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If tour pros played the same crappy course that we play

post #1 of 24
Thread Starter 

I won't even assume to know the answer to this but I often wondered how pros would score if they had to play the same crappy courses we have had to play.  I know they catch a bad break every now and then and have to hit off a root,  or red dirt or where their ball is sitting down in a hole but I have seen them screw up those shots a LOT.

 

So my question is.... Do you think if they had to hit off the same crappy lies and "Johnson" grass that we do they could get that perfect contact all the time like they do on those manicured fairways?  Also, I play at a cheap course to practice on and when the guys get together we go to a really nice country club.  The difference is night and day!  Even when hitting a shot out of the grass in the fairway you KNOW that you can hit down and through the ball without the thought that you might break your wrist hitting a rock. Divots fly 50 feet tall!!!  LOL

 

Anyway, let me know what you guys think.

post #2 of 24

Biggest difference is the misses..when they miss they have a human backboard to stop the ball or a million eyes to find the lost ball in deep grass. How often do you see a "lost ball" at a PGA event...almost never.

 

On a "goat ranch" most PGA players would score better then you think..on a real tough course I think they'd score well but probably would have a few more "penalty" shots because the gallery doesn't save a ball or they can't find a big miss in deep grass.

 

But...they are tour players for a reason...they don't need cushy lies to hit off of.

 

My brother could have played the tour...serious talent. He could hit a driver off a sidewalk 250-275 yards and not put a scratch on the club..I know this because it was always my damn club he'd do it with! LOL (back in the persimmon days.)

post #3 of 24

On your bog standard run of the mill course the top tour players would rip it apart if they played half decent. I would guess if they had a couple of practice rounds they would be breaking course records with ease.

 

I know they would on my home course, the course record is 65 (-4). The course is considered one of the harder courses in the area. What I would consider a tight tee shot these pro's could hit it blindfolded in a practice round without millions of people watching them. Your average course is just too short for these guys and the greens just too flat.

post #4 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royster1984 View Post
 

On your bog standard run of the mill course the top tour players would rip it apart if they played half decent. I would guess if they had a couple of practice rounds they would be breaking course records with ease.

 

I know they would on my home course, the course record is 65 (-4). The course is considered one of the harder courses in the area. What I would consider a tight tee shot these pro's could hit it blindfolded in a practice round without millions of people watching them. Your average course is just too short for these guys and the greens just too flat.

 

I tend to agree with the latter parts of this post. TPC Sawgrass is rated 76.8/155 from the Championship tees. One of my local courses is rated 70.7/125. Aside from being flatter, most local greens will run much slower as well. I would assume that to mean that a professional could just shoot at the flag, as opposed to having to think about what portion of the green the ball needs to land on. There's also probably a lot less trouble around most local greens (bunkers are extremely expensive to upkeep, and, at least in my area, there tends to be a lot less of them around). 

post #5 of 24

The public courses I play are not crappy at all, they are all very nice, and well kept.

 

My home course, The Heritage at Westmoor, they hold local US Open Qualifiers there and from the tips plays a whopping 7400 yards. No walk in the park, and they can setup the green to roll very fast too.

 

The PGA Tour would still light it up there though, If there was a PGA Tournament there, winning score would easily be in the -20s.

post #6 of 24

I agree that the pros would easily break the course records at all of the public courses I have played without any problem.

 

I also agree that they would have to make an adjustment and not go for as much as they do on the well-manicured courses where "the woods" are more like a city park where there is usually a good chance of finding the ball and hitting it out of there.

(I love those courses). :-D

 

They would simply hit their fairway woods and long irons on those holes (and hit those farther than most of us hit our drivers anyway) and it wouldn't be a problem at all.

 

Their biggest hurdle would be getting out of the car once they saw the course they were going to be playing and the travel trailer being used for the clubhouse. :bugout:

post #7 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Motley01 View Post
 

The public courses I play are not crappy at all, they are all very nice, and well kept.

 

My home course, The Heritage at Westmoor, they hold local US Open Qualifiers there and from the tips plays a whopping 7400 yards. No walk in the park, and they can setup the green to roll very fast too.

 

The PGA Tour would still light it up there though, If there was a PGA Tournament there, winning score would easily be in the -20s.

 

I don't think that those types of courses are in the spirit of the thread - I think the OP is talking about cheaper courses or local municipal courses, as opposed to quality courses. Sure, there's a course around here called Firekeeper, designed by Notah Begay, that is comparable in terms of price to the course you're talking about. It's 7500+ yards from the tips, and rated 77.1/137. 

post #8 of 24

They've done this before and it's not as low as you might think it would be.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/01/AR2007070101221_2.html

 

Good read.

post #9 of 24
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhanson View Post
 

 

I don't think that those types of courses are in the spirit of the thread - I think the OP is talking about cheaper courses or local municipal courses, as opposed to quality courses. Sure, there's a course around here called Firekeeper, designed by Notah Begay, that is comparable in terms of price to the course you're talking about. It's 7500+ yards from the tips, and rated 77.1/137. 

