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Young People not Playing. Golf Leagues Shrinking - Page 3

post #37 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by teamroper60 View Post
 

You say you understand but apparently, you really don't.   Employees don't get to decide whether their job has flexible hours.   That is reserved for the business owner and if he/she expects to be successful, they are going to primarily base their decisions not on what is best for the employee's fun, but on what is best for the fiscal health of their business.   An employee telling the boss he/she won't work weekends if needed and asking to take off early one day a week, is likely to find themselves looking for a new job and in case you haven't been paying attention, finding a new one is not exactly guaranteed.

 

Rather than questioning the priorities/dedication to golf of those who can't take off from work early to play in a league, I think you might want to instead, just thank your lucky stars your job allows you to do so..

Still doesn't address my point that If I can do it for 14 years and people before me have done it for 30 years why can't we get new people from the same company?  We all have the same rules.  These guys are just terrified to even try it.  Believe me we are not working on infrastructure, health or time critical stuff.......

post #38 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post I'm blaming the employees for not keeping work/life balance. 

 

It happens, especially, to younger, eager career minded folks.  Give them 10 more years of corporate America and they will change.  As for me (52 years old and aging), golf has higher priority than work :-).   I have no problem burning 1/2 day of vacation to play golf (and I burn it often enough). 

post #39 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post
 


Agree completely,  Like i said earlier.  I'm one to believe that if you want it enough you will make it happen.  I'm not blaming the corporations, I'm blaming the employees for not keeping work/life balance.

You're assuming the cause is work and not higher priority activities in life such as spending time with family, taking care of younger children, running kids to after school activities, attending kids sporting events, or taking evening college classes.

 

The role of men has changed significantly over the last 20 years.  Men are much more involved in home life today than their fathers were and the increase of dual income families requires both parents share the responsibilities in the home.

post #40 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post
 

You're assuming the cause is work and not higher priority activities in life such as spending time with family, taking care of younger children, running kids to after school activities, attending kids sporting events, or taking evening college classes.

 

The role of men has changed significantly over the last 20 years.  Men are much more involved in home life today than their fathers were and the increase of dual income families requires both parents share the responsibilities in the home.


Oh there is no assumption...  I know these people.  All unmarried.

 

I think it has more to do with what rkim says

"It happens, especially, to younger, eager career minded folks.  Give them 10 more years of corporate America and they will change."

post #41 of 104
Thread Starter 

I also have noticed a "if I'm not good at it immediately, i'm not going to do it" mentality among the younger players

post #42 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post

I also have noticed a "if I'm not good at it immediately, i'm not going to do it" mentality among the younger players


 



Where are you? Everything you've described is the opposite of the younger golfers I see here.
post #43 of 104

My observations:

 

Younger people working more hours than older people is not something that's new. They are at a lower end of pay scales, trying to climb the ladder and starting from scratch buying the things they want to own. They often have a mortgage and kids and are trying to make ends meet. Nothing new there.

 

Most of them are slightly over-extended with the houses they buy, the cars they drive, and the things they think they "need". They think they should automatically "have" all of the things their parents have (if not nicer things) and don't seem to get that their parents skimped and saved and did without for many years before getting to that position. (My own kids are certainly no exception. SMH!!!)

 

If anything young people work many less hours than my generation did. I worked 7 days a week and almost always 12 to 16 hour shifts during my 20s and 30s. My dad woke up at 5 o'clock every morning and ran a paper route, then taught school, then flipped hamburgers at a local burger joint at night. My mom taught school all day and taught piano lessons all evening.

 

Finding young people that are even willing to occasionally work a double shift at the joist company where I worked was almost impossible. I'm not saying that critically. In fact if I could go back in time I would have spent much more time with my oldest two kids and much less time at work.

 

The biggest drawback to joining a league for most people around here is they don't want to commit to playing at a certain time on a certain day each week. I've never played in a league for that very reason. If a course has a choose up dogfight at a certain time I might go play in it every day, but it is not a commitment. Anybody that's in the mood just shows up.

post #44 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave2512 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post
 

I also have noticed a "if I'm not good at it immediately, i'm not going to do it" mentality among the younger players

 



Where are you? Everything you've described is the opposite of the younger golfers I see here.


