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The I'd like 5mph more on my Swing Thread - Page 2

post #19 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post

I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but...

Say you swing 5mph faster on all you clubs. What's that translate to, 10 yards? Are you really going to be that much better with a 10 yard gain on all your clubs?

Oh and please don't take that the wrong way as I'm not trying to be antagonistic or anything. I just believe it's a fallacy. I simply believe there are other areas of improvement that golfers can focus on that will yield much greater results.

 

It's about 12.5 yards on the driver.

 

And 10 yards (just with the driver, mind you) saves a 70s golfer over half a shot per round.

post #20 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post

I think I would be a better golfer if I could hit the ball farther.  In fact, you could say I'm convinced.
I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but...

Say you swing 5mph faster on all you clubs. What's that translate to, 10 yards? Are you really going to be that much better with a 10 yard gain on all your clubs?

Oh and please don't take that the wrong way as I'm not trying to be antagonistic or anything. I just believe it's a fallacy. I simply believe there are other areas of improvement that golfers can focus on that will yield much greater results.

I was not joking, and did not take anything as antagonistic.

When you said farther, I did not think you meant only ten yards. Although that would mean ten further with driver and iron, so instead of 7 iron approach, I could hit 9. I do think this would make me better.

I am a fairly short but straight hitter. I rarely (for my handicap) have penalty strokes. A good drive for me though is about 230. I have played before with guys who can consistently hit 280-300. Maybe that is why I would very much like to hit it farther. Human nature to want what you don't have.

Instead of the "I hit 300, but have a terrible short game" guy. You can call me the "my short game is decent, but I can't hit it worth a crap" guy.

Again, human nature to always think "if only....."
post #21 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post


I was not joking, and did not take anything as antagonistic.

When you said farther, I did not think you meant only ten yards. Although that would mean ten further with driver and iron, so instead of 7 iron approach, I could hit 9. I do think this would make me better.

I am a fairly short but straight hitter. I rarely (for my handicap) have penalty strokes. A good drive for me though is about 230. I have played before with guys who can consistently hit 280-300. Maybe that is why I would very much like to hit it farther. Human nature to want what you don't have.

Instead of the "I hit 300, but have a terrible short game" guy. You can call me the "my short game is decent, but I can't hit it worth a crap" guy.

Again, human nature to always think "if only....."

 

 

Seriously?

 

230 is a pretty good distance for a drive, and you have not even minimized your handicap to your swing speed. According to the trackman charts you hit your 9i 120 and 6i 147. If I were able to do what's in the bold 5 months ago, I would never have gotten more lessons.

post #22 of 72
230 is a good one. Average is less. I seem to not make good contact very often with the driver. Many are around 200.
post #23 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post

230 is a good one. Average is less. I seem to not make good contact very often with the driver. Many are around 200.

 

Got it, your average drive is something like 205-ish.

 

What is keeping you from increasing your swing speed? What is your variance on center shots? How much of the face do you utilize on your 8i?

post #24 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post

230 is a good one. Average is less. I seem to not make good contact very often with the driver. Many are around 200.

Got it, your average drive is something like 205-ish.

What is keeping you from increasing your swing speed? What is your variance on center shots? How much of the face do you utilize on your 8i?

Good questions. I don't have all those answers. I did hit on a simulator a little while back, and I averaged around 90-95 swing speed with driver. I hit 99 a few times. I do realize that with my SS I could/should be hitting further than 205ish average. I need to work on my swing.

I believe I an capable. I am (relatively) young (33). I am 5'11" and weigh 175, so I don't think there is anything physical holding me back.

I also am not putting anything into swinging faster, my effort is going toward making my swing better. I do plan on trying to use a camera this season.
post #25 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post


Good questions. I don't have all those answers. I did hit on a simulator a little while back, and I averaged around 90-95 swing speed with driver. I hit 99 a few times. I do realize that with my SS I could/should be hitting further than 205ish average. I need to work on my swing.

I believe I an capable. I am (relatively) young (33). I am 5'11" and weigh 175, so I don't think there is anything physical holding me back.

I also am not putting anything into swinging faster, my effort is going toward making my swing better. I do plan on trying to use a camera this season.

 

That's about my size (your a bit taller and weight 20 pounds less). I'm older than you, and have been told that I should be able to carry 270 with my physique. Not sure about the 270 part, but I am carrying about 240 +/-5 to 10 yards depending upon where I hit the face. Your 92mph should give you a carry of 220 and total of 246. This is consistent with your estimate of 230 yards for good shots.

 

The best way to drive consistently 240 is to hit the center of the face. @mvmac tells nags me this every time I see him.

