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for a beginner, should I worry about shaft flex?


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I was asking this on another section but maybe it's more appropriate here.

I am a golf beginner... I went to a driving range about ten years ago and taught myself a swing, but it wasn't good at all.   Fast forward to today, I decided I wanted to play golf on a real course finally (I play PC golf off and on for decades... but I hate the Florida heat and humidity, plus the expense of golf, so I never got around to it beyond the driving range), so I got out a few of my old clubs (hand-me-downs from my dad, 1970's technology mostly, plus a few more modern woods from Ram).   The steel shafts are all medium flex, that's all my dad bothered with and they seem OK to me.  I'm missing a few clubs so I went to a thrift store and I got a few to play around with.  One is a senior flex 7 wood, the other 3 are 869 irons and they have S shafts (still, I am guessing).  And finally I have a Big Bertha 5 wood with regular flex shaft.

The issue I am having, while the 5 iron with the stiff shaft seems forgiving compared to the Faultless blade I often take to driving ranges, it doesn't seem to have the loft of the Faultless, even though they are both 5 irons.  I have looked at them up close and the loft appears the same on the face, but the stiff 5 iron doesn't get up in the air to the same degree.

The senior shaft seems to suit me just fine, as does the ones marked regular flex.

My swing is not yet fully developed.  I'm subscribing to Kirk Junge's golf learning website and practicing his drills every day in front of a mirror.  He uses a single-plane style of swing and his teacher was Moe Norman.  I'm also getting back into yoga and spending some time doing stretches my physical therapist gave me to do and I believe its helping my swing a lot.

I believe this swing I'm developing suits me much better for me than trying to learn a swing that involves a lot of lower-back rotation (what I was doing over a decade ago when I was much younger and my body wasn't about to enter middle age).  It doesn't look quite like Moe Norman's that I've seen (I believe it looks more like Vijay Singh's swing), but its closer to it, and my hitting is fairly straight compared to the past where it just tended to slice like crazy.  But it's not fully there so I am not sure spending time with a professional getting my swing analyzed would be worthwhile.

What do you think?  Should I worry about shaft flex at this point? Should I try to have my swing speed measured, even if I do not yet have a full swing? What is a good beginner shaft flex?

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Just my un expert opinion. I would concentrate on your swing, and would suggest maybe having a Pro look at your swing to identify any faults. Once you can make decent contact most of the time, then I would look at newer clubs, lots of good used clubs out there, and they don't have to be the latest technology. A bunch of us here play older irons, that work just fine.

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Worst mistake I see is new golfers starting to play or learning to play from coworkers or friends.  I always see guys getting clubs with too stiff of shafts as kind of a macho thing, that's what their friends use, or the idea the good golfers use stiffer shafts.  I do think its important to get a set that has consistency to it rather than a mixture of clubs.  A golf pro could quickly tell you if you have a swing that would warrant anything other than a regular flex shaft.

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The flex is not really the issue as much as learning to swing.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by FireDragon76

...  I'm missing a few clubs so I went to a thrift store and I got a few to play around with.  One is a senior flex 7 wood, the other 3 are 869 irons and they have S shafts (still, I am guessing).  And finally I have a Big Bertha 5 wood with regular flex shaft.

The issue I am having, while the 5 iron with the stiff shaft seems forgiving compared to the Faultless blade I often take to driving ranges, it doesn't seem to have the loft of the Faultless, even though they are both 5 irons.  I have looked at them up close and the loft appears the same on the face, but the stiff 5 iron doesn't get up in the air to the same degree.

The senior shaft seems to suit me just fine, as does the ones marked regular flex. ...

Your remarks above are a bit confusing. the 5i stiff "seems more forgiving" but doesn't "get up in the air" like the Faultless. Also, your comments on loft are confusing... new 5i has less loft, but they look the same.. (?)

If the Stiff 5i is fairly new, it may likely will have less loft than the Faultless (from 1970s). Lofts have been getting stronger since the late 1980s. A quick comparison:

Model

Year

5i loft

Average

1970s

31°

Callaway X20

2008

27°

Callaway XHot

2013

23°

TaylorMade SLDR

2014

24°

Originally Posted by FireDragon76

What do you think?  Should I worry about shaft flex at this point? Should I try to have my swing speed measured, even if I do not yet have a full swing? What is a good beginner shaft flex?

As you have noted, your swing is in development. Because of this, a basic static fitting would be best. For irons, the fitter takes a look at your stance and posture, and use that as a starting point to determine what shaft length you need. You will hit some shots, and the fitter will look at the impact point on the sole of the club to determine what lie angle you need. (Lie angle stabilizes fairly quickly,, even for beginners). Also, fitter will check your hand size to make sure the grip is proper thickness.

