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Newbie Driver Problems - Page 2

post #19 of 36
i'm 5'8" and i cut my driver down 1 inch and that helped considerably. i think shorter guys need that.
post #20 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

Maybe i am missing something but I don't see a description of your miss with driver. What are you trying to correct? Distance? A slice? A hook? Body shift is just one part but your upper body may be the issue to. Especially if your left shoulder is dipping. This would prevent you from being able to generate any power and getting the club face square with the ball.

Sorry I was not very clear. When I first started, I would make consistent contact, but hit the ball around 100-150 yards with a massive slice (consistently). At this point, after working on flattening my swing more (I was very much upright with not enough body rotation), I can hit a few straight drives here and there, but I am usually not making good contact, not delivering much power, not generating enough distance, not launching the ball in a straight line, and still slicing here and there. The club contact often feels heavy and hard. I sky the ball and top the ball too…  J

 

Now, I can hit my 3-wood pretty decently (increasingly). There are only 3 differences I am aware of :

-          Shaft length (43” vs. 45.75”)

-          Loft (15 vs. 10.5)

-          Club Head size

post #21 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lajito64 View Post

i'm 5'8" and i cut my driver down 1 inch and that helped considerably. i think shorter guys need that.

I have been wondering for some time if my height (5'7") requires me to utilize different techniques or different equipment. However, I know there are shorter players who do just fine as well. I did try choking down on the driver, but that did not seem to help. I think I am going to focus on my swing mechanics first before I start cutting my driver down and what not..

post #22 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 

I have been wondering for some time if my height (5'7") requires me to utilize different techniques or different equipment. However, I know there are shorter players who do just fine as well. I did try choking down on the driver, but that did not seem to help. I think I am going to focus on my swing mechanics first before I start cutting my driver down and what not..

 

Equipment wouldn't be all that different, maybe flatter lie angles but technique wouldn't be any different, Ian Woosnam and Gene Sarazen had all 5 Keys ;-)  You can give a good player a set of ladies clubs and he would still hit the ball first, hit it solid, equipment only does so much.

post #23 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

 

Equipment wouldn't be all that different, maybe flatter lie angles but technique wouldn't be any different, Ian Woosnam and Gene Sarazen had all 5 Keys ;-)  You can give a good player a set of ladies clubs and he would still hit the ball first, hit it solid, equipment only does so much.


Thanks for mentioning these guys. I know Jbe Kruger on the European tour is also shorter (5'5"). So I guess its not my height. Most likely still a swing mechanics issue..

post #24 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

 

Equipment wouldn't be all that different, maybe flatter lie angles but technique wouldn't be any different, Ian Woosnam and Gene Sarazen had all 5 Keys ;-)  You can give a good player a set of ladies clubs and he would still hit the ball first, hit it solid, equipment only does so much.


Thanks for mentioning these guys. I know Jbe Kruger on the European tour is also shorter (5'5"). So I guess its not my height. Most likely still a swing mechanics issue..

 

The fact that your club feels "heavy and hard" leads me to think you are using your arms more than your body.

 

I would try to follow the threads pertaining to 5SK, as Mike (mvmac) mentioned, and PM Mike and/or Erik.

post #25 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 

Sorry I was not very clear. When I first started, I would make consistent contact, but hit the ball around 100-150 yards with a massive slice (consistently). At this point, after working on flattening my swing more (I was very much upright with not enough body rotation), I can hit a few straight drives here and there, but I am usually not making good contact, not delivering much power, not generating enough distance, not launching the ball in a straight line, and still slicing here and there. The club contact often feels heavy and hard. I sky the ball and top the ball too…  J

 

Now, I can hit my 3-wood pretty decently (increasingly). There are only 3 differences I am aware of :

-          Shaft length (43” vs. 45.75”)

-          Loft (15 vs. 10.5)

-          Club Head size

Cutting a club is not going to help you. Sounds like you are trying to generate power without tempo. You should post a video or have someone look at your swing path but it sounds like what some of the posts are describing, all hands and no body. No body means it can't get out of the way and the hands have to come out and around. Causes a outside to in swing path which usually results in a slice. And the club weight is because you're trying to swing with your hands (small muscles) rather than you core (big muscles).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL_6M_xZvq0

 

This video made a big difference in my swing approach with driver. Fixed my slice. If your coming in over the top and dropping your left shoulder you can't hit with a square face. I helped a friend with a ridiculous slice. He couldn't visualize the direction of the slot during the swing. I recommended putting a plastic bottle of water, almost empty, to the outside of the path to force the visual on the back swing. If he cranks it over the top the club would come in from the outside and hit the bottle. Forced him to change his timing between his upper and lower body. He had to get his body out of the way to make room between hips and the water bottle.

