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Dick's Sporting Goods Fires In-Store Golf Pros - Page 14

post #235 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lihu View Post
 

 

Looks like you won't be buying any Adidas shoes either. He got promoted.

 

Actually I don't buy Adidas shoes. Not because of Mark King but because I have wide feet and they always seemed too narrow for me.

 

Now I have another reason not to buy them.

 

That's the thing about me when I don't like a product I will go out of my way not to buy them.

post #236 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinsk View Post


Well, having limited tee times available and taking 5+hrs to play a round at every public course around...with 6 minutes between tee times and seeing a mass of carts lined up at the first tee EVERY SINGLE DAY.....not buying it....I play all over and it's the same everywhere....

 

It may be happening in a lot of places, but not everywhere.  Not where I live now (Northern CO) and not where I used to live (high desert in socal)

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post
 

 

It's hard to discount the number of good people who work there, despite a lot of people not liking their business practices.   I personally think that TaylorMade has screwed the pooch.   You can't shove so many options at people in such a short time and claim it's the next best thing w/o making some people mad.   While I won't buy into their insane product cycles any more, I will give some of their other stuff a look.   

 

I used to feel the same way about Nike, but there are a heck of a lot of good people there.  Even if you don't like the people calling the shots, so if they offer good stuff I consider it.

 

The thing is, as a consumer the employees of the company are not my responsibility.  

post #237 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtleback View Post
 

 

It may be happening in a lot of places, but not everywhere.  Not where I live now (Northern CO) and not where I used to live (high desert in socal)

 

 

 

Nor here.  I can play in around 3 hours mid-week, at any number of courses.  On the weekends, it's usually right around 4 hours.......4:20 is unusual and feels like a death slog.  I played Orange County National last Sunday......a very popular, outstanding, 2-course facility running a great deal through the end of August.  9am tee time, so right in the middle of prime time and we still finished in 4:10, waiting on just about every shot with a rather slow 3-some ahead of us. 

 

Exceptions, sure.  But even in a golf destination like Orlando, the norm is 8 minute times and a 4 hour-ish round, more often than not.

post #238 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtleback View Post



The thing is, as a consumer the employees of the company are not my responsibility.  

They should be if you refuse to do business with a company because you don't like the CEO, celebrity endorser or some non-commercial reason. Plenty of people can be hurt by something outside of their control.

A couple of people have mentioned they don't like King, or Adidas/Taylormade here. I disagree that people should avoid them because they've screwed the golf club market to some extent. I certainly don't feel like buying into their current hype now, but should they revamp and come out with something good I'd consider it, despite King being somewhat of an ass.
post #239 of 266

Wow that is really not a good sign. Then again, I don't shop at Dick's because they have a PGA pro in the golf shop. 

post #240 of 266

what about their golf store? Golf Galaxy?

post #241 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post


They should be if you refuse to do business with a company because you don't like the CEO, celebrity endorser or some non-commercial reason. Plenty of people can be hurt by something outside of their control.

A couple of people have mentioned they don't like King, or Adidas/Taylormade here. I disagree that people should avoid them because they've screwed the golf club market to some extent. I certainly don't feel like buying into their current hype now, but should they revamp and come out with something good I'd consider it, despite King being somewhat of an ass.

Best way consumers can let a company know they don't like their business practices is to not spend their hard earned money on their products or services.   King dug the hole, now he's going to have to figure out how to fix it.

post #242 of 266

I'm not sure how often people on here or just people in general buy new golf stuff. I would assume that if you bought a new driver just as if you were to buy a new computer, when the next one gets released the following 6 months, year or even 2 years later, it doesn't mean you have to buy it. I'm using a computer from 4 years ago. I use my computer everyday, there has been new computers released at an even faster rate then golf equipment but that doesn't mean I need a new one. All Taylormade is doing is giving options for consumers. If you think you need the newest most up to date piece of equipment to score well, then yes be mad at Taylormade (but I assure you, thats not the reason you are not a pro golfer). 

 

I'm not sure why theres so many haters of companies that aren't Titleist or Mizuno but at the end of the day its a business and all these companies really care about is $$$ and lots of it. Some will get it by doing minimal R&D and only releasing clubs every 2 years others every 6 months. iphone releases a phone every year, Samsung releases 2 or 3 a year (smart/super phones). Is one better then the other? It depends on what you like. I refuse to pay $55 for a box of golf balls but others don't mind it. Same as I know that buying last years ball with a different name doesn't mean its an outdated ball it just means I save money :dance:

 

I own TM products but in no way will I fall for the "the next best thing" marketing plan. I love the options but doesn't mean I run out and buy new stuff every 6 months.