Pennsylvania.    Northeast US

post #45 of 104

One main reason or I should say theory why the demise of attendance and participation in golf in the 21-39 age group. This age group does not care for time commitment- 5-7 hours depending on travel and warm-up, they are too busy spending 250 bucks a month on cell phone, cable and internet charges today to consider joining a club- For most of us none of theses costs existed 20 years ago.  They have ongoing careers, longer commutes, starting familys/marraige/buying homes/cars/vacations. They did not grow up with golf as a family based activity, instead these kids grew up with soccer and video games. They were not taught golf in gym class-instead it was everything but. Dad may have played golf on Saturdays, dad is not cool.  Dad skied, so that means snowboarding for me.

 

The end result is a missing generation of golfers and we are now experiencing it. This has been building and other sports and activities are experiencing similar examples. "Take me fishing" was a campaign for the fishing industry, hunting is also way down- but gun ownership is way up.The generation before had who are now 45-60 experienced golf country clubs and all the social aspects. They were encouraged as part of their career to socialize and maybe conducts some business on a golf course.

 

Now before everyone chimes in with " I didn't play at a country club, I'm 26 and I play golf...etc etc" I speaking from a mile high view of what has been transpiring in most areas of the country and is a deep concern of golf courses, golf memberships, leagues, private clubs and of course anyone associated with golf merchandise- manufacturers included.  With almost perfect weather conditions described as "golfing days" we had an unusual high number of days last year. In fact 15% higher number than in stormy 2012.  Golf rounds were down and golfers playing golf #s were down. New young golfers especially. Older guys golfing 55+ took a substantial hit in retirement funds, health insurance being sky high for this group the past 5 years and others have simply become disinterested or dropped out.  For every new golf course opening up this year- 20 will close, not sold,  closed. 

post #46 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spitfisher View Post
 

One main reason or I should say theory why the demise of attendance and participation in golf in the 21-39 age group. This age group does not care for time commitment- 5-7 hours depending on travel and warm-up, they are too busy spending 250 bucks a month on cell phone, cable and internet charges today to consider joining a club- For most of us none of theses costs existed 20 years ago.  They have ongoing careers, longer commutes, starting familys/marraige/buying homes/cars/vacations. They did not grow up with golf as a family based activity, instead these kids grew up with soccer and video games. They were not taught golf in gym class-instead it was everything but. Dad may have played golf on Saturdays, dad is not cool.  Dad skied, so that means snowboarding for me.

 

The end result is a missing generation of golfers and we are now experiencing it. This has been building and other sports and activities are experiencing similar examples. "Take me fishing" was a campaign for the fishing industry, hunting is also way down- but gun ownership is way up.The generation before had who are now 45-60 experienced golf country clubs and all the social aspects. They were encouraged as part of their career to socialize and maybe conducts some business on a golf course.

 

Now before everyone chimes in with " I didn't play at a country club, I'm 26 and I play golf...etc etc" I speaking from a mile high view of what has been transpiring in most areas of the country and is a deep concern of golf courses, golf memberships, leagues, private clubs and of course anyone associated with golf merchandise- manufacturers included.  With almost perfect weather conditions described as "golfing days" we had an unusual high number of days last year. In fact 15% higher number than in stormy 2012.  Golf rounds were down and golfers playing golf #s were down. New young golfers especially. Older guys golfing 55+ took a substantial hit in retirement funds, health insurance being sky high for this group the past 5 years and others have simply become disinterested or dropped out.  For every new golf course opening up this year- 20 will close, not sold,  closed. 


Very well put. 

 

Before golf, I enjoyed bowling and played in leagues.  The leagues are no where to be found.   Instead, the remaining bowling alleys (many have closed) have became a birthday celebration place for 8 year olds, and teenagers to gather on Friday/Saturday night and cause havoc (none of them know any bowling etiquette).   Compare to bowling, I think golf is relatively doing ok despite decline seen in many places.    That keeps the green fees in check.   Many courses around my area kept the same green fee structure for the last 5 years.   

post #47 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spitfisher View Post
 

One main reason or I should say theory why the demise of attendance and participation in golf in the 21-39 age group. This age group does not care for time commitment- 5-7 hours depending on travel and warm-up, they are too busy spending 250 bucks a month on cell phone, cable and internet charges today to consider joining a club- For most of us none of theses costs existed 20 years ago.  They have ongoing careers, longer commutes, starting familys/marraige/buying homes/cars/vacations. They did not grow up with golf as a family based activity, instead these kids grew up with soccer and video games. They were not taught golf in gym class-instead it was everything but. Dad may have played golf on Saturdays, dad is not cool.  Dad skied, so that means snowboarding for me.

