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Somebody played /stole my ball

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 

Hi to all,

 

today at the first hole, i hit my driver left to the rough, while i was walking towards my ball, another player playing the 7th hole whose drive had gone way left was (i think) pretty close to where my ball was, but i didn´t pay too much attention........... until i arrived and saw my ball was not there. I am sure he played my ball or just picked it.

 

The thing is, when this happens and you can´t go back to the tee to play your third shot because of all the time it takes you, can you place a new ball to the closest position you think your first ball was and still have a legal score in that hole?

 

I play in Spain so i guess i am under St. Andrews rules.

 

What i did was write an "X" in my scorecard for that hole, it makes me so ungry to play  a round and not being to go back home and say "i made an 82, 84,.... (whatever) today".

 

Thanks a lot for your help.

post #2 of 14

these MAY apply IF you are "virtually certain" he stole the ball.  If there is a chance it was simply lost in the rough, then going back to the tee is your only option.

 

 

18-1. By Outside Agency

If a ball at rest is moved by an outside agency, there is no penalty and the ball must be replaced.

Note: It is a question of fact whether a ball has been moved by an outside agency. In order to apply this Rule, it must be known or virtually certain that anoutside agency has moved the ball. In the absence of such knowledge or certainty, the player must play the ball as it lies or, if the ball is not found, proceed under Rule 27-1.

 

18-1/5

Ball Stolen by Outside Agency from Unknown Spot

Q.At a par-3 hole, part of the green and the adjoining area cannot be seen from the tee. In this unseen area are a bunker, fairway and a dry water hazard.

A player plays towards this obscured area and cannot tell where the ball comes to rest. When the players are near the green, they see a boy running away with a ball in his hand. The boy throws the ball back and the player identifies it as his ball.

The player is unable to determine from where to play his next stroke under Rule 18-1. He does not know whether the ball was on the green, on the fairway or in one of the hazards.

How should he proceed?

A.As it was impossible to know where the ball should have been replaced under Rule 18-1, the player should, in equity (Rule 1-4), drop the ball in an area which was neither the most, nor the least, favorable of the various areas where it was equally possible that the ball originally lay.

post #3 of 14
Quote:

Originally Posted by lugonza_2001 View Post
 

I play in Spain so i guess i am under St. Andrews rules

.

 

The St Andrews rules (ie the R&A) are the same rules as in the US (USGA).

 

As said above you have to know or be virtually certain he moved the ball.

 

You can't always guarantee to find a ball in 7cm rough.

 

Did you or anyone else see him?

 

"but i didn´t pay too much attention" may be a killer. 

post #4 of 14

This has happened to me.  I saw a player from an adjacent hole play a ball from where I was sure my ball landed, as did my playing partner.  I dropped at the spot where he hit.  He realized he played my ball a few minutes later and drove over and gave me my ball back.  18-1 applies.

post #5 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

This has happened to me.  I saw a player from an adjacent hole play a ball from where I was sure my ball landed, as did my playing partner.  I dropped at the spot where he hit.  He realized he played my ball a few minutes later and drove over and gave me my ball back.  18-1 applies.

 

Only as long as you have virtual certainty that someone did indeed pick up your ball.  The same as with a water hazard, you can't make the assumption without overwhelming evidence.

post #6 of 14

We saw my ball land and were walking to it.  It is a very open area, and it was clear he just played my ball.  The other guys ball was also found a few yards away.

post #7 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

We saw my ball land and were walking to it.  It is a very open area, and it was clear he just played my ball.  The other guys ball was also found a few yards away.

Sounds like you had much more evidence of "virtual certainty" than the OP

post #8 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

We saw my ball land and were walking to it.  It is a very open area, and it was clear he just played my ball.  The other guys ball was also found a few yards away.

 

 I just posting that for the OP.  Your's was fairly apparent.  By his description, he did not have virtual certainty.

post #9 of 14

Long ago I had a similar situation but I was in a tournament.  I walked 100 yards over to the green of the adjacent hole and asked if anyone perhaps had played my ball and described the mark, brand and unique logo.  Everyone looked at me like I had just transported in from Mars and did not say a word.  I walked around the green looking at each ball and when I found mine I picked it up and walked away.  Yes, I was virtually certain.

post #10 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkuehn1952 View Post
 

Yes, I was virtually certain.

I would have thought you would 'know' in that case.

post #11 of 14

Greenskeeper that was raking a fairway bunker took mine the other day. After we all tee off, he goes driving across the fairway to an adjacent hole, running my ball over in the process. When he realized what he's done, he walks back and pulls it out of the ground and wipes it off on the ground. I think to myself, "well at least he cleaned it off for me", only to watch him then stick it in his pocket and drive off.

post #12 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rulesman View Post
 

I would have thought you would 'know' in that case.

Well, I was waiting for one of the gentlemen to protest that they also happened to be playing a Titleist 4 with a red blotch on the "T's" and a Hudson's logo (former Midwestern retailer).  That would have been an interesting discussion.

post #13 of 14

This is one of the awesome reasons I switched to yellow balls with lots of personal marks. My ball may be stollen but never mistaken as yours.

 

Years ago, I watched a guy drive his cart from his fairway, into the middle of my fairway, and play my ball. I was playing a TaylorMade when they were very rare -- first year out. "Oh, I thought it was a Titleist." Never again. I guess someone could say, "Oh. I thought I hit it so hard that it turned yellow."

post #14 of 14
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rulesman View Post

The St Andrews rules (ie the R&A) are the same rules as in the US (USGA).

As said above you have to know or be virtually certain he moved the ball.

You can't always guarantee to find a ball in 7cm rough.

Did you or anyone else see him?

"but i didn´t pay too much attention" may be a killer. 


Thank you very much for your help and comments.

I do not have virtual certain he picked my ball, although the person i was playing with was quite sure he did.

Anyway now i know how to proceed if this happens to me again.

Thanks again
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