 

All that said, I would love to own a set of Ping clubs!!! They offer a lot of options and almost everything, if not everything for lefties! 

post #243 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownCoast View Post

I'm not sure how often people on here or just people in general buy new golf stuff. I would assume that if you bought a new driver just as if you were to buy a new computer, when the next one gets released the following 6 months, year or even 2 years later, it doesn't mean you have to buy it. I'm using a computer from 4 years ago. I use my computer everyday, there has been new computers released at an even faster rate then golf equipment but that doesn't mean I need a new one. All Taylormade is doing is giving options for consumers. If you think you need the newest most up to date piece of equipment to score well, then yes be mad at Taylormade (but I assure you, thats not the reason you are not a pro golfer). 


I'm not sure why theres so many haters of companies that aren't Titleist or Mizuno but at the end of the day its a business and all these companies really care about is $$$ and lots of it. Some will get it by doing minimal R&D and only releasing clubs every 2 years others every 6 months. iphone releases a phone every year, Samsung releases 2 or 3 a year (smart/super phones). Is one better then the other? It depends on what you like. I refuse to pay $55 for a box of golf balls but others don't mind it. Same as I know that buying last years ball with a different name doesn't mean its an outdated ball it just means I save money " src="http://files.thesandtrap.com//images/smilies/new/c3_clap.gif" />. 


I own TM products but in no way will I fall for the "the next best thing" marketing plan. I love the options but doesn't mean I run out and buy new stuff every 6 months.


All that said, I would love to own a set of Ping clubs!!! They offer a lot of options and almost everything, if not everything for lefties! 


 



I'm still playing R7s, some Adams wedges that are older than that, and an off-brand putter from the 80s. I can't remember a single time that anybody twisted my arm to make me buy something newer.

I've yet to see any of my friends with the latest and greatest make any improvement in their games that I can notice.
post #244 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS256 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownCoast View Post
 

I'm not sure how often people on here or just people in general buy new golf stuff. I would assume that if you bought a new driver just as if you were to buy a new computer, when the next one gets released the following 6 months, year or even 2 years later, it doesn't mean you have to buy it. I'm using a computer from 4 years ago. I use my computer everyday, there has been new computers released at an even faster rate then golf equipment but that doesn't mean I need a new one. All Taylormade is doing is giving options for consumers. If you think you need the newest most up to date piece of equipment to score well, then yes be mad at Taylormade (but I assure you, thats not the reason you are not a pro golfer). 

 

I'm not sure why theres so many haters of companies that aren't Titleist or Mizuno but at the end of the day its a business and all these companies really care about is $$$ and lots of it. Some will get it by doing minimal R&D and only releasing clubs every 2 years others every 6 months. iphone releases a phone every year, Samsung releases 2 or 3 a year (smart/super phones). Is one better then the other? It depends on what you like. I refuse to pay $55 for a box of golf balls but others don't mind it. Same as I know that buying last years ball with a different name doesn't mean its an outdated ball it just means I save money <img src=

 

I own TM products but in no way will I fall for the "the next best thing" marketing plan. I love the options but doesn't mean I run out and buy new stuff every 6 months.

 

All that said, I would love to own a set of Ping clubs!!! They offer a lot of options and almost everything, if not everything for lefties! 

 



I'm still playing R7s, some Adams wedges that are older than that, and an off-brand putter from the 80s. I can't remember a single time that anybody twisted my arm to make me buy something newer.

I've yet to see any of my friends with the latest and greatest make any improvement in their games that I can notice.

But it is nice to have options right? The only new TM equipment I own is the wedges and the 3 wood which are from last year, everything else is older. I was never under the impression my equipment was no good once the newer stuff came out. TM, Callaway, Cobra, Adams, Nike, Mizuno, Titleist and all the rest all make great stuff. Sure some might not work as well as others for ones individual swing or appealing to the eye. These companies all have one thing in mind, money! They all have people running the business with marketing backgrounds or business backgrounds. They know what they are doing. Sure sometimes it gets to be a bit much when you see commercials or mag ads that say the best new thing in golf but hey thats how then advertise and lets face it, it works! If it didn't they wouldn't dump a fortune on advertising. 

post #245 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post


They should be if you refuse to do business with a company because you don't like the CEO, celebrity endorser or some non-commercial reason. Plenty of people can be hurt by something outside of their control.

A couple of people have mentioned they don't like King, or Adidas/Taylormade here. I disagree that people should avoid them because they've screwed the golf club market to some extent. I certainly don't feel like buying into their current hype now, but should they revamp and come out with something good I'd consider it, despite King being somewhat of an ass.

