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Scotty Cameron... Should I? - Page 2

post #19 of 104
If you aren't spending next month's rent money, get a Scotty if you like the feel! People don't flinch buying $300 plus drivers... But, like a driver, you might want to seek out a skilled Titleist fitter for assistance in selection and fit. Then, if the Scotty is making you feel good, get out and spend some time every week (or more often) on the practice green to make sure you are getting the full value of the club.

For what it is worth, I love mine. If you take the plunge let us know what you select.
post #20 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bird E3 View Post

Buy it, and if you don't like it you will lose $50 selling it.

That is a benefit of Scotty putters. You can sell them for a pretty high percentage of full value even a few years later.
post #21 of 104

The only club in my bag that I am not wanting to try something new is my Scotty. I've been playing it for 11 years and still seem to fall in love with it every round.

post #22 of 104
You use the putter more than any other club in the bag, period.

Why not use the best in the world. Scotty Cameron.
post #23 of 104

I personally like my Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum a good deal, because it looks nice and works well for me. I tested it and, while now it may be a half inch short or so due to growth, I aim it on my intended starting line at address every time and can put a consistent roll on the ball each stroke. 

 

I did, however, find a great deal on it. I got it from a local Golfsmith in like-new condition for only $125 because it didn't have a headcover, and then I bought the headcover for $15 afterwords.

post #24 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfbarefoot View Post

You use the putter more than any other club in the bag, period. Why not use the best in the world. Scotty Cameron.

 

Because at the end of the day it's an off-the-rack putter that's far less likely to fit you than not. :-)

 

Hey, you asked… :D

post #25 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfbarefoot View Post

You use the putter more than any other club in the bag, period.

Why not use the best in the world. Scotty Cameron.

Did they hire you to write copy or something?
post #26 of 104
I recently bought a SC Newport 2 Select. After using it now for a few rounds I don't roll the ball any better than I do with my Ping Redwood Anser 303ss.

I realized that I just bought a SC version of the Ping Anser putter.

Live and learn.
post #27 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfbarefoot View Post

You use the putter more than any other club in the bag, period.

Why not use the best in the world. Scotty Cameron.

 

 

Oh, I do. But it's called Edel.

post #28 of 104

Edel seems to have quite the following around here. I have never heard of them until joining here a few months back. I've checked out there website and it looks like they build some finely tuned clubs. I wish they had a fitting center closer to me.

post #29 of 104

I bought a new putter back in May and I went in with the intention of buying a Scotty (it was a birthday gift so budget was not a concern).

 

After hitting the Scotty's, Bettinardi's, Odyssey's and Kenny Giannini's I left with the Giannini G-4 No Neck. Loved the way it felt in store and had a great fitting experience. I've never been this confident on the greens and my game has reflected that. Not saying it's all the putter but I have shaved two strokes off my handicap since April. The Giannini line is slightly cheaper but not by much.

post #30 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by iacas View Post

Because at the end of the day it's an off-the-rack putter that's far less likely to fit you than not. a1_smile.gif

Hey, you asked… :D

I certainly wasn't talking about buying anything off a rack. My statement was, you use a putter more than any other club so make a quality investment. Of course..if you choose to buy any quality club, you should be properly fitted and assumed that was a given... especially with the price of a Scotty Cameron. Titleist has SC fittings just like their Irons, Drivers etc...

Putters as well as most equipment is personal, use what works best, heck use an old bullseye if you roll the rock better.. Who cares...

but regardless of what anyone 'thinks'..there is no higher quality on this planet than SC designs... So my point is you can't go wrong with all his available models and options...

It's like folks bashing ProV1 because they like top flites... Beauty is in the eye of the beholder..but it is what it is...Lol
post #31 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfbarefoot View Post
but regardless of what anyone 'thinks'..there is no higher quality on this planet than SC designs... So my point is you can't go wrong with all his available models and options...

This is false. I can tell you right now that the design of most Scotty Cameron putters has an identical (within copyright law) counterpart made by every singe other putter company out there. You can go on about how the manufacturing quality is better, but I can tell you as a fact that it's also bull. With a CNC mill I can create a putter that is every bit as high quality as a Scotty Cameron (through robotics I have access to a mill with tolerances measured in the millionths of an inch) and I already have a full CAD file made up of a putter I designed in Solidworks. I can send it, or a render of the putter, to you if you shoot me a PM.

