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Tiger Woods Driving Problems - Really dude? Really! - Page 4

post #55 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond View Post
 

Well, I don't know. Tiger has been protected all his life and may have been surrounded by "yes" men -- no doubt. Overprotected, who knows his mental maturity? Just speculating here...

 

Isn't it Foley's job to get his player to perform? Whether it is mental or physical? Heck, for all we know, Foley may have tried to get him help. Sorry if my posts are nuanced. The "blame," if any, goes to every member of Team Tiger, including Tiger. They take the glory ... and must take the accountability, allocated by Tiger...

 

I think he is probably gripping on his diminished skills that come with age. I just don't buy that the swing coach can do much about a 38 year old Tiger Woods figuring out how to overcome his mental issues.

 

I don't think I look at it as deeply as you. On the course he is on his own, and how he responds is up to him. That being said, I do think that Steve Williams leaving had a bigger impact than can be measured.

post #56 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond View Post
 

Well, I don't know. Tiger has been protected all his life and may have been surrounded by "yes" men -- no doubt. Overprotected, who knows his mental maturity? Just speculating here...

 

Isn't it Foley's job to get his player to perform? Whether it is mental or physical? Heck, for all we know, Foley may have tried to get him help. Sorry if my posts are nuanced. The "blame," if any, goes to every member of Team Tiger, including Tiger. They take the glory ... and must take the accountability, allocated by Tiger...

 

I think that asking Foley to help Tiger's mental game (you seem to believe that's a big problem currently) is reasonable. He's an instructor for the most part, regardless of what he might say about his shaman training (or whatever).

post #57 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

 

I think that asking Foley to help Tiger's mental game (you seem to believe that's a big problem currently) is reasonable. He's an instructor for the most part, regardless of what he might say about his shaman training (or whatever).

Well, I don't want to get too much into this mental thing -- but I've got to deal with it in my business role -- adults on drugs, too many guns, schizophrenia, insecurity, depression, ego ... all this mental stuff prevents people from performing. Someone mentioned age -- heck, Wade Phillips is tweeting his ego and insecurity as to whether he is a capable football coach by comparing his better record to the Cows Jason Garrett. Heck, Wade was fired because one season started 1-7. And Wade is late 60's. Some guys can't let go.

 

Some issues never die ... they just show up on Twitter.

 

look at Tig's life ... most of it is on the golf course ... dealing with real issues and his issues took a backseat as long as he was performing. Okay, enough of the shrink...

post #58 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by liquor box View Post
 

If I had the ability to hit everything straight I would probably hit long irons off the tee to allow me to hit full irons into every green.

 

I admit I am not a great player but I too have difficulty hitting accurately from 60-70 yards so I usually aim to be either 90-100m from the pin for a SW or 120m for a PW.

 

I also hit long irons or 5w from the tee to allow this distance to be left. I could hit driver but if you think about your next shot and not just the shot you are currently hitting you will quickly lose strokes from your handicap.

 

If you are even mildly accurate off the tee, even being in the first cut of rough on most fairways then course management will lose you plenty of strokes.

 

 

You have said you can hit a driver up to 300yds straight, do you ever try to move the ball left or right? This is when you will start to have issues with accuracy


No I can't fade or draw on purpose. If it happens its purely by accident.  My talent is hitting it straight.  I can aim with the best of them but I don't have consistent contact. I will hit it great, then hit it too high on the face, then hit thin, or maybe even too fat.  But one thing about my swing is no matter how I hit it, it will most times go straight toward the target I'm aiming. 

 

However this doesn't help me much because there is no way for me to hit a green more than once or twice a round because I may hit it 50 yards past because I skulled it or hit it 60 yards short because I hit it too fat.  It is VERY frustrating not to be able to hit the ball correctly consistently.

post #59 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by RightEdge View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by liquor box View Post

 
If I had the ability to hit everything straight I would probably hit long irons off the tee to allow me to hit full irons into every green.

I admit I am not a great player but I too have difficulty hitting accurately from 60-70 yards so I usually aim to be either 90-100m from the pin for a SW or 120m for a PW.

I also hit long irons or 5w from the tee to allow this distance to be left. I could hit driver but if you think about your next shot and not just the shot you are currently hitting you will quickly lose strokes from your handicap.

If you are even mildly accurate off the tee, even being in the first cut of rough on most fairways then course management will lose you plenty of strokes.