 

"They should be if you refuse to do business with a company because you don't like the CEO, celebrity endorser or some non-commercial reason. Plenty of people can be hurt by something outside of their control."

 

A CEO or a company is different than a celebrity endorser. What does "non-commercial reason" mean? I don't see how one can force any kind of change to a company if they continue to buy from a company that they don't agree with. A CEO is responsible for the company's strategies.

 

I don't like King's attitude that a) a solution to the drop in his company's sales can be solved by making golf easier  ....  maybe he should look in the mirror as the reason for his company's drop in sales; b) rehash old technology and introduce it as an invention of TM .... look at the latest slotted irons from TM well Wilson made them in the 80's  https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151125009477675&set=a.80492297674.80818.55676157674&type=1&theater ; c) TM does not really innovate as much as they are now purely a marketing company .... in the past (before King) TaylorMade had real innovations after all they were the first to introduce metal woods.

 

"A couple of people have mentioned they don't like King, or Adidas/Taylormade here. I disagree that people should avoid them because they've screwed the golf club market to some extent. I certainly don't feel like buying into their current hype now, but should they revamp and come out with something good I'd consider it, despite King being somewhat of an ass."  

 

Please explain to me how does one get change if they continue to buy from the company? Why would King ever be forced out if sales were to continue at the same levels? Then you state that should they revamp and come up with something good you would consider it .... well if we all continue to buy at the same levels why would King or TM change their current policies?

post #246 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by ay33660 View Post

"They should be if you refuse to do business with a company because you don't like the CEO, celebrity endorser or some non-commercial reason. Plenty of people can be hurt by something outside of their control."

A CEO or a company is different than a celebrity endorser. What does "non-commercial reason" mean? I don't see how one can force any kind of change to a company if they continue to buy from a company that they don't agree with. A CEO is responsible for the company's strategies.

I don't like King's attitude that a) a solution to the drop in his company's sales can be solved by making golf easier  ....  maybe he should look in the mirror as the reason for his company's drop in sales; b) rehash old technology and introduce it as an invention of TM .... look at the latest slotted irons from TM well Wilson made them in the 80's  https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151125009477675&set=a.80492297674.80818.55676157674&type=1&theater ; c) TM does not really innovate as much as they are now purely a marketing company .... in the past (before King) TaylorMade had real innovations after all they were the first to introduce metal woods.

"A couple of people have mentioned they don't like King, or Adidas/Taylormade here. I disagree that people should avoid them because they've screwed the golf club market to some extent. I certainly don't feel like buying into their current hype now, but should they revamp and come out with something good I'd consider it, despite King being somewhat of an ass."  

Please explain to me how does one get change if they continue to buy from the company? Why would King ever be forced out if sales were to continue at the same levels? Then you state that should they revamp and come up with something good you would consider it .... well if we all continue to buy at the same levels why would King or TM change their current policies?

Well it comes down to the fact that I like some of their products, they are not horrifically evil and that I don't think that voting with your wallet has the effect it should since corporations and reality are pretty much going in opposite directions. I guess the best way to describe it is a perfectly normal human thing to go. Bitch about something but don't 100% write someone off.
post #247 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post


Well it comes down to the fact that I like some of their products, they are not horrifically evil and that I don't think that voting with your wallet has the effect it should since corporations and reality are pretty much going in opposite directions. I guess the best way to describe it is a perfectly normal human thing to go. Bitch about something but don't 100% write someone off.

If you like their products and the way they do business you should support them by buying their products.  Those, like me, that don't buy into their hype or King's attempts to blame his own mis-management on the current state of golf will spend their money elsewhere.  

 

Voting with our money is the only option we have to get a business to change their tactics.   

post #248 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtogolf View Post
 

If you like their products and the way they do business you should support them by buying their products.  Those, like me, that don't buy into their hype or King's attempts to blame his own mis-management on the current state of golf will spend their money elsewhere.  

 

Voting with our money is the only option we have to get a business to change their tactics.   

Yup..  Economic democracy.

post #249 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post


Well it comes down to the fact that I like some of their products, they are not horrifically evil and that I don't think that voting with your wallet has the effect it should since corporations and reality are pretty much going in opposite directions. I guess the best way to describe it is a perfectly normal human thing to go. Bitch about something but don't 100% write someone off.

 

If you like their products then by all means buy them.

