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Simon Dyson DQed at BMW Masters - Page 2

post #19 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernest Jones View Post
 

I think that Rory was using traditional spikes as recently as 2011-12, not sure about now. I just remember a tweet from Poulter whining about spike marks and the "posers" who still insist on steel spikes, Rory replied with a tweet basically mocking Poulter for not having a high enough SS to justify spikes.

 

Edit* Nike site says Rory wears Lunar Control shoes. He may or may not have these spikes in them though, can't find a pic that's big enough to say.

Tri-Lock with steel spike.

That's annoying.  They invented the soft spike so you could make 3 much smaller marks on the green instead of one big hole, not so you could make 3 small marks AND one big hole.  Way to tear up all the greens Rory!!

post #20 of 60

USGA (or whoever) regulates away old-fashioned grooves but allows this.  Stupid.

post #21 of 60

Looks like there might be more coming to Dyson...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/10410193/Simon-Dyson-faces-Dubai-heartache-after-BMW-Masters-disqualification.html

 

Quote:
Simon Dyson is facing a possible fine or suspension after the European Tour confirmed that it would conduct a review of the events surrounding his disqualification from the BMW Masters tournament in Shanghai last week.
post #22 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by krupa View Post
 

Looks like there might be more coming to Dyson...

 

 

 

And rightly so.

To my eye, this was a blatant attempt at cheating.

He did it so quickly he thought it wouldn't get picked up.

He deserves what's coming to him, especially the scorn of his fellow competitors.

post #23 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

 

I'm going with brain freeze. I don't think it was a conscious thing he did.  If he really wanted to fix a mark in his line then he would follow the procedure of the unwritten rule.

 

I am just a guy who plays golf and I don't do it for a living. And I can think of countless times I have gone to mark my ball and seen a spike mark in front of it and thought, damn, that thing is right in my line. But I never once just unconsciously did what Dyson did. I'm guessing he knew what he was doing.

post #24 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by phan52 View Post
 

 

I am just a guy who plays golf and I don't do it for a living. And I can think of countless times I have gone to mark my ball and seen a spike mark in front of it and thought, damn, that thing is right in my line. But I never once just unconsciously did what Dyson did. I'm guessing he knew what he was doing.

Fair point ... I am usually the same way.  You see a spike mark and the normal thought process is "That is a spike mark, and its in my line ... crap!"  However, that is the exact reason why some of us are suggesting bran freeze.  We find it hard to believe that anybody (a casual golfer like me who plays 25 times a year, one like you who plays 50-60 times a year, and especially a pro who plays hundreds of rounds a year, many on worldwide television) would consciously make a decision to tamp a spike mark so blatantly like that, so we think (maybe hope is now a better word) that it is due to brain freeze.  As in, he's not thinking at all.

 

One example I can think of is a situation where late at night, probably due to exhaustion, I pull up to a green light and stop.  Only after my wife says "Um, what are you doing, its green?" do I realize it.  I wasn't thinking "Hey, this light is green, I should stop for no reason."  I simply wasn't thinking at all.  My mind was elsewhere.  (Luckily I've never done the opposite ;))

 

-------------------

 

Anyway, I'm curious as to why the other players seemed to, so quickly, jump to the conclusion that he's a cheater.  I wonder if their review process will include interviews with other players, maybe even watching old video, to see if this isn't a one-time thing?  Because, and maybe I'm being too nice here, it seems to me that DQ from the event is plently of punishment if it's the first time he's ever done anything like that.  (Unless he were to admit that he did it consciously, of course)

post #25 of 60

I've had brain freeze plenty of times. That doesn't look like brain freeze (unless he's always done it).

post #26 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 

I've had brain freeze plenty of times. That doesn't look like brain freeze (unless he's always done it).

I'm not quite sure what you mean about "unless he's always done it?"

 

Also, in your experience, what does brain freeze look like?  (That probably sounds smart-alecky ... it's not meant to)

 

Thirdly, like I hinted at last post ... I think the reason some of us jump to that option so quickly is because we want that to be the answer, because what is the alternative?  He intentionally cheated, right?  Who wants to think that anybody making a living on any of the pro tours is intentionally cheating?

post #27 of 60

The first time I watched this, I thought he might have had a brain freeze because he was upset he missed the putt.  I watched it over a few times and it appears that he's looking at the spike mark as he's walking up, which was a pretty big mark and easily seen in low res from a poor camera angle.   He could have been lost in thought at missing the putt but unlike Tiger, it was obvious the mark was there and he used the ball to tap it down.  Even if it wasn't in a tournament, that's a violation of rules and there's no reason for him to ever tap down a spike mark on his line.

post #28 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post
 

I'm not quite sure what you mean about "unless he's always done it?"

 

Also, in your experience, what does brain freeze look like?  (That probably sounds smart-alecky ... it's not meant to)

 

Thirdly, like I hinted at last post ... I think the reason some of us jump to that option so quickly is because we want that to be the answer, because what is the alternative?  He intentionally cheated, right?  Who wants to think that anybody making a living on any of the pro tours is intentionally cheating?