You have said you can hit a driver up to 300yds straight, do you ever try to move the ball left or right? This is when you will start to have issues with accuracy


No I can't fade or draw on purpose. If it happens its purely by accident.  My talent is hitting it straight.  I can aim with the best of them but I don't have consistent contact. I will hit it great, then hit it too high on the face, then hit thin, or maybe even too fat.  But one thing about my swing is no matter how I hit it, it will most times go straight toward the target I'm aiming. 

However this doesn't help me much because there is no way for me to hit a green more than once or twice a round because I may hit it 50 yards past because I skulled it or hit it 60 yards short because I hit it too fat.  It is VERY frustrating not to be able to hit the ball correctly consistently.
You should work on the
5sk training videos. Getting the first two steps down would help you a lot.
post #60 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil McGleno View Post


WHats Grant know about winning on the current-day PGA TOur that Tiger doesnt know?- Or winning a major?

 

He knows that hitting 7 down and 8 across might not be the best way to hit a driver ;-)

post #61 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvmac View Post
 

He knows that hitting 7 down and 8 across might not be the best way to hit a driver ;-)

 

Everyone knows that… including Tiger and Sean.

 


 

Anyway, what's the topic here exactly? That Tiger's a poor driver? Because I've never really seen that proven. He's better than average (PGA Tour), and… unless the argument is that he's not as good as he used to be, then I'm not sure there's a lot to that position.

post #62 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by RightEdge View Post
 


No I can't fade or draw on purpose. If it happens its purely by accident.  My talent is hitting it straight.  I can aim with the best of them but I don't have consistent contact. I will hit it great, then hit it too high on the face, then hit thin, or maybe even too fat.  But one thing about my swing is no matter how I hit it, it will most times go straight toward the target I'm aiming. 

 

However this doesn't help me much because there is no way for me to hit a green more than once or twice a round because I may hit it 50 yards past because I skulled it or hit it 60 yards short because I hit it too fat.  It is VERY frustrating not to be able to hit the ball correctly consistently.


I know where you are coming from. When I first started playing I was in that very same boat.I could bomb it long and fairly straight, and commence to screw the hole up from there. Finally grooved in an iron swing and a decent short game, and cant hit driver now to save my life. If you would have told me 2 years ago that my iron and wedge game was going to be the best part of my game, I would have laughed my ass off. It took some time and a lot of work, now Ive gotta figure out that dang driver again.

post #63 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by clutchshot View Post

It's so weird... I have been playing golf for 4 years and drove about 250, when I play with people in real life, even people who have been playing for years, they rarely drive that much further (if so like 10-20 yards), but when I get online everyone that plays can hit it 300, even guys that just started.... :)

Sorry I like to poke a little. If you are literally driving 300, and making 25 handicap, spend some time (like all your time) practicing chipping and putting.

Regarding Tiger's driving: Keep in mind he is hitting it harder and longer than you with more shape. Also keep in mind (this is important) they are playing really hard courses. If the pros came and played here, they would probably birdie every hole.


I keep hearing people say that online "everybody" drives it 300. It's getting kind of funny though although I do realize where this comes from but I just have to respond to some of these "remarks". When I'm at the range there are maybe 2 guys maybe 3 that can actually go 290-300 yards. I just happen to be one of them. Even though my game sucks when I play I mostly out drive my playing partners. However, as I have stated before, it doesn't help me really because my short game sucks to the highest. No disrespect but how many of the people on here that can't hit drives over 250 have been athletes prior to taking up golf?  I was.  I played basketball, baseball and football.  I was a baseball pitcher so guess what? I generate a lot of speed. Now, I am not saying just because you are taller, bigger or stronger than the average weekend golfer that means that you can hit the ball further than him, BUT if you are an athletic guy it certainly does help with distance if you contact is good. Look at Dustin Johnson and Keegan Bradley and how far they pump those balls out there. Bubba is the exception kind of.

 

I understand where a lot of the disbelief is coming from in this age of internet alternate reality but one of the few pet peeves I have is when someone who doesn't know me calls me a liar.

I'm not talking about anyone in particular but based on some of the replies I think it is fairly obvious what was hinted at.  No disrespect to the older guys but I take exception to a 60+ year old guy telling me that since he only hits it 250 yards there is no way I can hit it 300. Not a good comparison.

 

Also, these are pros I get it. Here's a thought though.  I understand pros have these really high swing speeds which is the biggest factor of them being able to hit it so far but here is a question.  Didn't most of these guys naturally have high swing speeds anyway and then just refined their game?  Do you think everybody trained to be good ball strikers and then TRAINED to have a really high swing speed? I know you can increase your swing speed with training but I don't believe you can take a guy who can't generate any substantial speed and train him to be able to swing 130 mph. A big part of it is athleticism.