 

You don't need more swing speed, but just more consistency.

post #26 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post


Good questions. I don't have all those answers. I did hit on a simulator a little while back, and I averaged around 90-95 swing speed with driver. I hit 99 a few times. I do realize that with my SS I could/should be hitting further than 205ish average. I need to work on my swing.

I believe I an capable. I am (relatively) young (33). I am 5'11" and weigh 175, so I don't think there is anything physical holding me back.

I also am not putting anything into swinging faster, my effort is going toward making my swing better. I do plan on trying to use a camera this season.

 

That's about my size (your a bit taller and weight 20 pounds less). I'm older than you, and have been told that I should be able to carry 270 with my physique. Not sure about the 270 part, but I am carrying about 240 +/-5 to 10 yards depending upon where I hit the face. Your 92mph should give you a carry of 220 and total of 246. This is consistent with your estimate of 230 yards for good shots.

 

The best way to drive consistently 240 is to hit the center of the face. @mvmac tells (nags) me this every time I see him.

 

You don't need more swing speed, but just more consistency.

 

This seems right.  Every now and then (on flat fairways) if I hit one cleanly (maybe at 99 SS?) I can push it out past 250 carry + roll.  This is extremely rare though, probably only once every few rounds.

 

I do think I have an issue with making my practice swing my real swing.  I do not have a radar, so I do not have a way to check, but I would not be surprised if my practice swings were 5-10 mph faster than my real swing.  I have a problem with hitting the ball.  When a ball is on the tee, I can not even swing to a full follow through.  Must be the "hit" instinct.  This actually is true for all of my clubs, but it seems to cause more problems the longer the club. 

 

 I can actually swing just fine if I put a tee in the ground, and try to clip the top (full follow through), but put a ball there and things go south.  When I say not being able to have a full follow through, what I mean is that every swing has a follow through almost like a punch shot.  Not sure if anyone else has this issue.  I will try to start a my swing thread as soon as the weather gets decent.

post #27 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post
 

 

This seems right.  Every now and then (on flat fairways) if I hit one cleanly (maybe at 99 SS?) I can push it out past 250 carry + roll.  This is extremely rare though, probably only once every few rounds.

 

I do think I have an issue with making my practice swing my real swing.  I do not have a radar, so I do not have a way to check, but I would not be surprised if my practice swings were 5-10 mph faster than my real swing.  I have a problem with hitting the ball.  When a ball is on the tee, I can not even swing to a full follow through.  Must be the "hit" instinct.  This actually is true for all of my clubs, but it seems to cause more problems the longer the club. 

 

 I can actually swing just fine if I put a tee in the ground, and try to clip the top (full follow through), but put a ball there and things go south.  When I say not being able to have a full follow through, what I mean is that every swing has a follow through almost like a punch shot.  Not sure if anyone else has this issue.  I will try to start a my swing thread as soon as the weather gets decent.

 

At least from what I've observed of myself, when I get warmed up on the range and start really compressing balls that is my "max" swing (even though I feel like I could swing it 30 to 40% faster). This is my controlled "range" swing. On the course, I expect to hit 80% of this, or bad things tend to happen. If I am on a roll, I can hit my warmed up "max" swing. This is a rare occasion and only happens when the pace of play is fast.

 

Not sure how it correlates with other people, but the way I hit my max swing appears to be consistent with your 250 (99mph SS) on occasion. I would not swing at 80 on your "normal" swing, but definitely around 90 on the course.

 

The main thing it sounds like is you need is to make more consistent center face contact.

post #28 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

 

It's about 12.5 yards on the driver.

 

And 10 yards (just with the driver, mind you) saves a 70s golfer over half a shot per round.

Maybe I'm a little slow, but I'm not sure if you are saying that 10 yards throughout one's whole bag would add to a decent amount of shots saved per round. I think you are, but that's for a 70's golfer? Like score-wise or age? I take that back, I'm really slow today.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post


I was not joking, and did not take anything as antagonistic.

Great. Sometimes it's hard to read how statements can come across over the internet.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post


When you said farther, I did not think you meant only ten yards. Although that would mean ten further with driver and iron, so instead of 7 iron approach, I could hit 9. I do think this would make me better.

I am a fairly short but straight hitter. I rarely (for my handicap) have penalty strokes.

In the context of this thread (5mph), yes, it would only be ten yards (actually, 12.5 for the driver, thanks @iacas). I suppose, given your game, if you increased your swing speed by 5mph (assuming your ballstriking stays the same), yes, I can see how you can be better simply from a faster swing. Of course, that's assuming that your ballstriking would stay the same, and this is the point I'm getting at:

 

You will get better with a better swing; not simply a faster one, but one where you hit the sweetspot of the clubface more consistently. As an added bonus, you would see gains in distance without ever increasing your current swing speed.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 14ledo81 View Post

I have played before with guys who can consistently hit 280-300. Maybe that is why I would very much like to hit it farther. Human nature to want what you don't have.

