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Protecting that left knee - Page 3

post #37 of 43
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

 

100% agree with this. Left foot being flared allows greater range of motion for the left knee, it can flex forward longer and rotate left (open up).

 

Video below, note where the pressure is tracing, towards the toes of the left foot. @march11934, your's would be going more towards the left heel because of the way the left knee works.

 

 

 

Good drill to do for the left knee/Key #2 (Weight forward)

 

OK sot there were some points I am not following. There are a number of theories including Pete Cowen's about striking down on the ball. How is this achieved if the ball is forward of center? From watching Stenson he seems to place the ball farther back in his stance than most relative to each club and hits down into the ground. He uses a full body turn and drives down. HIs release is low and around his body rather then around his neck because of how he makes his arms and torso as one unit. I have been trying to emulate this. If the ball is placed forward you either need to slide forward on the foreswing to get the ball in the downward arc or you end up hitting the ball in the upward portion of the swing? You really see me flipping at the ball? That would be a casting motion correct? So that would mean that the club head has gotten in front of my hands with the ball back in my stance? Im not following how this is being seen.

post #38 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

OK sot there were some points I am not following. There are a number of theories including Pete Cowen's about striking down on the ball. How is this achieved if the ball is forward of center? From watching Stenson he seems to place the ball farther back in his stance than most relative to each club and hits down into the ground. He uses a full body turn and drives down. HIs release is low and around his body rather then around his neck because of how he makes his arms and torso as one unit. I have been trying to emulate this. If the ball is placed forward you either need to slide forward on the foreswing to get the ball in the downward arc or you end up hitting the ball in the upward portion of the swing? 

 

You can have the ball forward of center and hit down. I am defining "center" as being the center of the stance ;-)  The left shoulder joint is generally the low point of the golf swing. Most good players have the ball a couple balls behind the left shoulder. We recommend with a driver, to have a positive angle of attack, to play the ball just forward of the left shoulder. 

 

All good players have some amount of transfer/slide with their lower bodies. The average PGA Tour player has between 80-95% of his pressure on his front foot at impact. Stenson is no different, notice how far forward his hips get with the left shoulder going slightly more forward.

 

BTW, I didn't draw the yellow circle, that was already on the video.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

You really see me flipping at the ball? That would be a casting motion correct? So that would mean that the club head has gotten in front of my hands with the ball back in my stance? Im not following how this is being seen.

 

 

With the video it's tough to see exactly what is happening with the wrist angles but I would recommend more weight forward at impact, notice how straight your left knee is. Will make solid contact much easier.

post #39 of 43
Thread Starter 

Thanks mvmac, that makes a lot of sense. I see just how much more dramatic of a forward lean Stenson sets up. Now that i started videoing myself i see how much less active my swing is. Much less lean, shift, knee bend, etc. This is literally the first time i have seen my own swing on video that i created. I did a video session with a local golf clinic once but just couldn't substantiate the cost, so i went on my own in studying a swing. I have been trying to lock my left arm the way he does. This has been a great advance on hitting the ball consistently.  I totally agree with my left knee being straight. I actually snap it on the upswing to try and produce that acceleration they all talk about just before impact. The weakness in my knee is holding up my weight when its bent and rotation. When its straight i can support any amount of weight. I installed far too much carpeting and tile in my younger years and now paying my dues... Funny thing is I am thinking i am bending it more that i really am. Seeing the videos I am going to definitely push the bent knees and the forward press a lot more. Going to work on a lot more shift as well. I was trying to stay more centered and rotating on an axis but like you said with some more shift it would get the face of the club into the ball cleaner? 

I guess i am a typical amateur when it comes to hitting irons. The shorter irons have a lot more range than the longer irons. Maybe these swing flaws are the reason why. I can push a pitching wedge to about 150 if i really lean into the hit but i can count on a 125 shot with a 80% swing. 7 goes about 165-175. But when i get into my 5 its about 175-190. Can't really count on the consistency and quality strike as with the shorter clubs. I can actually hit my 7 almost s far as my 5, ?? I'm hoping working on these swing principles will help me hit the longer irons a little better. 

Thanks for the info, I have something definite to work on.

post #40 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by march11934 View Post
 

Going to work on a lot more shift as well. I was trying to stay more centered and rotating on an axis but like you said with some more shift it would get the face of the club into the ball cleaner? 

 

Correct that is the idea, weight forward moves low point forward, more solid strikes.

post #41 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

Here's what the "jumping" often comes down to.

 

Pros or better players, particularly with the driver where distance is important and the ball is teed up (more margin for error), will jump so forcefully to create additional speed that they'll literally "jump" off the ground slightly. Because their hips are turning, and their foot has lost friction (with the ground), the foot spins out.

 

That can be an entirely different thing than spinning on your heel. You can spin on your heel because you've "unweighted" your foot by jumping (i.e. slightly smaller jumps than the kind in my second paragraph, i.e. no real big gaps between foot and ground, but enough to "unweight" the foot), or because you just move all of the pressure to your heel, unweight the FRONT part of your foot, and spin because your heel acts with reduced friction as a pivot point.

 

The latter would tend to be indicative - but not always - of a swing flaw. And it may not be a big flaw, but people who pivot hard on their front heel tend to have too much rotation prematurely in the downswing. Path tends to be INward.

 


 

When we visited Dr. Kwon (a biomechanist near Dallas, TX) he was just in the early stages of doing a trial on whether flaring the feet helps or hurts golfers. Flaring the foot helps reduce rotational torque on the knee, particularly in the follow-through, yet a lot of PGA Tour players play with very square toes.

 

I theorized, and Dr. Kwon liked this possibility, that players square their lead foot in to help slow their rotation during the downswing, then allow it to spin out (some even on their heels a little - as I said it's not always a swing flaw) to reduce pressure from the torque. In other words, they're trying to get the "best of both worlds:" the reduced downswing turning from having it squared in, but then releasing it and letting it turn out so as not to shred their knee during the follow-through.

 

Very interested to read this study. I work in PT and am a front foot spinner of sorts but I like to keep it square at address. Able to stay down and through longer with a quicker release. Flared I tend to open up too soon and don't release the club in time. As you noted, it is not always a swing flaw.

post #42 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

@march11934 ,

 

Give the flared front foot time to work for you.  @iacas and @mvmac had me convert to this three years ago as I had a tendency to spin on my front foot.  It took a while for it to be comfortable and it took a lot of stress off my left knee, which has osteoarthritis.  It helps if you keep your left knee flexed longer in the downswing.  It really shouldn't straighten until after impact.  To increase shoulder turn in the back swing, you can flare the back foot a bit as well.


+1

post #43 of 43
Thread Starter 

 

OK. I have made a few adjustments. Minor but I can feel the difference. I widened my stance. Flared both feet. Left foot considerably, not sure if its very evident in the video and incorporated some action in the lower body from the hips down and not spinning on my heel. Moved the ball forward in my swing to about 50/50 in my stance. Not comfortable moving the ball forward any more cause i start to loose the draw and i start catching too much ground before the ball. Still some snow out in NC so not sure what the flight is until I get to the range but i can definitely feel the "splat" if a solid strike. I'm hitting Pro V's with a 7 iron and i can feel a solid strike. The club i am using is an MP33. A lot heavier that the 52's i use for gaming so i'm not quite generating as much club head speed with the blades as i do with the cavity backs. Thanks again everyone for your thoughts. Going to keep working on developing more action with my lower body.

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