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SEC investigating Phil Mickelson for insider trading - Page 2

post #19 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by topspin4hand View Post

Phil's attorney said he's not the subject of any investigation but the reports seem to indicate otherwise.  I will definitely follow this to see what stage of the investigation the feds are in.



Phil should say nothing, so unlike Martha, he cannot be convicted of lying.
post #20 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

Agree.  It is part of the "Manufactured Outrage" approach of today's media.  Phil will be tried and convicted or acquitted in the media long before the investigation is complete.

 

It's easy to throw the allegation at the media (who don't have the power to sentance him anyway) but let's not forget that Phil has been very happy to play the media over the years to help cultivate the Mr Clean, all American image, which he's been more than happy to then exploit to secure endorsements and heaven knows how much moolah.

 

OK we tend to take a more cyncial view of these manufactured personnas and never bought into the Mickelson thing anyway, so I can hoenstly say this comes as absolutely no shock at all (anymore than the final unmasking of Lance Armstrong did). I think we prefer our sports stars to have a darker side though

 

Where we have gone through this media thing in the past like few others is our irrational obsession with things royal. Yes we might feign shock at the way that members of the royal family were pursused by the media, even resulting in one of them being killed, but the bottom line is the media only report what will sell and therefore reflect opinion as much as they generate it. If the golf watching public of America were really that indignant all they'd have to do is threaten cancel their subscriptions to the golf channel and then you'd quickly see how newsworthy they regarded it 

post #21 of 63

Well he's got to try to get back ahead after all those taxes he pays. 

post #22 of 63

I wonder how these posts would read if you replaced "Phil Mickelson" with "Tiger Woods."

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FarawayFairways View Post
 

It's easy to throw the allegation at the media (who don't have the power to sentance him anyway) but let's not forget that Phil has been very happy to play the media over the years to help cultivate the Mr Clean, all American image, which he's been more than happy to then exploit to secure endorsements and heaven knows how much moolah.

 

QFT.

post #23 of 63

It might amuse you to know that the marketing agency used by the R&A have had a bad week!!!

 

Featuring across the UK's newspapers on Saturday with have a series of ads for the Open (sadly I can't find an electronic version to show you) but they read

 

JOIN GOLF'S GIANTS AT ROYAL LIVERPOOL

 

McIlroy, Woods, Mickelson. Don't miss your chance to see golf's giants battle it out on the game's biggest stage. Join them at Royal Liverpool

 

 

 

I'd love to have heard the conversation. 

 

"we have to produce things in threes, it scans better. Who shall we use? Well Rory McIlroy obviously, he's involved with Wozniackei so bound to lend some glamour. Tiger is a definite, can't see anything going wrong there. And Phil is defending champion and mister squeaky clean all American good guy who cup cakes wouldn't melt in his mouth.

 

Great that's our three headline acts sorted then, what could possibly go wrong?"

post #24 of 63

People with money get stock and investment tips all the time.  If they can prove Phil knew they were insider tips then he's guilty, if they can't, he becomes a witness for the SEC and pays a fine.  Knowing what happened to Martha Stewart he'd be stupid to lie.

post #25 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowfly View Post
 

Unfortunately the media acts to create as much interest as possible and thus drive opinion by juxtaposition toward guilty until proven innocent. Side note, adding fuel to the fire is having a professional gambler involved with a professional athlete in an unsavory activity. 

 

Innocent until proven guilty my folks, let the investigation take its course.

You seem to be assuming that our opinions on this matter in some way. You might have time in your life to analyze and assess all the nuances and particulars of this news story. I don't. That said I know full well that my opinion on Phil Mickelson doesn't amount to jacksquat so why would I bother with trying to weigh out both sides of the issue to make sure my judgment is fair and equitable. As a completely disinterested observer I am free to say THROW THE BOOK AT HIM just like people are free to say PHIL IS A CLASS ACT ad infinitum or whatever. Tiger, Phil, boo, hiss, whatever, it's all pro wrestling to me.

post #26 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by legitimatebeef View Post

You seem to be assuming that our opinions on this matter in some way. You might have time in your life to analyze and assess all the nuances and particulars of this news story. I don't. That said I know full well that my opinion on Phil Mickelson doesn't amount to jacksquat so why would I bother with trying to weigh out both sides of the issue to make sure my judgment is fair and equitable. As a completely disinterested observer I am free to say THROW THE BOOK AT HIM just like people are free to say PHIL IS A CLASS ACT ad infinitum or whatever. Tiger, Phil, boo, hiss, whatever, it's all pro wrestling to me.