 

The manufacturing of the putters which Scotty Camerons, Pings, Nikes, Odysseys, and others produce is all comparable. They are all manufactured on CNC mills, likely a Haas milling center as they currently hold the majority market share for such mills, and usually up to four will be mounted in the machine at once (It completes an operation, spins the holder, does the same operation on the next part etc.). Since a lot of these putters are made using highly similar, if not the exact same kind, machines you cannot tell me that they are manufactured to tighter tolerances or are better from that standpoint.

 

As for materials, most putters will use a kind of steel that fits the weight profile required. Most are made of stainless steel (except the Pro Platinum by SC which was made with a carbon steel blend that does rust) with some having inserts of different types on the face. They are all milled from a solid block of steel at the start of the process just because that's the fastest and (when factoring in labor) cheapest way for a company to do it. This means that all putters start out just about equal, with some having different blends of steel but them all really being about the same material at the end of the day.

 

Now, on to the final point, the idea of the design being of a higher quality is nearly impossible to quantify. Can you show me any data that proves that Scotty Cameron's designs specifically are better than the identical ones put out by other companies? Is there any specific advantage to the head shape alone, in the tiny minute differences from company to company, that will make the design quantifiably better than the competition? If you can't prove any advantage like that, then the design quality is irrelevant because all the putter designs on the market from decent brands are structurally sound and will put a good roll on the ball with a stroke that fits the putter (or more accurately, if you pick a putter that fits your stroke).

 

The putters aren't any "better" than others, it is a personal preference as to which you use. I personally use a Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum because I found it on sale in like-new condition for $125 and I like it more than any other putter I've tried. This is a personal preference, and is partially due to an aversion to spending more money on a different putter. I can consistently hit my starting line with this putter and it feels good in my hands. There is no difference in the quality, but Scotty Cameron has enough people who use their putters (the same as Titleist has many people using their ball on tour) that it makes it appear as though they are of a higher quality than the rest to the public. Thus, demand goes up and so does the price. Once the price is up, it just leads to more people thinking that the quality will inherently be higher just because it's more expensive (one marketing study showed that designer handbags that are priced under the norm do not sell as well as those priced at the average price, because the buyers thought they were a lower quality due to the lower price).

 

Do not take this as me bashing Scotty Camerons. I enjoy putting with mine. It's just that there is no discernible quality difference between them and the competition. Again, shoot me a PM and I'll give you a render if you don't believe designing a putter can be simple if you know what you want and how to use the tools to make it.

post #32 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pretzel View Post

This is false. I can tell you right now that the design of most Scotty Cameron putters has an identical (within copyright law) counterpart made by every singe other putter company out there. You can go on about how the manufacturing quality is better, but I can tell you as a fact that it's also bull. With a CNC mill I can create a putter that is every bit as high quality as a Scotty Cameron (through robotics I have access to a mill with tolerances measured in the millionths of an inch) and I already have a full CAD file made up of a putter I designed in Solidworks. I can send it, or a render of the putter, to you if you shoot me a PM.

The manufacturing of the putters which Scotty Camerons, Pings, Nikes, Odysseys, and others produce is all comparable. They are all manufactured on CNC mills, likely a Haas milling center as they currently hold the majority market share for such mills, and usually up to four will be mounted in the machine at once (It completes an operation, spins the holder, does the same operation on the next part etc.). Since a lot of these putters are made using highly similar, if not the exact same kind, machines you cannot tell me that they are manufactured to tighter tolerances or are better from that standpoint.

As for materials, most putters will use a kind of steel that fits the weight profile required. Most are made of stainless steel (except the Pro Platinum by SC which was made with a carbon steel blend that does rust) with some having inserts of different types on the face. They are all milled from a solid block of steel at the start of the process just because that's the fastest and (when factoring in labor) cheapest way for a company to do it. This means that all putters start out just about equal, with some having different blends of steel but them all really being about the same material at the end of the day.

Now, on to the final point, the idea of the design being of a higher quality is nearly impossible to quantify. Can you show me any data that proves that Scotty Cameron's designs specifically are better than the identical ones put out by other companies? Is there any specific advantage to the head shape alone, in the tiny minute differences from company to company, that will make the design quantifiably better than the competition? If you can't prove any advantage like that, then the design quality is irrelevant because all the putter designs on the market from decent brands are structurally sound and will put a good roll on the ball with a stroke that fits the putter (or more accurately, if you pick a putter that fits your stroke).