 

I don't really understand what you are trying to say with your comment "I don't think that voting with your wallet has the effect it should since corporations and reality are pretty much going in opposite directions"

 

Why would I want to spend my money buying a product from a corporation that I don't like and not spend it with a corporation that I like?

post #250 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by ay33660 View Post

If you like their products then by all means buy them.

I don't really understand what you are trying to say with your comment "I don't think that voting with your wallet has the effect it should since corporations and reality are pretty much going in opposite directions"

Why would I want to spend my money buying a product from a corporation that I don't like and not spend it with a corporation that I like?

There's a fundamental disconnect between results and reality in most companies. You can spin anything.

I actually was more pissed about this issue and walked back from that. I started off wanting to yank the two TM clubs out of my bag because it ticks me off the way they do business and then I came back from that. I'm tired of generalizing about issues and taking the "never shopping there again approach". I work for a company a lot of people hate, but there are a lot of good people where I work. So I feel the other side of it I guess.
post #251 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob0225 View Post

Dicks sells Mizuno clubs.

The dicks near me sells Titleist, Ping mizuno and others! the staff is very professsionL and contray to what some believe they sell, the exact same product for the exact same price than at Proshops. All the major manufactures have MAP pricing on their products - everyone sells it for the same. dicks does have resources for trade ins that pro shops don't or prefer not to use. The training that I provided for Dicks is identical to what I provide to proshops employees.

the golf industry is shrinking, the number of players has slowly been flat to down in numbers since- 2000. tiger boosted revenue for TV golf and pink hat fans of golf with him playing. This downturn of participation is not to be blamed on him. But this great sport/game we have has been contracting. We ( us) are getting older with no one filling in behind us. 14 years worth of that.

Dicks took and agressive approach to hireing qualified PGA pro to substantiate and grow their golf business. it self admittedly did not work, so like many big companies, they pulled the plug on it. That's the way things are today.

Golf retail, in Dicks,family owned stores, super stores as well as your small little proshops. Are you ready for this ? It sucks, its terrible. no one is making any money and when retailers don't make money- that's a problem.

Golf wholesale, is really bad, too many companies, chasing fewer dollars with a reported full 3 year glut of inventory being distributed any way possible. It's not just Taylormade, but cobra, Nike and others. I saw a 1 year old nike tour driver, new with head cover wrench and they would fit it to Me on their launch monitor all for 99 bucks. I had no interest in the driver myself. the store lost money, the brand is weakened, Nike will not be getting a re-order or perhaps any order for next year. And it's not just nike. too many manufactures chasing fewer and fewer dollars.

golf course, cutting those fairways, greens, tee boxes and everything else associated with course maintence is through the roof. the mowers themselves can be tens of thousands of dollars and you need several of these. Carts are often a ten year capital expense for a whole fleet. rounds are down, casual play is down, tournements such as scrambles for charity are not filling up the way they did 6+ years ago! hellyou really can't write off golf as an expense anymore for business. I kind of chuckle when I read that" golf course should lower their green fees" .yeah there may be a little truth there, but I say why even bother unless you want to lose more money. If a typical green fee with cart is 75.00, do you think I will play 75% more times if it were $50? because that basically what you are asking golf courses to expect. The reality is, and Dicks made it clear, there not enough golfers with purchasing power, expendable income, call it what ever you want. the past two years golf has taken a nose dive in participation, due a number of factors. With no back fill of the younger people picking the sport up.

Lastly, What is the PGA going to do with fewer golfers? What did they do when there was golfers?

So what will golf look in the future? Well to start 3 deep pocket mega brands and an additional 2 niche brands. ( ping, Callaway and titleist) There will be another wave of consolidation of manufactures. There has to be. Its unsustainable. The golf game will stay essentially the same, probably two sets of rules. one for Recreational and one for Pros.
post #252 of 266
Quote:
Originally Posted by imsys0042 View Post


There's a fundamental disconnect between results and reality in most companies. You can spin anything.

I actually was more pissed about this issue and walked back from that. I started off wanting to yank the two TM clubs out of my bag because it ticks me off the way they do business and then I came back from that. I'm tired of generalizing about issues and taking the "never shopping there again approach". I work for a company a lot of people hate, but there are a lot of good people where I work. So I feel the other side of it I guess.

 

Got it now.

 

I do see the other side. Thank you for pointing it out.

 

I have been lucky so far in my business life as I have been an owner of my company since I was in my early thirties.

 

I can see that a lot of times the employees of corporations could actually disagree with the direction taken by senior management but have very little to say about changing it.

 

Sorry I didn't mean to come off like an ass. I suspect that there may be some parallels with the staff at my business!


Edited by ay33660 - 9/1/14 at 9:05am
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