Hope that helps.

Regards

post #26 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 

 

The fact that your club feels "heavy and hard" leads me to think you are using your arms more than your body.

 

I would try to follow the threads pertaining to 5SK, as Mike (mvmac) mentioned, and PM Mike and/or Erik.


Very good chance of that. Sometimes my arms feel a bit sore after a range session and I might have a slight case of tendonitis in my left arm (pain in outer part of arm below elbow).  At this point I am wondering if indeed my weight shift is not sufficient. It seems that I am pivoting/shifting, but perhaps I am not actually moving my hips forward enough. What throws me off though is that I make fairly decent shots with the rest of my clubs (increasingly). Not the case with driver though. I just know (intellectually) that it cannot be that hard to hit that club. Otherwise, nobody would be able to hit it. I am definitely missing something. Next session, I am going to focus hard hard on the weight shift and in slow motion to try and get the sequence (as I understand it..see below). So step 3/4 will be the focus (and challenge)..

 

Sequence being:

1) address position

    - slight bend in the knees, fairly vertical back

    - ball slightly forward (aligned with inner left foot)

    - ball tee: equator lined up with top of clubhaead

    - club head center sweet spot aligns with ball when elevated off ground

 

2) Back swing: keeping head steady, rotate shoulders and club to parallel with ground and body and then up/around..finishing with a wrist hinge of club.

 

3) Initiate weight shift: move hips to the left and rotate towards target simultaneously.

 

4) Initiate downswing: focus on ball and swing through, around and over left shoulder..

post #27 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

Cutting a club is not going to help you. Sounds like you are trying to generate power without tempo. You should post a video or have someone look at your swing path but it sounds like what some of the posts are describing, all hands and no body. No body means it can't get out of the way and the hands have to come out and around. Causes a outside to in swing path which usually results in a slice. And the club weight is because you're trying to swing with your hands (small muscles) rather than you core (big muscles).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL_6M_xZvq0

 

This video made a big difference in my swing approach with driver. Fixed my slice. If your coming in over the top and dropping your left shoulder you can't hit with a square face. I helped a friend with a ridiculous slice. He couldn't visualize the direction of the slot during the swing. I recommended putting a plastic bottle of water, almost empty, to the outside of the path to force the visual on the back swing. If he cranks it over the top the club would come in from the outside and hit the bottle. Forced him to change his timing between his upper and lower body. He had to get his body out of the way to make room between hips and the water bottle.

Hope that helps.

Regards

Thanks for your suggestions. It certainly seems like an arms vs body problem. I will work on getting a video together.

As far the Ben Hogan video, it seems that he is moving a lot of his left leg/knee inward/back during his initial back swing (0:15 in the video). Certainly more so than I do. Do you think that is a necessary part to get into proper position for lower body weight transfer pre/during downswing? To get proper leverage?

post #28 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 

Thanks for your suggestions. It certainly seems like an arms vs body problem. I will work on getting a video together.

As far the Ben Hogan video, it seems that he is moving a lot of his left leg/knee inward/back during his initial back swing (0:15 in the video). Certainly more so than I do. Do you think that is a necessary part to get into proper position for lower body weight transfer pre/during downswing? To get proper leverage?

No problem. I hope it helps. This is a great video. I reference it form time to time my myself.

I do believe that the left leg action is integral to helping the proper rotation and balance. I found it difficult to incorporate into my swing until it happened naturally. I think he used that motion to create a proper transition to his right side. Notice how he had the upward motion at the end and not a slide to the left. Reverse C. Getting his fundamentals into your swing would be a great start. Moe Norman are another great reference worth looking into regarding how to hit driver with aim. Regards.

post #29 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 


Very good chance of that. Sometimes my arms feel a bit sore after a range session and I might have a slight case of tendonitis in my left arm (pain in outer part of arm below elbow).  At this point I am wondering if indeed my weight shift is not sufficient. It seems that I am pivoting/shifting, but perhaps I am not actually moving my hips forward enough. What throws me off though is that I make fairly decent shots with the rest of my clubs (increasingly). Not the case with driver though. I just know (intellectually) that it cannot be that hard to hit that club. Otherwise, nobody would be able to hit it. I am definitely missing something. Next session, I am going to focus hard hard on the weight shift and in slow motion to try and get the sequence (as I understand it..see below). So step 3/4 will be the focus (and challenge)..