The putters aren't any "better" than others, it is a personal preference as to which you use. I personally use a Scotty Cameron Pro Platinum because I found it on sale in like-new condition for $125 and I like it more than any other putter I've tried. This is a personal preference, and is partially due to an aversion to spending more money on a different putter. I can consistently hit my starting line with this putter and it feels good in my hands. There is no difference in the quality, but Scotty Cameron has enough people who use their putters (the same as Titleist has many people using their ball on tour) that it makes it appear as though they are of a higher quality than the rest to the public. Thus, demand goes up and so does the price. Once the price is up, it just leads to more people thinking that the quality will inherently be higher just because it's more expensive (one marketing study showed that designer handbags that are priced under the norm do not sell as well as those priced at the average price, because the buyers thought they were a lower quality due to the lower price).

" every bit as high quality as a Scotty Cameron"

"others produce is all comparable"



My point exactly goofball... But not higher quality...as I said. I'm wondering why people even play Cameron's now if anyone can make them like you.. You're killing me. Dude you gotta settle down..

Lol but enjoyed your rant. You're embarrassing yourself.

Next tell us how Prov1 balls are average Like I said.. It's preference... I'm dying laughing... I can hear those Nike play in the now commercials .... I'll keep my wound ball, thank you..
Edited by golfbarefoot - 7/23/14 at 1:09am
post #33 of 104
Nobody makes them at a higher quality because they are all the same quality. That's the part you missed that was important.

Also, it's not really that difficult to make something on a CNC machine. There are programs to create all of your NC code with some basic human inputs (HSMWorks and Mastercam are commonly used in industry, though Mastercam is considered standard) and CAD software like Solidworks can be easily picked up within a month of using it for around 1-2 hours a day (I spent enough time learning about it across ~6 months to pass their Solidworks Associate certification testing). Provided that you have the materials (steel stock) and machines (CNC 5-axis mills) it's not rocket science. It's just manufacturing.

As for the ProV1 comment, that's a whole separate fish to fry. Suffice to say that I did testing when the 2013 ProV1x came out vs Nike and Bridgestone balls and found no statistically significant difference in performance using an z-interval test with a .95 confidence interval. I will do these tests again when the 2015 ball comes out in a few short months and I will post the results from that this time. That is, however, off-topic and I will go no further on the subject matter in this thread.

If I were to hazard a guess though, I would say that I'm not appearing to embarrass myself to anyone except you. I did not rant in my last post, I merely pointed out the different facets of quality and why Scotty Camerons are on equal footing with the rest. They're decent putters, but so are all the other big brands on the market. If a thorough post is seen by you as a rant, I cannot help it.
post #34 of 104
"They're decent putters". Lol!

There's is a reason why everyone says,

"But it's as good as....."

It's like Pepsi, they should change their slogan to: Is Pepsi okay? Prov1, Scotty Cameron.. They are the benchmarks... rants like yours are typical. It's okay, and funny.

Just relax. You're wound too tight and need to enjoy. There is nothing anyone can ever prove that is the end all best equipment. Someone who's a master craftsman putter maker like you should know that. Enjoy it man!
post #35 of 104

I bought a Scotty many years ago that I still use, but if I was to spend that kind of money on a putter today, I'd rather look at getting fit for something. Not necessarily a Scotty.

 

You might like a Ping Anser if it was a Scotty Anser you tried, and buy a less expensive Ping for now.

 

If you ever get properly fit for a good putter, it's a club you can use the rest of your life.

post #36 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfbarefoot View Post

"They're decent putters". Lol!

There's is a reason why everyone says,

"But it's as good as....."

It's like Pepsi, they should change their slogan to: Is Pepsi okay? Prov1, Scotty Cameron.. They are the benchmarks... rants like yours are typical. It's okay, and funny.

Just relax. You're wound too tight and need to enjoy. There is nothing anyone can ever prove that is the end all best equipment. Someone who's a master craftsman putter maker like you should know that. Enjoy it man!

You are the one who is making a fool of yourself.

There are many putter manufacturers who do EXACTLY what SC does.

They are mass produced, milled putters. So what?

If they were better than everything else, why wouldn't every pro use one? 

You have been conned. 

Benchmarks? Copies of Ping putters? Yeah, right. SC has mastered the art of imitation. Why does that impress you so much.

SC is a marketing genius and he has fooled lots of golfers into believing that they are buying something special. If you like them, great. Prove that they are different from a high end non insert Odyssey, Bettinardi , Piretti etc. etc.

Please explain.

Funny how guys like Kaymer can cope with a $90 anser and dozens of pros manage with OTR Odysseys.

You are  the perfect customer. Gullible and ill-informed.

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