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What club would you use?

post #1 of 31
Thread Starter 

So after another frustrating round - im really thinking short game actually IS my priority piece. Hit 9 GIRs today and shot 100. 3 putted 8 of the GIRs and 4 putted once. As embarassing as that is, it is actually not where majority of strokes were lost...(NOTE: Off the tee, only 1 Ball OB - every other tee shot was in fairway OR very playable rough with clear shot to pin or clear shot to good landing area on a par 5)

The disasters came on holes where I did not hit the green. On all approach shots that did not hit the green, I was (on average) 3-6 yards off (in two of these cases, that meant greenside bunker). In all of said instances today, I putted from off when possible but the majority called for some "other" shot...and that is where I start looking like a 22 handicap. Not exaggerating, from right off the green...everytime I had something in my hand other than a putter, I sculled / topped it and sent it flying all the way over the green (which in 2 cases meant into a hazard!) OR if I was lucky enough to stay on the green, I was looking at a 35-45 putt for a par which each time turned into a double bogey (3 putt). 

 

SO, my question...obviously I was making a bad stroke in these situations, that is guaranteed (since I was sculling). BUT was I using the wrong club / type of shot? I have seen all the videos posted on this site with some great instruction and I appreciate that, but I just dont feel like im "getting it" yet. I can accept not hitting a perfect chip every time because I am just not that  good BUT sculling every single one and unnecessarily adding 2-3 strokes per hole is crazy.

 

I was using either a pitching wedge or 9 iron, playing ball back in stance with weight forward and shaft leaned a little forward and just trying to keep it low and get it on the green and rolling towards the pin. In a few of these situations, the ball may have been just off green but pin was way in back, regardless I was sculling all of them.

 

I know some people would use a 56 degree for these shots but I have been trying to only use my 56 around the green if I absolutely HAVE TO pop it up in the air and get it to stop close (which lets be honest, I am not playing pga tour courses so that is rarely necessary). The irony is, with some instruction and help from this site that is now a shot I have been hitting solid EVERY time! (playing ball forward letting gravity drop club on to ball, feeling almost like using a paint stroke on the way down etc). 

 

Any input is appreciated. What club do you guys use in these situations? And is there a common cause for these sculled chip shots? Thanks!

post #2 of 31

I am not a low capper but chipping is one area that I do pretty well.    I haven't skulled a chip in a long while but when I did, it was generally because I was using a high lofted club and not seeing the club make contact with the ball (lifting/turning my head)...   I typically play the ball just back of center and make sure to get ball first contact..

 

What club I use depends on the shot I need to make.    I probably use a 54* sand wedge more than any other club but if I need more roll (and depending on how much) I have used everything down to my 8-iron.   

post #3 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by teamroper60 View Post
 

I am not a low capper but chipping is one area that I do pretty well.    I haven't skulled a chip in a long while but when I did, it was generally because I was using a high lofted club and not seeing the club make contact with the ball (lifting/turning my head)...   I typically play the ball just back of center and make sure to get ball first contact..

 

What club I use depends on the shot I need to make.    I probably use a 54* sand wedge more than any other club but if I need more roll (and depending on how much) I have used everything down to my 8-iron.   

Thanks for the input. I have (for the most part) the same approach as you - (PW, 9 or even 8 if that much roll is needed) - I may be lifting / turning head etc.too  im really not sure! Crappy part is, I rarely do this (sculling) during practice! I want to get a short game lesson but I honestly fear I would not scull any during a lesson / practice and perhaps the instructor would not get to see whatever it is im doing on the course. I know that sounds kind of silly but, if a pro is not on the course with you - how can they address the issue? Speaking for myself I know the swing, chip, pitch etc. I make during practice is different than what I do on the course. (If I played the same way I practiced my scores would be way better)

 

Anywho - It can be certain that I am making a very bad stroke on these chips during round, but im just thinking that... if I am at least 100 percent certain that im using the right club - maybe it will at least give me more confidence in the shot.

post #4 of 31

You're quite right regarding practice versus playing- no pressure in practice, hence the different results. It's quite amazing though what a tiny bit of pressure will do to a golfer, if there is a technique fault (like your chipping/short game) it will eventually break.The best drill I've seen work is the one where another shaft is jammed into the end of another club (8,9,P or S) making the club at least 2 ft longer, take your grip, let the extension run up beside your left side (for RH) and go and hit some chips. You will quickly realise how the body and arms should work together through the ball, as soon as you flick at it you'll get a nice little whack in the ribs!!  This drill is for chipping only.

post #5 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pave View Post
 

You're quite right regarding practice versus playing- no pressure in practice, hence the different results. It's quite amazing though what a tiny bit of pressure will do to a golfer, if there is a technique fault (like your chipping/short game) it will eventually break.The best drill I've seen work is the one where another shaft is jammed into the end of another club (8,9,P or S) making the club at least 2 ft longer, take your grip, let the extension run up beside your left side (for RH) and go and hit some chips. You will quickly realise how the body and arms should work together through the ball, as soon as you flick at it you'll get a nice little whack in the ribs!!  This drill is for chipping only.

never heard of this drill but sounds great and will def. try! thank you

It really is amazing, the difference just from stepping off practice area and onto the tee box...I immediately lose all the "feel" I just had moments before. The "feel" that goes away applies to all facets of my game. As soon as I feel the pressure of "now it counts" something gives. This is in no way to say my mechanics / technique are good BUT I am 150% sure if I played with the relaxed feeling I have during practice - I would at least be able to break 90 consistently which is my short term goal (a goal I have become somewhat obsessed with lol).

