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Why do the pros hit it so far? Here's my take - Page 4

post #55 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 


Really I'm getting the idea that the pros carry the ball 230 is based on Jack's book Golf My Way, which described that most pros (back then) carried about 230 and when they hit 300 yard drives it rolled about 70 yards. I guess they hit it longer now than they did then but still I think they're longest drives, even if they do carry 270, are because of the factors above. If you want a 350 yard drive, it will need roll, downhill, and tailwind. I'm a short hitter, and no matter how hard I swing, I can't get it past 250 without tearing something, so I really rely on wind and roll for my distance. Maybe I don't have enough distance to compete on the tour, But I certainly have enough to shoot par in about a year if I keep playing automatically.

 

By the way, jack said that there was a hole on a course that he couldn't carry a creek 230 out unless he hit his absolutely best shot. He said this indicates the truth about professional golf distance perfectly. Though pros are longer now with carry, they can't hit 350 without roll, elevation, downhill, and tailwind (maybe not all at once). So when you're upset because you're ball isn't going long enough, think about those factors.

Swinging hard doesn't mean the ball with go far. It's all about making the proper movements. I don't feel like I swing any harder today than I did 5 years ago, but guess what, I carry the ball 50 yards further. 

post #56 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 


I just researched pros carry distances and it's about 260. Jack carried about the same. So I don't see a difference really, besides the fact that fairways and greens are much faster than they were back in the 70's.

 

What? 
 

You've been telling us this whole time Jack couldn't carry a creek 230 yards out and now he carried it 260?

post #57 of 138
Thread Starter 

I'm just afraid that if I swing to hard I might break my driver face. LOL

post #58 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 

I'm just afraid that if I swing to hard I might break my driver face. LOL


As long as your not trying to pound nails with it I think it will be just fine.

post #59 of 138
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shortstop20 View Post
 

 

What? 
 

You've been telling us this whole time Jack couldn't carry a creek 230 yards out and now he carried it 260?

These stats are both in his book. He claimed to have carried it 260 but he also said that he couldn't carry a creek that was 230 unless he hits his best shot. I'm just stating what he said in his book.

post #60 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 

These stats are both in his book. He claimed to have carried it 260 but he also said that he couldn't carry a creek that was 230 unless he hits his best shot. I'm just stating what he said in his book.

 

So on anything besides his best shots, he lost 30 yards of carry? 

 

I don't think so.

post #61 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 

Simply put, Jack Nicklaus said that he could carry about 260 swinging as hard as he could. He rarely hit over 300 unless he has a tailwind, downhill, and dry fairways. I'd say the same for pros nowadays. They don't carry 300 yards unless they're going downhill, downwind and on dry fairways. Most of them carry about 230 (estimate) and it rolls about 50 yards. These courses that  the pros play on are dried out hard and fast. No wonder they hit it so far! Also these courses have a lot of wind. If they have a headwind, they merely hit it lower. If they have a tailwind, look out there's going to be some bombs, especially if it's downhill and the fairways are hard. I hit my drives about 200 carry and if I had these conditions described here I could hit it 270 (maybe 250) No wonder it doesn't look like they're trying. They let the course take care of distance for them.

 

Also, Jack also said that a course he had a hand in designing called harbor town,  there was a hole in which there was a creek separating two fairways and he said that it carried about 230. But he also said that he couldn't carry that spot unless he hit his absolutely best shot. He said that if he hit it even just a bit thin, he wouldn't be able to carry, no matter how hard he swung. This makes sense because most of us only drive about 230 on average, but we play on slow courses and we don't swing very hard. I swing all out and I still can't get it past 220 on the range, but on a fast course I can get it to 280. So generally, this is my opinion on how the pros hit it so far.

 

Another factor though, is how strong these guys are; they swing so fast because of their strength. So if you want more distance, work out. Simple as that.

 

That's my opinion.

 

Sources: Jack Nicklaus' Book Golf My Way and my own logic

 

Comment freely. Thank you for your concern, and I appreciate your responses

 

Have a nice rest of your week,

 


Xerex250 (pastaman)


Ok so you think the courses the tour pros play are tricked up that all they need to do is get off a shot of about 230 yards and the hard fast fairway will take care of the rest . . . WRONG! Maybe back in the day when persimmon drivers where lofted at 12* with only a 43" shafts and had a much smaller sweet spot and the ball not only flew shorter but not as straight either and players didn't have the access they do now to all the latest techniques to squeeze out every ounce of potential energy from the face of a driver to a ball. Just the other day one of my playing partners carried his drive 290 yards onto a short par 4 no problem for him. The difference in the pro game you see today versus 50 or even 40 years ago is night and day all the great courses have to be lengthened by as much as 700 yards in some cases or par brought down a stroke or 2 or even both.

post #62 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by shortstop20 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post

 
These stats are both in his book. He claimed to have carried it 260 but he also said that he couldn't carry a creek that was 230 unless he hits his best shot. I'm just stating what he said in his book.

So on anything besides his best shots, he lost 30 yards of carry? 

I don't think so.

Maybe a headwind, and needs to hit lower.