Geez no hard feelings there, enjoy your cross to bear.
post #27 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by legitimatebeef View Post

You seem to be assuming that our opinions on this matter in some way. You might have time in your life to analyze and assess all the nuances and particulars of this news story. I don't. That said I know full well that my opinion on Phil Mickelson doesn't amount to jacksquat so why would I bother with trying to weigh out both sides of the issue to make sure my judgment is fair and equitable.

I hope that, if you're ever accused in a public manner of doing something illegal and/or unethical, that people who hear of the story show you more consideration than you're showing Phil.
post #28 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

I wonder how these posts would read if you replaced "Phil Mickelson" with "Tiger Woods."

 

 

QFT.

 

Took the words right out of my mouth

post #29 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by FarawayFairways View Post
 

 

It's easy to throw the allegation at the media (who don't have the power to sentance him anyway) but let's not forget that Phil has been very happy to play the media over the years to help cultivate the Mr Clean, all American image, which he's been more than happy to then exploit to secure endorsements and heaven knows how much moolah.

 

OK we tend to take a more cyncial view of these manufactured personnas and never bought into the Mickelson thing anyway, so I can hoenstly say this comes as absolutely no shock at all (anymore than the final unmasking of Lance Armstrong did). I think we prefer our sports stars to have a darker side though

 

Where we have gone through this media thing in the past like few others is our irrational obsession with things royal. Yes we might feign shock at the way that members of the royal family were pursused by the media, even resulting in one of them being killed, but the bottom line is the media only report what will sell and therefore reflect opinion as much as they generate it. If the golf watching public of America were really that indignant all they'd have to do is threaten cancel their subscriptions to the golf channel and then you'd quickly see how newsworthy they regarded it 

I agree with you.  I will just add that we, the media's customers, tend to feed the monster.  Lately, I will turn off the news in the car because it seems they are just trying to make me angry.  I don't want to be angry.  They want us to be outraged!  Politics and political arguments are worse.  They want us to absolutely hate the opponent or opposing argument.  I don't want to hate anyone unless they really deserve it.  

 

As for Phil, the honesty that he plays golf with is what he needs right now with the SEC.  The SEC is a very powerful entity that was created to prevent rampant cheating in the market.

 

Funny, if Roger Goodell was PGA Commissioner, Phil would be suspended already without appeal. :-P

post #30 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post
 

I wonder how these posts would read if you replaced "Phil Mickelson" with "Tiger Woods."

 

 

QFT.

Lol, I know you don't have to wonder much, you already knew the answer to that. 

 

As for Phil, I would like to hope this gets cleared up quickly before it becomes a major distraction for him.

post #31 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post

People with money get stock and investment tips all the time.  If they can prove Phil knew they were insider tips then he's guilty, if they can't, he becomes a witness for the SEC and pays a fine.  Knowing what happened to Martha Stewart he'd be stupid to lie.
This really can't be compared to Martha Stuart, simple put she was stupid, she lied to the Feds and their was a paper trail indicating "she" was informed, not a financial analysis or her admin, but she was informed that a company that she owned stock in was about to tank, days ahead of the breaking news. She was stupid and was lucky to get what she received as a pan ally/fine and jail time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by legitimatebeef View Post

You seem to be assuming that our opinions on this matter in some way. You might have time in your life to analyze and assess all the nuances and particulars of this news story. I don't. That said I know full well that my opinion on Phil Mickelson doesn't amount to jacksquat so why would I bother with trying to weigh out both sides of the issue to make sure my judgment is fair and equitable. As a completely disinterested observer I am free to say THROW THE BOOK AT HIM just like people are free to say PHIL IS A CLASS ACT ad infinitum or whatever. Tiger, Phil, boo, hiss, whatever, it's all pro wrestling to me.

This is an excellent point, because this is often the mind set of average people, ( not all) especially when it concerns breaking news of celebrity/athlete. They scan the head line and make a quick evaluation. They expect the possy to round up the bad guys without any additional facts or even consideration that the headlines were used to grab attention. Phil may be part of the investigation, but we can be assured Phil is not on his Callaway Pajamas @11:30pm feverishly trading stocks based intel that he recieved that day. I'm sure there are people in high places that handle his financial affairs, but he does own the stocks and authorizations.


