have had anything better to do and watched as much as I could take of it...Which wasn't all that much.

 

Looked like the Thursday practice without pads or defense at the local high school.

post #914 of 1006
I'd rather watch the pro bowlers play a round of golf.
post #915 of 1006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonTheSavage View Post

I'd rather watch the pro bowlers play a round of golf.
So would I ... Walter Ray Williams is (or was at least) a 2 handicap. ;)
post #916 of 1006
While in some ways it would be great to review anything and everything, does anyone really want games to take 6 hours?
post #917 of 1006
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by smellysell View Post

While in some ways it would be great to review anything and everything, does anyone really want games to take 6 hours?

Not really.  I think we're all thinking of the college style, which has a ref or two in the booth watching everything just as we are at home, and they buzz down to the ref on the field only in situations that require a second look.  The games aren't that much longer.

post #918 of 1006
Quote:
Originally Posted by smellysell View Post

While in some ways it would be great to review anything and everything, does anyone really want games to take 6 hours?

 

According to this blog post, the average review takes just over 2 minutes. Change the format to replay officials (similar to college football), and I think you can cut that down significantly. But for argument's sake, let's say the amount of time for a review doesn't change. In 2013, the average NFL game lasted 3 hours and 10 minutes and featured 1.6 reviews. Let's say the number of reviews goes up to 10 per game, which is probably a stretch, you're looking at about 18 more minutes. You're now looking at the average NFL game lasting 3 and a half hours. Not a material change, especially when you consider that added time comes with more accurate officiating. 

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