We need the context from his book, like an excerpt.

I am going to borrow the book from the library, it does sound interesting anyway.
post #63 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post


Maybe a headwind, and needs to hit lower.

We need the context from his book, like an excerpt.

I am going to borrow the book from the library, it does sound interesting anyway.


I have an old persimmon driver in the closet that I've never hit. Needs a new grip before I would even enjoy swinging it.

 

I'm curious enough now to put a grip on it and see how far I can hit it. I will be very surprised if I can't hit it 230 yards...And I'm no Jack Nicklaus by a loooong shot.

post #64 of 138
Sniff...sniff...
post #65 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by xerex250 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

 

Then open your eyes.* :bugout:

 

* I mean that as nicely as possible. Seriously, there are HUGE differences. And Jack regularly drove the ball 260+. Don't believe everything you read. Especially if they tell you modern PGA Tour pros carry the ball 230. :P


Really I'm getting the idea that the pros carry the ball 230 is based on Jack's book Golf My Way, which described that most pros (back then) carried about 230 and when they hit 300 yard drives it rolled about 70 yards. I guess they hit it longer now than they did then but still I think they're longest drives, even if they do carry 270, are because of the factors above. If you want a 350 yard drive, it will need roll, downhill, and tailwind. I'm a short hitter, and no matter how hard I swing, I can't get it past 250 without tearing something, so I really rely on wind and roll for my distance. Maybe I don't have enough distance to compete on the tour, But I certainly have enough to shoot par in about a year if I keep playing automatically.

 

By the way, jack said that there was a hole on a course that he couldn't carry a creek 230 out unless he hit his absolutely best shot. He said this indicates the truth about professional golf distance perfectly. Though pros are longer now with carry, they can't hit 350 without roll, elevation, downhill, and tailwind (maybe not all at once). So when you're upset because you're ball isn't going long enough, think about those factors.

 

In an earlier post, you mentioned that you drive about 200 yards. This is roughly what a bogey golfer can do. To get to the low teens or high single digits, you need to be able to get the ball 250 to 260 consistently. The occasional 250 is not enough.

 

You mentioned that you can't swing faster without tearing something. This does not sound right. My son is about the same height as you (he's 5'5"/5'6" 120 pounds or 50 pounds lighter), he carries his drives 220 and has hit one or two to 290 (carry and roll). I'm pretty confident that with 5SK training he'll be able to hit even longer.

 

You should take @mvmac's advice and get more Keys (look up 5SK) on this site. Avoiding injury is the best way to success. I'm not an instructor (so I get to say this without any legalities), and I am pretty sure you will be able to drive 250 by the time you learn the proper technique.

 

Instead of telling everyone that pros drive less, you should learn the technique to hit farther.

post #66 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post


Maybe a headwind, and needs to hit lower.

We need the context from his book, like an excerpt.

I am going to borrow the book from the library, it does sound interesting anyway.


I have an old persimmon driver in the closet that I've never hit. Needs a new grip before I would even enjoy swinging it.

 

I'm curious enough now to put a grip on it and see how far I can hit it. I will be very surprised if I can't hit it 230 yards...And I'm no Jack Nicklaus by a loooong shot.

 

Wait, but you hit your 5W 230, that's your answer already.

post #67 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 

 

Wait, but you hit your 5W 230, that's your answer already.


I'm not sure about that. Maybe a modern 5 wood goes farther than this old persimmon. We'll see, I already have the old grip off...It came off in small pieces it was so old. ;-) 


Edited by MS256 - 2/27/14 at 7:57pm
post #68 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 

 

Wait, but you hit your 5W 230, that's your answer already.


I'm not sure about that. Maybe a modern 5 wood goes farther than this old persimmon. We'll see, I already have the old grip off...It came off in small pieces it was so old. ;-) 


Do you have any Balata Balls? How soft were the balls during this driver's heyday?

post #69 of 138
I think the biggest change in distance is the golf ball. The advent of titanium face on the driver is a large change as well, but let's face it, the mfg are capped on the cor that they can produce a driver face so there is a limit to technology since. The ball however, continues to develop. The attached link is on a test of titleist balls from the balata to the current pro v1 ball. All test are. With a player that has a 110 mph swing, less than. The longest tour pros by quite a bit. Look at the distance changes. On the balls, easily 35 yards just due to the ball! If nicklaus were using a titanium faced driver and a current pro v1 he would be hitting it just as far as the modern player. And. By the way, I doubt that a bubba could hit the balata ball as straight as he does the modern ball. He would be all over the course!


http://www.andrewricegolf.com/2011/08/evolution-of-a-golf-ball/
post #70 of 138
A guy on YouTube did a comparison with an XHot and an old Big Berths and the difference was only 8 yards. Same ball
post #71 of 138
Agree on the club comparison, but a big Bertha vs a persimmon would add some distance. That distance pulse the ball changes, makes up most of the distance advantages IMO. Also, a player using balata and persimmon could not afford to swing off of their feet like bubba, they would rarely be in the fairway if they did back the due tithe spin and ball design
post #72 of 138
Pros carry the dog way over 230 in air
Way over it
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