 

I know I should not take it so serious, but I can't help it. 

post #6 of 31

Pick your wedge that has the most bounce, and use it.

 

http://thesandtrap.com/t/39411/quickie-pitching-video

 

You could also chip using a putting method...

 

http://thesandtrap.com/t/70998/chipping-with-a-putting-method

post #7 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tristanhilton85 View Post
 

Pick your wedge that has the most bounce, and use it.

 

http://thesandtrap.com/t/39411/quickie-pitching-video

 

You could also chip using a putting method...

 

http://thesandtrap.com/t/70998/chipping-with-a-putting-method

Thanks - I have watched these videos a bunch. 

 

Question, in regards to the "chip using putting" video - I thought about this during my round a lot today but didnt use this method because I was not sure if it still applied and worked as well if...lets say for example...he was 10-15 feet further away than where he is standing in the video and in front of him were little mounds, not high mounds, but high enough that if you hit a shot as low as he does in the video, you would hit right into it. Could you still use 9,8,7i and play the shot same way?

 

The "quickie pitching" video has already helped me immensely in certain situations but I do not feel comfortable using it in situations like what I was faced with a number of times today. When its possible to keep the ball somewhat low and get it on the green and rolling, I would prefer that. I feel the "chip using putting" method might have been more called for in my round today.

post #8 of 31
Hi golfguy, what I now do in this situ, (off the green by a just a few feet) is use my 7 iron very much like a putter, I will try to stroke the ball so it lands a third of the distance to pin, clearing the rough/fairway grass, and then roll the other 2 x thirds towards the pin, this might not look as pretty as a lovely little chip with a sw, but its easy to control and often leaves me close enough to putt out!, and zero chance of skulking/ blading!!!!!
post #9 of 31

GET A CHIPPER.....!

 

I know, not cool, and you won't do it, but it will take a LOT of strokes off your game, especially when used in conjunction with the "putting method" of chipping.

 

And yeah, if you're 3-putting that often, you need to work on distance control on your lag putts too.

post #10 of 31

This approach has really helped me a lot.

 

 

Joe

post #11 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
 

GET A CHIPPER.....!

 

I know, not cool, and you won't do it, but it will take a LOT of strokes off your game.  And yeah, if you're 3-putting that often, you need to work on lag putts too.


Tried out a chipper a couple of weeks ago. Love how it can be used for anything from 120 yard pitches right in to little chip and runs around the green. For me personally though there's nothing I'd pull out in place of it as the shots I play are all ok with other clubs. My grandfather however has shaved a whole load of strokes off already since he started using it the day after we tried it and he loves it to pieces so I can sincerely see how it could be of benefit.

post #12 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniBlueDragon View Post
 


Tried out a chipper a couple of weeks ago. Love how it can be used for anything from 120 yard pitches right in to little chip and runs around the green. For me personally though there's nothing I'd pull out in place of it as the shots I play are all ok with other clubs. My grandfather however has shaved a whole load of strokes off already since he started using it the day after we tried it and he loves it to pieces so I can sincerely see how it could be of benefit.

 

Good on ya.

 

I've known single-digit players to use them with devastating results.  But, like any other club, it needs to be practiced with and used to get the feel.  Too many players that even try them assume it's magic and when the first 5 chips don't go in the hole, they give up.

post #13 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by GolfGuy123 View Post
 

SO, my question...obviously I was making a bad stroke in these situations, that is guaranteed (since I was sculling). BUT was I using the wrong club / type of shot? I have seen all the videos posted on this site with some great instruction and I appreciate that, but I just dont feel like im "getting it" yet. I can accept not hitting a perfect chip every time because I am just not that  good BUT sculling every single one and unnecessarily adding 2-3 strokes per hole is crazy.

 

I was using either a pitching wedge or 9 iron, playing ball back in stance with weight forward and shaft leaned a little forward and just trying to keep it low and get it on the green and rolling towards the pin. In a few of these situations, the ball may have been just off green but pin was way in back, regardless I was sculling all of them.

 

I know some people would use a 56 degree for these shots but I have been trying to only use my 56 around the green if I absolutely HAVE TO pop it up in the air and get it to stop close (which lets be honest, I am not playing pga tour courses so that is rarely necessary). The irony is, with some instruction and help from this site that is now a shot I have been hitting solid EVERY time! (playing ball forward letting gravity drop club on to ball, feeling almost like using a paint stroke on the way down etc). 

 

Any input is appreciated. What club do you guys use in these situations? And is there a common cause for these sculled chip shots? Thanks!

 

First, practice putting. 3-4 putting is not good. I would recommend having someone look at your putting stroke, it might be off. Which would make it impossible for the person to gain touch or feel on putts because the contact is bad. 