Also, the fitter can use your driver swingspeed to gauge what shaft flex would be best for you.

A good fitter can help you get used irons that match you to keep the cost down.

So, you're at the point where you need more help than you can get from doing Kirk Junge workouts in front of the mirror. Get a golf lesson or a fitting to find the next step. (Some pros who work with beginners can do both.)

Focus, connect and follow through!

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The 869 5-iron sends the balls up on a lower trajectory than the Faultless, fairly consistently.  It's more forgiving in terms of accuracy, however.  I mis-hit the Fautless on the toe and it twists in my hand, for instance, a lot more often than the 869, which has peripheral weighting.  I like the weighting aspect, but I don't care for the low trajectory.

I don't think the 869 is too new, it looks about 10-20 years old, with some rust in places.

I'll try to find someone who can work with me and check out my swing using a launch analyzer.   I just don't want to go to somebody who will try and sell me new clubs or tell me my swing is wrong (when I'm trying to develop a swing that most pro's don't use).   I buy used clubs from thrift stores for a reason, of course.  But my intuition tells me that stiff shafts are probably the wrong match for me, the only question is whether I should go with regular or senior/amateur shafts.   The Black Steel 7 wood (senior flex) I've messed around with seems to not be as accurate as the Big Bertha 5 wood (regular flex).   At least, its punishing my errors more- I get a nice solid contact sound sometimes, but the ball flight doesn't seem so solid (it tends to go randomly left or right somewhat).

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Listen to WUTiger-he is in pre-med.

Seriously everything he said is good advice.

If you want it said a different way and if you are semi-serious about taking up the game:

1. Get a lesson from a qualified instructor. Unless you are using video AND understand the moving parts of a swing, what you are doing is likely not what you think you are doing. A proper lesson or three can get you in the right set up and making the right basic moves so you don't have to unlearn the wrong ones.

2. Assuming you are an adult male between, oh, 16 and 55 with average build, strength, and flexibility, go with a regular flex for now all through the set.

3. Unless you have money backing up on you, don't invest a lot, but get a decent set of clubs, and if you buy used replace the grips. I recently bought a set of Tommy Armour 845s and a set of PING Eye-2s at Goodwill for about $30 each. One set missing a 6 iron, one set missing a 9. If I was going to use these to learn on, it would not put me off a bit to spend $50 on new grips; I would still have a serviceable set for under $100. It wouldn't matter to you to be missing a club, especially 1 in the middle of the set as you probably can't tell the difference in an 8 and a 9 ( I barely can). For a wood  to start with, find a fairway with about 15* loft or actually your Big Bertha 5 wood is about perfect.

Probably stay away from senior and lady flex as they will be a bit whippy and inconsistent as you noticed with the 7 wood.

A matched set of irons is better because you want to make your swing consistent and change distance by changing clubs. Sets that are playable and can be found on the cheap are Tommy Armour 845s, Titleist DCI's, PING Eye-2's, and occasionally PING ZINGS. If you are around 5'10-6', you will probably look for a Black dot in the PINGs. These are not the only clubs to be recommended, but they were so poplular in their day, there are a bunch of them around.

After you play for a couple of years or so and develop, you will have a better idea of what you need. Then you will go out and spend more than you should like the rest of us, LOL. On the other hand, I could have one of the above sets and add a driver, a couple of wedges, and a putter, and play casual golf about as good as I can until I need senior shafts.

Don

In the bag:

Driver: PING 410 Plus 9 degrees, Alta CB55 S  Fairway: Callaway Rogue 3W PX Even Flow Blue 6.0; Hybrid: Titleist 818H1 21* PX Even Flow Blue 6.0;  Irons: Titleist 718 AP1 5-W2(53*) Shafts- TT AMT Red S300 ; Wedges Vokey SM8 56-10D Putter: Scotty Cameron 2016 Newport 2.5  Ball: Titleist AVX or 2021 ProV1

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Chunk the 5i into the garage.

Beginner?

Begin with an 8i... when you're hitting it consistently, get the 7i... when ....

If it's me, I start with a SW and technical drills w no expectations. After 3 practice swings without a ball and I get comfortable with one, just technical stuff ... then I'll address the ball. Don't worry about the result. You're not thinking target, you're thinking technique. Hopefully you'll relax while doing this..

After technique, spend about 20 minutes or so, not thinking techie stuff, but target -- visualize from behind the ball, practice swing, deep breath, address ball, breathe, target, go.

Ping G400 Max 9/TPT Shaft, TEE EX10 Beta 4, 5 wd, PXG 22 HY, Mizuno JPX919F 5-GW, TItleist SM7 Raw 55-09, 59-11, Bettinardi BB39

 

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Chunk the 5i into the garage.