 

My point is I think a big number of those pros probably were kinda like me.  They could swing fast right from the start and then just refined their game and got better. Now having said that, anyone that still wants to believe that no 6'3 200+ lb athletic  guy with a sucky handicap can hit a golf ball 300 yards then I don't know what else to say. 

post #64 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by RightEdge View Post
My point is I think a big number of those pros probably were kinda like me.  They could swing fast right from the start and then just refined their game and got better. Now having said that, anyone that still wants to believe that no 6'3 200+ lb athletic  guy with a sucky handicap can hit a golf ball 300 yards then I don't know what else to say. 

 

People put their "got to see it to believe it" guard up because there are many people who make these claims without realizing what a 300 yard shot really looks like.  When measured accurately using GPS or a radar device like Trackman, many have been humbled to realize that what they thought was 300 yards was not even close. 

 

If what you say is true, then wonderful.  I would suggest you film your swing, post it in the my swing section of this forum and show us.  The beautiful thing is that the 5SK guys on the forum will be happy to help you with the deficiencies in your swing that you can work on and those suggestions will transfer over and help you with your 150-60 yard swing issues.  Win win...

post #65 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deryck Griffith View Post
 

 

People put their "got to see it to believe it" guard up because there are many people who make these claims without realizing what a 300 yard shot really looks like.  When measured accurately using GPS or a radar device like Trackman, many have been humbled to realize that what they thought was 300 yards was not even close. 

 

If what you say is true, then wonderful.  I would suggest you film your swing, post it in the my swing section of this forum and show us.  The beautiful thing is that the 5SK guys on the forum will be happy to help you with the deficiencies in your swing that you can work on and those suggestions will transfer over and help you with your 150-60 yard swing issues.  Win win...


So there are people who hit a shot, watch it go down the fairway and say "Ok that's about 300 yards". lol.  If that is true that is sad but ok I understand what you are saying but for the record I measure my distances 2 ways.  First I practice at different driving ranges where they have flags and yardages marked.  Secondly, I check the flags with my range finder. This is the one I use.  http://www.thegpsstore.com/Bushnell-Tour-V3-Slope-Edition-Golf-Laser-Rangefinder-P3600.aspx?gclid=CLiiq4j0i70CFTRo7Aod-WAACg

 

So unless both the driving range yardages and my range finder are off I think I'm pretty close to accurate. About posting my swing, yes I'll do that.  I was planning to anyway to be honest.  I'm looking into getting an ipad because I heard that it has some apps that you can use to record and study your swing. Once I make that purchase I can use it to post video is what a friend told me.

post #66 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by RightEdge View Post
 


So there are people who hit a shot, watch it go down the fairway and say "Ok that's about 300 yards". lol.  If that is true that is sad but ok I understand what you are saying but for the record I measure my distances 2 ways.  First I practice at different driving ranges where they have flags and yardages marked.  Secondly, I check the flags with my range finder. This is the one I use.  http://www.thegpsstore.com/Bushnell-Tour-V3-Slope-Edition-Golf-Laser-Rangefinder-P3600.aspx?gclid=CLiiq4j0i70CFTRo7Aod-WAACg

 

So unless both the driving range yardages and my range finder are off I think I'm pretty close to accurate. About posting my swing, yes I'll do that.  I was planning to anyway to be honest.  I'm looking into getting an ipad because I heard that it has some apps that you can use to record and study your swing. Once I make that purchase I can use it to post video is what a friend told me.

There are a lot of people (especially on the internet) that don't know how to properly measure the distance their drive travels.  If a hole is playing 500 yards and where your ball ends up is 200 yards from the flag it doesn't necessarily mean you drove the ball 300 yards.

 

This isn't to say you don't hit 300 yard drives, it's just most people over estimate how far they actually hit them because they measure them incorrectly.

post #67 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post
 

There are a lot of people (especially on the internet) that don't know how to properly measure the distance their drive travels.  If a hole is playing 500 yards and where your ball ends up is 200 yards from the flag it doesn't necessarily mean you drove the ball 300 yards.

 

This isn't to say you don't hit 300 yard drives, it's just most people over estimate how far they actually hit them because they measure them incorrectly.

 

 

Yep, score card distances can vary as much as 100 yards. I've been on holes were all the tees were moved up 2 tee boxes before. 

 

If you want accurate driving distance GPS is the best solution. Most devices now have a measure shot feature. 