 

Sequence being:

1) address position

    - slight bend in the knees, fairly vertical back

    - ball slightly forward (aligned with inner left foot)

    - ball tee: equator lined up with top of clubhaead

    - club head center sweet spot aligns with ball when elevated off ground

 

2) Back swing: keeping head steady, rotate shoulders and club to parallel with ground and body and then up/around..finishing with a wrist hinge of club.

 

3) Initiate weight shift: move hips to the left and rotate towards target simultaneously.

 

4) Initiate downswing: focus on ball and swing through, around and over left shoulder..

 

For #1, check this thread out, beware of a "straight" back for good golf.

 Good Golf Posture (How to Address the Golf Ball) 

 

For #2, rotating the shoulders and hips parallel to the ground would cause a lot of problems.  We play golf on a tilted angle so we have to rotate on a tilted angle.  You can clearly see the golfer below turns his shoulders about 90* to his address inclination.

 

More on that

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

No problem. I hope it helps. This is a great video. I reference it form time to time my myself.

I do believe that the left leg action is integral to helping the proper rotation and balance. I found it difficult to incorporate into my swing until it happened naturally. I think he used that motion to create a proper transition to his right side. Notice how he had the upward motion at the end and not a slide to the left. Reverse C. Getting his fundamentals into your swing would be a great start. Moe Norman are another great reference worth looking into regarding how to hit driver with aim. Regards.

 

Be careful with Hogan's "fundamentals".  His book was about how he played golf.

post #30 of 36

i agree. I wouldn't hang my hat on anyone's swing theory. But Hogan, like so many others had good points. That was what i was referring to. Try it and see if the results are positive. Otherwise move on and try something else. 

post #31 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
Notice how he had the upward motion at the end and not a slide to the left. Reverse C.

 

This is interesting. I have not seen this being referred to as "upwards motion or reverse C" before. Sorta like scooping up? I am concerned about the timing/sequencing here and being able to train my body. It seems like I have to really not move arms until weight shift is way underway. In slow motion I get it, however incorporating this into a "real" swing is a whole different story.

post #32 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by baw1 View Post
 

 

This is interesting. I have not seen this being referred to as "upwards motion or reverse C" before. Sorta like scooping up? I am concerned about the timing/sequencing here and being able to train my body. It seems like I have to really not move arms until weight shift is way underway. In slow motion I get it, however incorporating this into a "real" swing is a whole different story.

 

It's all about clearing the lower body. I would suggest trying it in practice at a very easy rate and then ramp it up if it seems to work.

Search the internet about the Reverse C finish. I believe many of the old time greats had a similar finish.Especially with long clubs like driver and 3 wood. I don't think its something that you intentionally do but rather a result of a proper swing sequence. Its kind of a result of the hips and upper body finishing in the right sequence and just letting the finish go thorough to the end that looks like a Reverse C. Nicholas and Watson both credited for finishing in that manner and never heard of them getting injured form it either. I tend to have a stiff back but when i finish in that manner it actually feels like a release rather than a snap at the finish. Also take a look at some to the long drive hitters. Some finish like that too. Not recommending you try to imitate their swings. Just see if you can draw info from their technique. I have.

Regards.

post #33 of 36
Depends on the person. For me it's holding the left knee flex and dropping the arms fast. My legs are always to active, so I loose a lot of keys if I don't stabilize myself. After years of being all over the place, feeling as little movement as possible works.

Yes proper sequencing is Important. Proper turn rates and shoulder and hip incline helps a ton. Too shallow turn makes it difficult.
post #34 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:

Originally Posted by march11934 View Post

 

You should post a video

 

Ok, I have posted 2 videos below. They are taken indoors with rubber balls and shooting at a net about 12-feet away, but I think these should suffice. When I say good or bad below, I am referring to how it felt coming off the club, the sound of the ball at impact with the bulls-eye (assuming it hits the bulls-eye), and the potential trajectory/distance perceived.. Fire away.

 

video #1: Driver, 2 shots. 1st shot is bad. 2nd shot is much better.

 

video #2: 3-Wood. Decent shot

 

post #35 of 36

Please post your swing videos on this forum, once you do I'll move march's comments over there and I'll include my own.

 

http://thesandtrap.com/f/4180/member-swings

post #36 of 36
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

Please post your swing videos on this forum, once you do I'll move march's comments over there and I'll include my own.

 

http://thesandtrap.com/f/4180/member-swings


Thanks mvmac. Done: http://thesandtrap.com/t/71705/my-swing-baw1

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