And for what its worth if this was. Tiger rather than Phil, it would be the leading story on the golf channel and TMZ for the next 10-14 days without any more details being released. A certain percentage would refer to it as witch hunt going after him, another percentage would be wishing for the gallows to be constructed for the public hanging and yet another percentage would be reminding us of how great a father he is, how many tour wins he has and what he has done for the game of golf. b2_tongue.gif
post #32 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
 

I agree with you.  I will just add that we, the media's customers, tend to feed the monster.  Lately, I will turn off the news in the car because it seems they are just trying to make me angry.  I don't want to be angry.  They want us to be outraged!  Politics and political arguments are worse.  They want us to absolutely hate the opponent or opposing argument.  I don't want to hate anyone unless they really deserve it.  

 

 

 

The media's altered Boogie, (especially the print media) and can no longer report news because it's out of date almost as soon as it hits the press with the advent of so called social media. Instead they've had to look to other approaches in order to stay relevant and maintain their following. I believe what we've witnessed is a subtle move away from reporting, and trying to manage your emotional reaction to a story of questionable authenticity instead. In nearly always involves trying to whip up ones moral indignation through the production of an inflamatory extreme example (often historical), which they then use to try and get you to demonise those who they broadly encourage you to hold responsible. Lay that onto a political landscape and the implications are clear. I don't believe the US is too bad, in that you don't really have national newspapers, and your reporting is much more state based. In this respect the UK with its notorious tabloids leads the field. Where I think the US has taken this sort of thing to a different level though is so called talk radio. I wouldn't be too surprised to discover that Phil had been the subject of such shows, as it isn't difficult to provoke a reaction with the right bait on a hook

post #33 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by FarawayFairways View Post
 

 

It's easy to throw the allegation at the media (who don't have the power to sentance him anyway) but let's not forget that Phil has been very happy to play the media over the years to help cultivate the Mr Clean, all American image, which he's been more than happy to then exploit to secure endorsements and heaven knows how much moolah.

 

Perhaps I'm naive but if Phil has spent so much time and effort to create a Mr Clean image, is he also so stupid and greedy to knowingly get involved in illegal activity?  When my girlfriend saw the headline, her reaction was "does he really need that much more money!?" 

post #34 of 63

People with that kind of money should be paying someone to manage their money. I find it hard to believe Lefty is looking at an Ameritrade screen on his laptop in a hotel room and clicking his mouse. So he's telling his broker that he's heard some good things about Chlorox.

 

On the other hand, the trade in question was a $225K deal for an 5 day call option. It took in several million.  That's the kind of bet that takes big balls for a golfer to make unless you know something. However, that golfer hits crazy shots out of trees with a million bucks on the line, and also has $180M in the bank so that's pocket change. When you have that kind of money, your bottom line easily fluctuates $1M with a bad day on the DOW. What's $225K? I also figure his broker quizzed him about the source of his hunch, as any money manager knows the kind of heat a bet like that makes when it wins.

 

Had to be a leak. No one comes out of the blue and bets on a soap company. like that. Anyway, it was a short term capital gains, so they all probably paid in at 39%. That's $1.2M for the tax coffers. Everyone wins if you ask me.

post #35 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWu1948 View Post
 

People with that kind of money should be paying someone to manage their money. I find it hard to believe Lefty is looking at an Ameritrade screen on his laptop in a hotel room and clicking his mouse. So he's telling his broker that he's heard some good things about Chlorox.

 

On the other hand, the trade in question was a $225K deal for an 5 day call option. It took in several million.  That's the kind of bet that takes big balls for a golfer to make unless you know something. However, that golfer hits crazy shots out of trees with a million bucks on the line, and also has $180M in the bank so that's pocket change. When you have that kind of money, your bottom line easily fluctuates $1M with a bad day on the DOW. What's $225K? I also figure his broker quizzed him about the source of his hunch, as any money manager knows the kind of heat a bet like that makes when it wins.

 

Had to be a leak. No one comes out of the blue and bets on a soap company. like that. Anyway, it was a short term capital gains, so they all probably paid in at 39%. That's $1.2M for the tax coffers. Everyone wins if you ask me.


I'm not so sure about the "everybody wins" part of this, the money has to come from somewhere and somebody has to work for it at one time or another, this whole thing is going to wind up costing Phil more than what he made on this trade, the last thing he wants is this kind of publicity with his name tied to people who he would rather no one knew about. In the end if he winds up being caught doing insider trading it just adds fuel to the fire with the argument about the income inequity in this country, people with more money than they would ever need cheating to acquire more at anyone elses expense, that grinds the gears of a lot of people.

post #36 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by boogielicious View Post
The SEC is a very powerful entity that was created to prevent rampant cheating in the market.

 

 

Created to prevent - doesn't mean that they do it very well. Ask Mr. Madoff :banana:

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