 

Personally I like to just record my swing speed. From there its up to my ball striking and my launch conditions to get my distance. I can mess around with Flightscope trajectory optimizer to see what my best conditions are. 

post #68 of 69

Right Edge, I can empathize in a couple of ways.  First off, when you try to start a conversation about somebody else, it's not uncommon to find yourself attacked.  Thick skin helps.   Second, I find myself in a similar boat when it comes to hitting a driver.  

 

I actually got re-interested in golf about 10 years ago, and particularly in the sport of long drive.  Not that I was any good at it.

 

Few days ago I played a round after a long layoff.   (Developed arthritis in my thumbs and hadn't picked up a club since last June or so.)  Hitting balls on the range warming up, I couldn't hit a ball solidly with any club.  Went to play and found my drives were the only good thing about my game.  (Did end up on the green off the tee on a par 5, but it was the wrong green.  Penalty!   Hit a fade on a dogleg left and bounced the ball off a brick wall back into play, on in 2.)     Not claiming 300 yds but most drives were well over 250.    I topped a drive, to find it rolled 200+ yards down the center, not a problem.   Generally on or just off the green in 2 on par 4s and 5s.  Short wedge to the green on the last hole, 360 yards, then 6 putted.  Typical.

 

Back to tour golf.   Really -- long drivers tend to have problems.   John Daly in his prime would be all over the map, had to have a great short game to make up for erratic drives.   Fred Funk, a short driver, was most accurate.   Seems a trade off, doesn't it?   But I think statistically, and on many courses, long but erratic drivers are better off than short but consistent ones.  Depends on how erratic.  Erratic for me is always fatal, erratic for Tiger or Phil is not.   Erratic for Daly could be really erratic.

 

In times long past George Bayer, a former football lineman, was the longest driver on tour.  He was said to have felt pressured to keep his drives long to please the crowds and felt that hurt his game and kept him from scoring as low as he could have.   Longer necessarily means worse misses when you miss.

 

Tiger as was pointed out no longer leads the pack in driving distance.  I don't think it from aging per se but because of swing changes, seeking more control, and concern for longevity.   He could hit one 350 if he wanted to.   He has had what seems like a lot of physical issues for a 38 year old..   Maybe we can debate whether his weight training has helped or hurt.    Did you suffer from back spasms at 38?   How many golfers have?   Other hand, how many golfers have had the strength and physical capability of Tiger and used it on a golf course?

post #69 of 69
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole_Tom_Morris View Post
 

Right Edge, I can empathize in a couple of ways.  First off, when you try to start a conversation about somebody else, it's not uncommon to find yourself attacked.  Thick skin helps.   Second, I find myself in a similar boat when it comes to hitting a driver.  

 

I actually got re-interested in golf about 10 years ago, and particularly in the sport of long drive.  Not that I was any good at it.

 

Few days ago I played a round after a long layoff.   (Developed arthritis in my thumbs and hadn't picked up a club since last June or so.)  Hitting balls on the range warming up, I couldn't hit a ball solidly with any club.  Went to play and found my drives were the only good thing about my game.  (Did end up on the green off the tee on a par 5, but it was the wrong green.  Penalty!   Hit a fade on a dogleg left and bounced the ball off a brick wall back into play, on in 2.)     Not claiming 300 yds but most drives were well over 250.    I topped a drive, to find it rolled 200+ yards down the center, not a problem.   Generally on or just off the green in 2 on par 4s and 5s.  Short wedge to the green on the last hole, 360 yards, then 6 putted.  Typical.

 

Back to tour golf.   Really -- long drivers tend to have problems.   John Daly in his prime would be all over the map, had to have a great short game to make up for erratic drives.   Fred Funk, a short driver, was most accurate.   Seems a trade off, doesn't it?   But I think statistically, and on many courses, long but erratic drivers are better off than short but consistent ones.  Depends on how erratic.  Erratic for me is always fatal, erratic for Tiger or Phil is not.   Erratic for Daly could be really erratic.

 

In times long past George Bayer, a former football lineman, was the longest driver on tour.  He was said to have felt pressured to keep his drives long to please the crowds and felt that hurt his game and kept him from scoring as low as he could have.   Longer necessarily means worse misses when you miss.

 

Tiger as was pointed out no longer leads the pack in driving distance.  I don't think it from aging per se but because of swing changes, seeking more control, and concern for longevity.   He could hit one 350 if he wanted to.   He has had what seems like a lot of physical issues for a 38 year old..   Maybe we can debate whether his weight training has helped or hurt.    Did you suffer from back spasms at 38?   How many golfers have?   Other hand, how many golfers have had the strength and physical capability of Tiger and used it on a golf course?


Agreed.

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