 

The end result is a missing generation of golfers and we are now experiencing it. This has been building and other sports and activities are experiencing similar examples. "Take me fishing" was a campaign for the fishing industry, hunting is also way down- but gun ownership is way up.The generation before had who are now 45-60 experienced golf country clubs and all the social aspects. They were encouraged as part of their career to socialize and maybe conducts some business on a golf course.

 

Now before everyone chimes in with " I didn't play at a country club, I'm 26 and I play golf...etc etc" I speaking from a mile high view of what has been transpiring in most areas of the country and is a deep concern of golf courses, golf memberships, leagues, private clubs and of course anyone associated with golf merchandise- manufacturers included.  With almost perfect weather conditions described as "golfing days" we had an unusual high number of days last year. In fact 15% higher number than in stormy 2012.  Golf rounds were down and golfers playing golf #s were down. New young golfers especially. Older guys golfing 55+ took a substantial hit in retirement funds, health insurance being sky high for this group the past 5 years and others have simply become disinterested or dropped out.  For every new golf course opening up this year- 20 will close, not sold,  closed. 


Good points.  I thought about this as well - the technology distractions and overall rising costs of digital life.

 

Ironically my father loves baseball, pushed me into baseball, played baseball to death into his late 40's early 50's.    I don't like watching baseball,  i'll play it in a pick up game but I would never join a league.   No one in my family played golf.  I started cause a buddy of mine took me out on the course when i was 15.  Shot 122 that day....   But now my father is a golfaholic once i started playing in High school and college.    So yeah i can see that sometimes kids also want to distance themselves from parents

post #48 of 104

Interesting responses.  Play in a league for the chamber.  Our team is paid for by the company.  Thursdays @ 4:30.  Everyone on the team knows that if both machines are down, nobody will golf that day.  Has not happened on a Thur yet.  I'm 38, 2 others @ 22.  One at 40, and alternate at 39.

 

Most of the folks in the league are from the plant next to us and younger guys.  Not a good representative sample though.  South of I-10 in AL.  Lot more laid back down here.

 

Semi-related.  Most salary folks, myself included, never take our full vacation at my plant.

post #49 of 104
Closing in on 40, so guess not really young....

Any way, work is tremendously unpredictable and not willing to set a precedent of having to leave "early" every whichever day. Much prefer to bang out early morning 9's whenever I can and still get to work at a decent time. Plan 1/2 days off for 18.
post #50 of 104

I believe the entire premise for this thread is complete hogwash.  League play is just fine...................in fact there are TOO MANY leagues.  LOL

post #51 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post
 


Agree completely,  Like i said earlier.  I'm one to believe that if you want it enough you will make it happen.  I'm not blaming the corporations, I'm blaming the employees for not keeping work/life balance. 

You don't get to set their priorities and "blaming" them for not choosing to spend their time the same way you do, seems almost adolescent.  

post #52 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by teamroper60 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachinPA View Post
 


Agree completely,  Like i said earlier.  I'm one to believe that if you want it enough you will make it happen.  I'm not blaming the corporations, I'm blaming the employees for not keeping work/life balance. 

You don't get to set their priorities and "blaming" them for not choosing to spend their time the same way you do, seems almost adolescent.  

 

but..but..  shouldn't everybody like the same things I do???  After all, the things I do are the best....

post #53 of 104

In Calgary, they cost far too much and start too early.

 

The cheaper leagues are out of the city, and last tee time is at 5:30pm - I would have to park and sprint to the teebox to make it

 

I'm stuck playing weekends at $110 a round

post #54 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran123 View Post
 

In Calgary, they cost far too much and start too early.

 

The cheaper leagues are out of the city, and last tee time is at 5:30pm - I would have to park and sprint to the teebox to make it

 

I'm stuck playing weekends at $110 a round


In the county where I live most of the major industries have day shifts that run from 6:00 am to 2:00 pm. That should be perfect for golfers (and it always was for me) but unfortunately there is probably a lower percentage of people that play golf per capita here than almost any place I know of.

 

Golf just never was a big part of the culture around here, mostly for financial reasons (perceived or real).

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