What's that Harvey Penick quote? "The woods are full of long hitters."

 

I can hit the ball pretty far (not internet far, mind you) and I'm still a bad golfer. The difference between my ability to hit a 7i versus a 9i onto the green is marginal, at best, whereas my mishits are magnified tremendously. It can be a lot more penal to be 15 yards offline when you are also hitting it 15 yards longer.

 

Appreciate what you have, my friend. You may not be a long hitter, but if you hit it straight, you can play some very good golf.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 

 

The best way to drive consistently 240 is to hit the center of the face. @mvmac tells nags me this every time I see him.

 

You don't need more swing speed, but just more consistency.

Yes, thank you. This is exactly what I'm trying to say.

post #29 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post
 

Maybe I'm a little slow, but I'm not sure if you are saying that 10 yards throughout one's whole bag would add to a decent amount of shots saved per round. I think you are, but that's for a 70's golfer? Like score-wise or age? I take that back, I'm really slow today.

 

10 yards with JUST the driver will save the 70s golfer about half a shot. 20 yards will save him more than a shot. And that's just the driver. Throughout the bag it saves a bit more.

post #30 of 72
I agree 100% that distance makes a huge difference when it comes to scoring. I gained about 20 yards in one year and dropped from a 16 handicap to a 6.
post #31 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post

10 yards with JUST the driver will save the 70s golfer about half a shot. 20 yards will save him more than a shot. And that's just the driver. Throughout the bag it saves a bit more.
Ok that's what I thought you meant. But that's ten yards, not 5 mph as the subject of the thread, right? As in you wouldn't tell a single digit player to learn to swing faster to improve his game?
post #32 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

 

10 yards with JUST the driver will save the 70s golfer about half a shot. 20 yards will save him more than a shot. And that's just the driver. Throughout the bag it saves a bit more.

Interesting, I have at least 10 yards or more on all my irons this year.  I was one club shorter last year and it has not even gotten warm yet here.  I don't really measure my drives so I am not sure how much longer they are, but they are longer

Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post


Ok that's what I thought you meant. But that's ten yards, not 5 mph as the subject of the thread, right? As in you wouldn't tell a single digit player to learn to swing faster to improve his game?

They got more club speed and distance out of me last fall immediately by improving my swing.  The club head speed increase was just part of that.  

post #33 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by cipher View Post

They got more club speed and distance out of me last fall immediately by improving my swing.  The club head speed increase was just part of that.  
Thanks for sharing. That backs up what I'm trying to say: improve the mechanics and the speed and distance will follow, not the other way around.
post #34 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post


Thanks for sharing. That backs up what I'm trying to say: improve the mechanics and the speed and distance will follow, not the other way around.

 

My thoughts exactly. If i get to a point where my swing is pretty sound and the things i'm working on become rather minor adjustments and i'm still only carrying my driver 210-220 as i am currently then thats when i'll start asking my instructor about thoughts on how to increase my swing speed. I'd like to think, as has been said, if I get some better mechanics to my swing my distance will creep up by itself because i realise that 215 average carry is short for someone in their 20s at 5'10" in reasonable shape, so i'm sure that in time i do have at least 10 yards i could gain

post #35 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by billchao View Post


Thanks for sharing. That backs up what I'm trying to say: improve the mechanics and the speed and distance will follow, not the other way around.

And I think it is worth noting that there are other factors than speed when improving the mechanics that are improving distance. Swing speed it just a small part of improving distance. As you improve the mechanics, clean contact improves, center face contact improves, angle of attack, and often the face/path relationship gap is tightened.  All these things will gain the player more distance with greater accuracy.

post #36 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooFader View Post

My thoughts exactly. If i get to a point where my swing is pretty sound and the things i'm working on become rather minor adjustments and i'm still only carrying my driver 210-220 as i am currently then thats when i'll start asking my instructor about thoughts on how to increase my swing speed. I'd like to think, as has been said, if I get some better mechanics to my swing my distance will creep up by itself because i realise that 215 average carry is short for someone in their 20s at 5'10" in reasonable shape, so i'm sure that in time i do have at least 10 yards i could gain

You could probably gain even more than 10 yards just hitting better shots in the center of the face with better swing mechanics. 215 carry is pretty respectable already, and as my coaches stated a couple times work on your consistency and form and the distance when you have nothing else to work on.

Like @cipher mentioned earlier, just improving the form and consistency brought distance and speed without really trying to gain it. That's because you start hitting the center of the face with the proper face angle and swing path. As your swing path becomes more efficient, you gain more speed.

My son who's only 5'6" is starting to out drive me, but his mechanics is really good and only getting better. By the time he's our size it would not be unrealistic for him to drive 280 or more without really trying any harder.
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