or Connect
TheSandTrap.com › Golf Forum › The Pro Shop › Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting › Graphite or steel shaft for irons?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Graphite or steel shaft for irons? - Page 2

post #19 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post


Id love to see some proof that backs up any of those claims.

A) The fact that graphite irons dampen feedback is a big reason why people use them at all. They dampen vibrations. I guess I could look it up, or you could go to your local Golfsmith, find unused graphite and steel shafts, and tap them on a table.

B) Not sure I can put a number on the fact that I lose the feeling of lighter-shafted clubs (which all graphite-shafter irons on the market are as far as I can tell). Happens with some lighter drivers too.

C) I guess graphite shafts don't have to be whippier, but all of the current iron models are exceedingly so.
post #20 of 35
OEM graphite shafts are notoriously light and for the most part have a reputation for being inconsistent

Aftermarket shafts or OEM upgrades are available - heavier shafts and more consistency.

Aerotech steel fiber shafts, which Sneds and Kuchar use are in the 70-110g range, some have a lower torque than steel, and are consistent. The wedge shafts are in the 125 g range

It consists of a graphite core with micro steel bands making up the finish.

It is best to have someone who knows Aerotech shafts to fit and install
post #21 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post

A) The fact that graphite irons dampen feedback is a big reason why people use them at all. They dampen vibrations. I guess I could look it up, or you could go to your local Golfsmith, find unused graphite and steel shafts, and tap them on a table.

B) Not sure I can put a number on the fact that I lose the feeling of lighter-shafted clubs (which all graphite-shafter irons on the market are as far as I can tell). Happens with some lighter drivers too.

C) I guess graphite shafts don't have to be whippier, but all of the current iron models are exceedingly so.
A) that's a bad thing
B) not sure what you are saying
C) they are because the people that need them usually need a whipper shaft. Not necessarily. Personally, I need a lighter shaft, but a stiffer shaft
post #22 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick1998bunker View Post

A) that's a bad thing
B) not sure what you are saying
C) they are because the people that need them usually need a whipper shaft. Not necessarily. Personally, I need a lighter shaft, but a stiffer shaft

C'mon man, please read. I wasn't replying to you, I was specifically responding to GaijinGolfer who asked me to explain my assertions.
post #23 of 35

The control of a steel shaft is in reference to the club head staying in line with the shaft plane. Minimal toe droop, minimal head twist, and greater consistency for returning a great swing to the ball as close to the expected "spot" as possible. However; while this gives those with a great swing a more predictable pattern for various shots it does not mean that it is easier to control the club in its entirety. Control of the swing plane, when and how the head is released into the ball, a back swing, and so on are up to the golfer.

Therefore my humble opinion is that lighter is better for those of us that aren't single digit cappers or pros. It is simply easier to control the swinging of the club with a lighter shaft. The desired "feel" of the club can be accommodated with swing weighting, counter balancing, and/or club head design. A golf buddy plays Yonex graphite (he plays to a 5) and Ive tried them at the range and on the course. They "feel" like steel and do provide some additional distance for me. However: I have a single plane/S&T hybrid that seems to perform better with a light steel shaft. Again, its about feel and perception. I am not a great player so my misses are the same with all shafts.

post #24 of 35

I think this from Golfsmith.com sums it up pretty well:

 

 

Tiger Woods is a man of steel, but that doesn't mean you should be. What about amateurs? Are steel or graphite shafts better? There is not a clear-cut answer because both have advantages and disadvantages. In almost all cases, your driver and fairway woods will have graphite shafts. The real question comes down to the irons. The status quo has always been that professionals and low-handicap golfers use steel shafts, while amateurs and beginners benefit more from graphite shafts. This is not necessarily the case these days.

Benefits of Steel Shafts

The main benefit of the steel-shafted club is it imparts more vibrations up the shaft to the player's hands. Skilled players often desire this feedback. A skilled player can often tell what they may have done wrong or right by the feel of the swing and impact; more so than a beginner. The steel-shafted club is heavier than the graphite club. Players with a high swing speed may find that this fits their swing tempo better and allows them more control. Players who tend to swing too fast also will benefit from heavier clubs. Steel-shafted clubs are less expensive than graphite clubs.

Disadvantages of Steel Shafts

Mishit shots are apt to leave one's hands stinging due to the vibrations imparted through the shaft. The heavier weight will slightly reduce swing speed, resulting in a difference of up to 4 miles per hour that translates into a loss of about 10 yards. Steel- shafted clubs are more likely to irritate chronic hand, arm or shoulder problems than a graphite club, due to the weight and rigidity.