1. If he's done that in casual rounds for years it would look like brain freeze to me. I know an older guy that rolls the ball forward an inch or two with his putter before he putts. I honestly don't think he even knows he is doing it he's done it for so long.

 

2. Brain freeze is doing something subconsciously or neglecting to do something subconsciously when we should know better if we were thinking. (At least in the hillbilly English I speak). That looked like a conscious move to me.

 

3. I'm with you on wanting it to be brain freeze and I hope it was. Just doesn't look like it to me.

post #29 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 

1. If he's done that in casual rounds for years it would look like brain freeze to me. I know an older guy that rolls the ball forward an inch or two with his putter before he putts. I honestly don't think he even knows he is doing it he's done it for so long.

Gotcha.  Sort of why I came to the realization last year that I really, really had to start paying attention to everything that I was doing in ALL rounds so I didn't flub up by doing something really stupid during a tournament.  Such as ...

 

In my 3rd or 4th tournament last season, I was paired with a really nice guy who was playing in his first.  He was playing somewhere in the mediocre-to-poor range when we got to our 9th (#18) hole of the day.  A par 4, he missed the green and chipped on.  Then he missed his first putt by about 5 feet or so.  Instead of marking it, he just walked up to it and hit it ... like somebody would if they were disgusted and were planning on picking up after that putt, miss or make.  Well, he missed that one too.  Then he reached across the hole to try and tap it in from an awkward angle, missed.  Tried again to hit it from where he stood, this time back the other direction, so he's kinda standing left-handed, and he barely even waited for the ball to stop moving from the last one.  Somewhere after this, he finally put it in.  I think he 6-putted, and 5 of them were from 4 or 5 feet, and all due to the fact that he stopped thinking, forgot he was in a tournament, and didn't just take a breath and relax.  A brain freeze, enabled by the fact that in casual rounds, that is what he'd do.  Miss a short-ish putt, and then just drag it in, or pick it up, or something other than what the rules require.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 

2. Brain freeze is doing something subconsciously or neglecting to do something subconsciously when we should know better if we were thinking. (At least in the hillbilly English I speak). That looked like a conscious move to me.

OK, yep, that's my definition too.  I'm just not sure how to tell if it was conscious or not from the limited amount of video.

post #30 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

Here it is.

 

 

Now them's some manly spikes!  :smartass:

 

 

When I looked at the video, it made me suspicious.  The super-speed tap and turn away just looked like something a person would do who was trying not to be noticed while doing it.  I like to give any player the benefit of the doubt, so I'm not saying any more than that until further information might come available.

post #31 of 60
What a cheater. I hope he is suspended.
post #32 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfingdad View Post

One example I can think of is a situation where late at night, probably due to exhaustion, I pull up to a green light and stop.  Only after my wife says "Um, what are you doing, its green?" do I realize it.  I wasn't thinking "Hey, this light is green, I should stop for no reason."  I simply wasn't thinking at all.  My mind was elsewhere.  (Luckily I've never done the opposite ;))

Lol. I've done that often. I've also sat at stop signs waiting patiently for them to "change".
post #33 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernest Jones View Post


Lol. I've done that often. I've also sat at stop signs waiting patiently for them to "change".

I had been known to do that back when I was in college, but I think my brain was more fried than frozen. :whistle:

post #34 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty View Post
 

And rightly so.

To my eye, this was a blatant attempt at cheating.

He did it so quickly he thought it wouldn't get picked up.

He deserves what's coming to him, especially the scorn of his fellow competitors.


Bull. He was called on it, he accepted it, he was DQ'd. End of story but now, somehow, you think he should have an additional penalty outside of what is proscribed for what he did? Come on.

post #35 of 60

It looked completely deliberate and not particularly sneaky to me, I think he straight up didn't know it was against the rules.

post #36 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by misty_mountainhop View Post
 


Bull. He was called on it, he accepted it, he was DQ'd. End of story but now, somehow, you think he should have an additional penalty outside of what is proscribed for what he did? Come on.

 

Seems Dyson might have had a few violations this year?

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/10416403/Simon-Dyson-facing-prospect-of-European-Tour-ban-following-his-disqualification-from-the-BMW-Masters.html

Quote:
 After an initial report that claimed he had “no recollection” of the incident, officials are understood to have collected evidence on other violations of which Dyson, a six-time winner on tour, has been accused this season.

The three-man committee deciding the 35-year-old’s sanction will comprise a lawyer, a former player and an administrator, and are likely to meet soon after next month’s season-ending World Tour Championship in Dubai.

 

Or not....

 

http://golfweek.com/news/2013/nov/01/sources-european-tour-unlikely-expel-dyson/

 

Quote:
Speaking on condition of anonymity, sources told Golfweek that Dyson is unlikely to face any further penalty.

“Simon has no previous record of anything like this,” one English European Tour player said. “I’ve never heard any rumors about anything dodgy in his past. He’s a good lad. We all know you can’t tap down spike marks. All I can think is that he’s just made a mental error at the time.”
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