 

Correct.  I wasn't talking about the distances to the flag, I was more talking about how nice the ball is always sitting on those nice courses. The really nice manicured courses I have played, if you hit the ball in the fairway it is usually sitting so nice that it is the equivalent of teeing the ball up 1/2 inch on a crappy course.  What I'm trying to say is that it is REALLY REALLY easy to get the club face on the ball on these types of courses (At least the ones I played).  The pros ALWAYS play these great courses.  I know they are longer and have more elevation and all that but even then it is still easier to get good clean strikes on the ball.  The places a lot of us have to play the ball doesn't sit up like.  If you are a pure striker like the pros yes you can get great contact but a bad strike will result in disaster.  On great courses a strike that is not pure is not as severely penalized it seems (I could be wrong).  Kind of like on a par 3 if you tee the ball up it gives you some wiggle room for a strike that is not perfect.  Anyway, that's my opinion and I was just wondering what you guys thought about that.

post #10 of 24
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by poser View Post
 

They've done this before and it's not as low as you might think it would be.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/01/AR2007070101221_2.html

 

Good read.

 

Yep that kind of hits on some of the things I was thinking.

post #11 of 24

tour players will destroy most courses the typical weekend golfer plays.....................................what you call a terrible hardpan lie, the pro's say YUMMY.   They will tear the course apart. 

post #12 of 24
Thread Starter 
Look at the imprint this club puts on the grass every time he sits it down. That would be a nice fluffy lie for the golf ball.  Easy to get good contact almost like sitting on a tee.  You can't find that on any fairway on the course I use to practice on.  I wonder if practicing on a crappy course affects my swing thought process when I play better places.
post #13 of 24
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut View Post

 
tour players will destroy most courses the typical weekend golfer plays.....................................what you call a terrible hardpan lie, the pro's say YUMMY.   They will tear the course apart. 

You may be correct but I do have a question about that. If these bad lies don't matter, why are they visibly upset and complaining when their ball ends up there?  I have never seen a pro on tv looking pleased when his ball rolls in the pine straw, hard dirt, gravel dirt or sitting down in an old divot.

Despite being asked a few times I keep failing to multiquote. I will do better from here on.
post #14 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut View Post

tour players will destroy most courses the typical weekend golfer plays.....................................what you call a terrible hardpan lie, the pro's say YUMMY.   They will tear the course apart. 

^^^^^Yep^^^^^. I don't know about "yummy", but you're right, they tear them up.

Chris DiMarco lives in the area here. He owns the course record on at least 3 local courses that I know of. 2 63's and a 62.. One of the 63's was shot the first time he played the course, within a month of its opening. None of these courses could be called tour-pristine by any means.

Doubters should also get out to some buy.com events. Some of those are played on some pretty rough tracks. Do pros prefer perfect conditions? Sure, just like we do, but they strike the ball so solidly that a tough lie affects them a lot less that we mere mortals. The relative easy course and set-up that most of us play far outweighs a few less than perfect lies!
post #15 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckeyeNut View Post
 

tour players will destroy most courses the typical weekend golfer plays.....................................what you call a terrible hardpan lie, the pro's say YUMMY.   They will tear the course apart. 


Hardpan lie? The YUMMIEST lie for me. :dance::dance::dance: I'll take them all day long!!! The harder the pan the better.

 

On the other hand, holes, rocks, leaves, "fairway grass" 1 1/2 inches tall, sloping tee boxes, unputtable greens, and balls disappearing forever in the rough are not any fun for ANYBODY. :surrender:

 

(The pros would still beat the heck out of us on any of it, but wouldn't be happy campers, and wouldn't ever come back again).

post #16 of 24

These threads pop up every now and then, they make me laugh. If anyone truly thinks they would have the "edge" competing against a tour pro on their local goat track, they are completely delusional about the difference between a tour player and joe-blow scratch. 

 

If you think that the bad lies are gonna kill them consider the mind blowing recovery shots these guys hit at every event. Sure they prefer a perfect lie but that doesn't mean they couldn't break par with crap lies. Hell, Tiger has won events where he's never even sniffed the fairway let alone had a perfect lie for his approach.

post #17 of 24
@David in FL played a casual round with GMAC on a harder than average course and that guy basically moonwalked his way around that place for something like a 64. @BuckeyeNut is right ... These guys would destroy our average courses.
post #18 of 24
There is a former tour pro that lives in this area, Steve something from Ft. Morgan CO. He is one of those that barely managed a year or two on tour so not the rich and famous type. Last year he played my home course and shot a 62 from the championship tees 74.7/131 7435 yards. Even very good golfers tear up these places. Likewise the courses in the area that host US Open qualifiers and Web.com events are noticeably tougher when I play there and that's with every day conditions. My guess is if they would be frustrated with anything it would be the poor condition of the greens and the resulting inconsistency.
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