Beginner?

Begin with an 8i... when you're hitting it consistently, get the 7i... when ....

If it's me, I start with a SW and technical drills w no expectations. After 3 practice swings without a ball and I get comfortable with one, just technical stuff ... then I'll address the ball. Don't worry about the result. You're not thinking target, you're thinking technique.

Then spend about 20 minutes or so, not thinking techie stuff, but target -- visualize from behind the ball, practice swing, deep breath, address ball, breathe, target, go.

When I took lessons back in the dark ages of hickory and featheries, the pro started me with a 5 iron, the theory being it was the middle of the set and the swing for it worked on everything else. Of course that 5 iron was probably the equivalent of today's 7 or 8, so---

Don

In the bag:

Driver: PING 410 Plus 9 degrees, Alta CB55 S  Fairway: Callaway Rogue 3W PX Even Flow Blue 6.0; Hybrid: Titleist 818H1 21* PX Even Flow Blue 6.0;  Irons: Titleist 718 AP1 5-W2(53*) Shafts- TT AMT Red S300 ; Wedges Vokey SM8 56-10D Putter: Scotty Cameron 2016 Newport 2.5  Ball: Titleist AVX or 2021 ProV1

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When I took lessons back in the dark ages of hickory and featheries, the pro started me with a 5 iron, the theory being it was the middle of the set and the swing for it worked on everything else. Of course that 5 iron was probably the equivalent of today's 7 or 8, so---


yes, they did that to me, too.

Do you punish your son for your father's mistakes?

:doh:

The point being, let's have people enjoy the game.

My instructor says "get the SW out" when we're introducing new stuff.

Ping G400 Max 9/TPT Shaft, TEE EX10 Beta 4, 5 wd, PXG 22 HY, Mizuno JPX919F 5-GW, TItleist SM7 Raw 55-09, 59-11, Bettinardi BB39

 

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yes, they did that to me, too.

Do you punish your son for your father's mistakes?

The point being, let's have people enjoy the game.

My instructor says "get the SW out" when we're introducing new stuff.

Actually, that was my verbose and smart a-- way of agreeing with you -which I do.

Don

In the bag:

Driver: PING 410 Plus 9 degrees, Alta CB55 S  Fairway: Callaway Rogue 3W PX Even Flow Blue 6.0; Hybrid: Titleist 818H1 21* PX Even Flow Blue 6.0;  Irons: Titleist 718 AP1 5-W2(53*) Shafts- TT AMT Red S300 ; Wedges Vokey SM8 56-10D Putter: Scotty Cameron 2016 Newport 2.5  Ball: Titleist AVX or 2021 ProV1

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Actually, that was my verbose and smart a-- way of agreeing with you -which I do.


Yep, I don't punish my son that way, either.

I have other ways... :-D

Ping G400 Max 9/TPT Shaft, TEE EX10 Beta 4, 5 wd, PXG 22 HY, Mizuno JPX919F 5-GW, TItleist SM7 Raw 55-09, 59-11, Bettinardi BB39

 

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....

If you want it said a different way and if you are semi-serious about taking up the game:

1. Get a lesson from a qualified instructor. Unless you are using video AND understand the moving parts of a swing, what you are doing is likely not what you think you are doing. A proper lesson or three can get you in the right set up and making the right basic moves so you don't have to unlearn the wrong ones.

2. Assuming you are an adult male between, oh, 16 and 55 with average build, strength, and flexibility, go with a regular flex for now all through the set.

...

I'm about 5'8 and have long arms (my wrist is about 32 inches to the floor) according to what I've read in terms of fitting, standard lengths should be OK but I might need to adjust my grip a bit?

My physical health is not the best- cardiovascular health is good and I'm not overweight but  I may have some flexibility and muscle strength issues , I've been through physical therapy twice in the past 3 years, most of the issues are in my "core" area.    My PT mentioned my hamstrings were very tight all the time.  I used to do yoga only a few years ago, but I have fibromyalgia working against that so it feels like stretching benefits don't last as long.

I'm using video occasionally at the driving range and trying to look at what my body is doing to figure it out my mistakes.  If I took instruction from a pro, I'd be interested in learning stack and tilt or single plane swinging because I heard so many people with back issues gravitated to that teaching method.  My dad thinks my swing is already really weird (because I rotate my hips too much, he says).   I'm really not looking to have low scores, just have fun and learn a consistent swing that won't wreck my back.  If anything I've thougtht about going back to my doctor and asking for him to look me over and give some advice (because I have noticed more back soreness at times since I've taken up golf), perhaps a physical therapist would know some options in that area for teaching?

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