Benefits of Graphite Shafts

Graphite shafts are lighter than steel shafts, resulting in an increase in swing speed and distance. This is particularly beneficial to players with slow swing tempos. Most golfers can realize an increase of at least 5 yards for each club. Graphite shafts are easier to swing for someone who has hand, arm or shoulder problems. Vibrations are muffled on mishits and less painful.

Disadvantages of Graphite Shafts

Graphite shafts are less rigid than steel shafts and tend to have more whip and flexibility. Though this can be an advantage for a player with a well-grooved swing, it also can exaggerate the problems of a poor swing and may affect accuracy. Graphite shafts are more expensive and typically add about 15 percent to 20 percent to the cost of a set of irons.

Considerations

The choice comes down to what feels best for you and the skill level you have in your game. It is no longer true that steel shafts are more durable than graphite shafts. Either set will last a lifetime if your equipment is treated properly. Graphite shafts get the edge in the "last set of clubs I'll ever own" department because they tend to be easier to use for elderly golfers. Take time in deciding on your personal preference. Try out a lot of clubs, a lot of times. Quality clubs are a significant investment and should last many years.

post #25 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derrick Parker View Post
 

I think this from Golfsmith.com sums it up pretty well:

 

 

Tiger Woods is a man of steel, but that doesn't mean you should be. What about amateurs? Are steel or graphite shafts better? There is not a clear-cut answer because both have advantages and disadvantages. In almost all cases, your driver and fairway woods will have graphite shafts. The real question comes down to the irons. The status quo has always been that professionals and low-handicap golfers use steel shafts, while amateurs and beginners benefit more from graphite shafts. This is not necessarily the case these days.

Benefits of Steel Shafts

The main benefit of the steel-shafted club is it imparts more vibrations up the shaft to the player's hands. Skilled players often desire this feedback. A skilled player can often tell what they may have done wrong or right by the feel of the swing and impact; more so than a beginner. The steel-shafted club is heavier than the graphite club. Players with a high swing speed may find that this fits their swing tempo better and allows them more control. Players who tend to swing too fast also will benefit from heavier clubs. Steel-shafted clubs are less expensive than graphite clubs.

Disadvantages of Steel Shafts

Mishit shots are apt to leave one's hands stinging due to the vibrations imparted through the shaft. The heavier weight will slightly reduce swing speed, resulting in a difference of up to 4 miles per hour that translates into a loss of about 10 yards. Steel- shafted clubs are more likely to irritate chronic hand, arm or shoulder problems than a graphite club, due to the weight and rigidity.

Benefits of Graphite Shafts

Graphite shafts are lighter than steel shafts, resulting in an increase in swing speed and distance. This is particularly beneficial to players with slow swing tempos. Most golfers can realize an increase of at least 5 yards for each club. Graphite shafts are easier to swing for someone who has hand, arm or shoulder problems. Vibrations are muffled on mishits and less painful.

Disadvantages of Graphite Shafts

Graphite shafts are less rigid than steel shafts and tend to have more whip and flexibility. Though this can be an advantage for a player with a well-grooved swing, it also can exaggerate the problems of a poor swing and may affect accuracy. Graphite shafts are more expensive and typically add about 15 percent to 20 percent to the cost of a set of irons.

Considerations

The choice comes down to what feels best for you and the skill level you have in your game. It is no longer true that steel shafts are more durable than graphite shafts. Either set will last a lifetime if your equipment is treated properly. Graphite shafts get the edge in the "last set of clubs I'll ever own" department because they tend to be easier to use for elderly golfers. Take time in deciding on your personal preference. Try out a lot of clubs, a lot of times. Quality clubs are a significant investment and should last many years.

Don't agree.

 

See above post re Aerotech Steelfibers

post #26 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond View Post

Don't agree.

See above post re Aerotech Steelfibers

How can you disagree with a post that closes with this:

"The choice comes down to what feels best for you and the skill level you have in your game."
post #27 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernest Jones View Post


How can you disagree with a post that closes with this:

"The choice comes down to what feels best for you and the skill level you have in your game."

Because as we all know, "feel isn't real."

 

:dance:

post #28 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick1998bunker View Post

You tell us what the benefits of graphite is?


I already have.  Just for you, I'll repeat though: theyre lighter, so you get more clubhead speed and more distance.

post #29 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamo View Post


A) The fact that graphite irons dampen feedback is a big reason why people use them at all. They dampen vibrations. I guess I could look it up, or you could go to your local Golfsmith, find unused graphite and steel shafts, and tap them on a table.

B) Not sure I can put a number on the fact that I lose the feeling of lighter-shafted clubs (which all graphite-shafter irons on the market are as far as I can tell). Happens with some lighter drivers too.