 

Putting the ball back in your stance will bring the leading edge into play. This makes hitting the ball first paramount. It is a lot of pressure on the short game. Once you duff a few, or chunk a few, then all hell breaks loose with thin shots and chunks. Its a horrible spot to be in. 

 

If I can I putt the ball around the green. If I can't putt the ball the I really just do short pitch shots. I like using the bounce. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hey Joe View Post
 

This approach has really helped me a lot.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VERRhU-Jz7g

 

Joe

 

I do not like that method. Not saying it is bad. I just don't like it for the following reason. 

 

You you have to remember the launch angle and run out of each club and compute how it changes when the green speed changes, if you are going up hill or down hill. It really sucks if you have a huge breaking or mounding shot. 

 

For me I rather teach someone to use one or two clubs around the green. It also teaches the person flight control on trajectories and how to use bounce. 

post #14 of 31

Your quickest return on time investment is in putting:  One key (mine) to reducing 3-putt greens, (honestly, I don't even know what a FOUR putt green is!) is to be able to lag any putt to within 5 feet.  Then, a practice regimen that makes those 2-5 foot putts nearly automatic is required.  Before each round, I hit the practice green with 2 golf balls.  I hit 2' putts with both balls from 4 sides of a relatively flat hole placement.  Then, move out to 3' then 5.  Wash, rinse, repeat.  Then I take the same 2 balls to a hole that isn't quite flat.  This gives me oppty at uphill, downhill and both side breaking putts.  Same thing.  2, 3 and 5' range putts.  Make as many as you can.  Finish up your practice session lagging 15, 20 and 30' putts with a focus on getting them ALL inside 5 feet.  You should be ready to 2-putt most greens.  The premise is that you've been there and done it so many times that when you're on the greens, you become nearly automatic on thee short putts.

 

Chipping is a whole other ball game.  My premise again is that you have to have been there and done it hundreds of times to be relatively assured of success when a shot presents itself on the course.  I like the video someone posted about changing clubs based on flight and roll out.  This is a great technique and I've used it with good success.  The problem is that it assumes you have a tight lie, and clear access to the pin placement.  Not always the case during your round and where the misses end up.

 

I practice my short game a lot working from the green collar to medium and deep rough.  What works BEST for me is a 58* Vokey wedges with a good (11* I think) degree of bounce.  It goes through anything and is forgiving on even the tightest of lies.  Also learn how to square the face, open the face and slide it under the ball.  Lots of 'nuances' to the short game.

 

Back to your original post:  Blading sometimes means that your right hand is passing your left hand resulting in a 'scooping' motion.  This is what I've seen people do who 'skull' the ball regularly.  Keep those hands consistent with the left hand leading through the shot and well after impact.  that should help you a bit.

 

dave

post #15 of 31
Like Dave said working on getting those lag putts close will help reduce 3/4 putting

Best thing I can say for the short game nerves is keep practicing, and when you're on course facing that shot trust your swing. Don't get ahead of yourself and worry about where the ball is gonna go, instead pick the swing you are gonna make and focus on that. When you make that swing keep your head down until you hear the ball land.

When this issue is seen in the shooting world it's called anticipation. The shooter becomes so worried about seeing where his shot went that he forgets about all the stuff that needs to happen before the bang. Long story short the solution to this is to focus on having a good grip, look at your front sight, and a slow smooth trigger squeeze. In golf I try to apply these things, as I had the same problem you did but with every shot because I was so excited to see where the ball was going.

Sorry to get off topic I just found that was how I fixed a similar issue, plus I'm only on my second cup of coffee.
post #16 of 31

 

@saevel25 it works for me.  It simplified my chipping to one basic swing. I appreciate there are finer points here, but for a +20 handicap, it has merit.  My last round I had 4 1 putts as a result of good chipping.  One of the great and horrible things about golf and a new golfer is the spectrum of approaches to the same problem.  It has become a journey to adopt or reject based on what produces the best results for me.

post #17 of 31

As an 18 HCP I spend the majority of my time working on my full swing since it is a prerequisite to a good round, which for me is in the high 80's.  You seem to have a decent full swing and with 9 GIR and a few yards off the green for the remainder, it should not be too difficult to knock 5-6 strokes off your game.

 

I would recommend taking the time to find a good short game facility with putting, chipping, pitching, and sand shots, and dedicate a full session (1-2) hours weekly until you get some confidence - and don't be afraid to start with a lesson strictly on the short game.  I would also take a look at the golf ball you are playing - many people will tell you that you have no business playing a ball with a moderate amount of spin, which may not be true.  I switched last year to a couple of lower priced urethene covered balls (Gamer Tour and RBZ U) and have had a ball watching my short pitches and chips hugging the green instead of rolling like a marble.

 

Have fun and good luck.

post #18 of 31

chipping is the strongest part of my game.    never used to be ... i bought one of those $20 chipping nets & put it in the corner of my living room & have hit thousands of chips into it.    It has made a dramatic improvement in my chipping - just gives me confidence - I love to chip now.     Chipping and putting are the two things you can do in your house/apt ... assuming you have carpet and not hardwood

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