C) I guess graphite shafts don't have to be whippier, but all of the current iron models are exceedingly so.


Im going to dispell the myth that is a) right now: vibration in the shaft has NOTHING to do with feel.  Its all the vibration of the clubhead and the noise is makes that forms our perception of feel.  Its not as if your perception of feel is from the vibrations that come up through the shaft because at best, those vibrations are dampened out by the grip.  Next!

post #30 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post


I already have.  Just for you, I'll repeat though: theyre lighter, so you get more clubhead speed and more distance.
But if the shaft is way to light you have no control. It feels similar to swinging a headless shaft
post #31 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post


Im going to dispell the myth that is a) right now: vibration in the shaft has NOTHING to do with feel.  Its all the vibration of the clubhead and the noise is makes that forms our perception of feel.  Its not as if your perception of feel is from the vibrations that come up through the shaft because at best, those vibrations are dampened out by the grip.  Next!

I didn't say the word "feel" once.
post #32 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post
 


I already have.  Just for you, I'll repeat though: theyre lighter, so you get more clubhead speed and more distance.

So this could be and advantage to those who want/need more speed and distance. I don't need either so I like to go with steel shafts in my irons. What is good for one golfer doesn't make it good for all golfers. I used to have graphite shafts in a previous set of irons. I didn't like how they felt, but that's just personal preference. Also, there is a threshold for a lot of people where when something is too light they have less control. Others have mentioned this already. 

post #33 of 35

I changed to AeroTech composite from PX 5.0. The composite AreoTechs feel like graphite. I changed when I got tennis elbow. Love the shafts. They allowed me to practice without pain or fear of injury. Now that I'm mostly better, I still really like them. At 95 grams, they are lighter than the steal I was playing (PX 5.0 is lighter than many shafts at 115). I really like the feel of my irons with 95 gram shafts. I do not think I have lost the "feel of the clubhead" even though my swing weight dropped a few points. I have maintained the distance control that had me switch to MP-53 heads from the longer and more forgiving (but slightly less distant-consistent) JPX 800 Pros.

 

To the OP: these higher end graphite and composite shafts are a bit pricy and worth looking at for their weight/torque benefits. There are many good options available. Just in the AeroTechs you can choose a weight from 125 down to 70. If you are looking to drop shaft weight under 100 grams, look to graphite for great options. If you are not going to get fitted (I did not because my injury made my swing irrelevant), I attached a link to their chart for shaft selection based on driver swing speeds. Better than nothing. I went with i95 stiff soft stepped once. This board and others suggest that they play "stiff to flex" meaning they feel stiffer than rated. Soft stepping makes me feel a bit better knowing that I'm not playing the same weight and flex as two top tour pros who both play i95 stiff.

 

http://www.aerotechgolfshafts.com/steelfiber_irons_sp.php

 

In my uneducated opinion, I think weight is the most import selection criteria for iron shafts. More than material, flex, torque, flex profile... I may be wrong, but I know that I notice weight more than any of those other factors. I believe this is particularly true as you get into shorter irons. I challenge anyone north of a 5 handicap to tell the difference between a stiff and regular flex shaft in an 8-iron. 

post #34 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post
 


Im going to dispell the myth that is a) right now: vibration in the shaft has NOTHING to do with feel.  Its all the vibration of the clubhead and the noise is makes that forms our perception of feel.  Its not as if your perception of feel is from the vibrations that come up through the shaft because at best, those vibrations are dampened out by the grip.  Next!


Nah. You thin a 3-iron in the cold and you'll feel those vibrations coming up your club shaft.

post #35 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer View Post
 


Im going to dispell the myth that is a) right now: vibration in the shaft has NOTHING to do with feel.  Its all the vibration of the clubhead and the noise is makes that forms our perception of feel.  Its not as if your perception of feel is from the vibrations that come up through the shaft because at best, those vibrations are dampened out by the grip.  Next!


I can FEEL a mishit on either the graphite shafts or the steel shafts in my bag.

 

Neither is much affected by the club grip, rather primarily by the severity of the mishit, secondarily the type of clubhead, and lastly by the shaft.

 

Example (in descending order of harshness):

 

1. MB blade with steel shaft

2. GI or SGI iron with steel shaft

3. Steel metalwood with steel shaft

4. Steel metalwood with graphite shaft

 

ALL with new quality grips.

 

YMMV, but I doubt it. :whistle: 

 

BTW- I have noticed that there is very little "feel" (aside from shaft torque) in my steel shafted laminated maple woods... but great audible feedback!

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
TheSandTrap.com › Golf Forum › The Pro Shop › Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting › Graphite or steel shaft for irons?