Article Says Real Reason for Slow Play is Short Tee Time Intervals

So lets say a 18 hole round of golf with a cart costs $40 dollars. So would the course still be packed at 11 minute intervals, at $46 dollars (just over a 15% increase to cover the volume cost)?

I think some courses could get away with that. Still that is only 14 minutes. Would that be substantial enough for some golfers.

So you are looking at a 5.5% reduction in overall playing time, 15% reduction in revenues.

This is one of the things I've said most times when this topic comes up.  A course should be laid out and set up to let the players play golf, not to inflict the maximum penalty on every errant shot.  That isn't to eliminate all hazards, but to turn many of those balls lost in rough and OB into playable trouble shots rather than ball searches ans lost balls.  Even following Rule 27 for a provisional ball takes more time than being able to find the original ball and playing it, even if that play means punching back to the fairway from under a tree.

My former home course started as a fairly wide open layout, built on a very limited budget, but over the years they added a tree here and there in strategic locations.  This has had the effect of making an attractive course that plays a bit more difficult that it would appear at first glance.  I played  with a couple of guys visiting from Maine a while back, and their first impression was that it would be an easy course, since they were used to courses carved out of the forest.  However, both had a very different experience, as they were constantly in tree trouble almost every time they missed the fairway.  But with all of their difficulties, they were usually able to find and play the ball fairly easily, even though most of the time the trees were the equivalent of about a half stroke penalty.

The course that will be my most played one in the coming years is fairly similar, maybe not quite as well maintained, but it plays with a similar philosophy of allowing the golfer to find and put a club on his ball, even if the shot isn't necessarily what he would have preferred.  Rough cut to 1½" will still cause flyers and loss of spin on shorter approaches.  Trees placed flanking the fairway in landing areas will make for some randomness on approach shots - from clear shots to obstructed shots to no resort but a punch out, but still playable without a protracted ball search.

The guys who post about their home course with the 74.5/140 rating and slope just perpetuate the myth that this is what the player is supposed to be looking for, when in reality, most golfers will find much more enjoyment from a course which will let them play golf.  Even the best pros will bitch when a course is set up with too much difficulty, so why are we weekend warriors flogging ourselves to play such layouts?  Isn't it time to start playing the ball as it lies instead of hit-drop-penalty?

Lower scores, more fun, and faster rounds.  I don't see the downside.

Although I think increased interval starting times are a step in the right direction, I don't think very many golf courses are going to give up revenue dollars in the interest of a faster pace of play. "Return On Investment"  (ROI)   rules things in the business world, and even though we as players think of golf as a game, it's still just a business to the owners/operators of golf courses.

No, I think the only way to speed up pace of play, is to get all golfers on the same page as far as how fast they play. That is not going to happen. Getting everyone to play at the same 4 hour+/- speed is an impossibility. Youngsters will play faster than the older folks. The older, slower folks help keep the game affordable for the track stars on the course.

I have said many times that I don't care for slower play, but to me, it is just another part of the game to be dealt with while playing. It falls under dealing with course conditions.  In my particular case,  I run into what I consider slow play just a few times every year. Maybe less than 5% of the times I go golfing. It's just not a big problem for me.

Now there is a muni course I use to frequent, that had no rough to speak of. It had Trees, fairways, bunkers, and greens, but what could have been longer grass (rough) was kept pretty short. No matter where you tee shot, or approach shot landed the golfer could easily find their ball, still have decent lie, and shot to the green. I don't ever remember slow play being a problem there, and it was usually quite busy.

Before the change the average round was 4 hours and 54 minutes.  After the change to 11 minute splits the average dropped to 4 hours and 49 minutes.  Additional improvements were most likely the result of a change in their "Pace of Play Penalty" procedure.

I don't think 4 hours and 49 minutes is all that fast considering they play in 3-somes.  Plus the players at the end of the field were still on the course for 5 hours and 4 minutes, on average.

Unfortunately, there is no one cure for slow play.

Tee off times at my course are every 8 minutes (it was in the Guinness book of records as the most played course one year), all of them Tee-Off times are taken during busy periods, I'd estimate that less than 1 in 50 people use carts, the standard is generally low (more shots) and people still generally go around in about 2.5-4 hours.

How you guys in the USA use carts, 10 minute tee-off's and still take more than 4 hours is beyond me?

When it's less busy I can play 2 or 3 balls with a lot of practise in-between and take 10 minutes a hole, and even at that I can still get caught up by a two, three or four ball behind.

I've not played in any weekend comps but can't imagine these take much longer.

I've only had the good fortune to play in Scotland maybe 25 times, but it was obvious to me from the get go that folks on your side of the pond have a cultural bias towards faster play and respect for the game, and folks on our side of the pond have a cultural bias towards slow play. The backups on the courses in Scotland were almost always Americans, you could tell from a mile away.

I'd say a huge indication of the difference in culture is carts. Here in southern California you hardly ever see walkers carrying bags, sometimes push carts, there is no stigma against electric carts and they are "acceptable" for even healthy young athletic folk (and the course makes more money, of course.)  My brief experience in Scotland was if you were on your deathbed they might let you take a cart with a doctor's note, but maybe not even then

I assume that England and Scotland have a similar golf culture, maybe that's not accurate.

But enjoy your fast golf culture, it's mostly gone over here. When you see young healthy guys riding carts, and you ask them why don't you walk and they look at you like you are an idiot, I don't expect it to improve much.  That's not how they learned. Over here it's okay to be slow.

Sometimes I think we are losing respect for the game. Is it really necessary to watch video of the football game and read your texts in your cart while you are playing? Especially when its your turn to hit!

Arrrrggghhh. I'm turning into a crusty old dude, I guess.

Yeah.  There is one shitty course by me that I play as a last resort.  The only positives are: that I can usually reserve a tee time late in the week AND they'll let me reserve a tee time for one.  The negatives are ... EVERYTHING else.  Seriously.  Check this out:

That's all fairway.

Our tee time was 7:22, and these days I believe the sun comes up around 6, and we didn't get off until about 15-20 minutes late, and the round took almost 5 hours.  This course has 8 minute tee time intervals and allows fivesomes.

Now, in the past, I would come up 18 and be surprised because there was nobody around waiting to play.  So my thought is that it might be packed in the morning, but since it's not packed all day, then they could certainly look into spreading out the tee times and maybe the guys who wanted to tee off at 10, now tee off at 11, but they still have the same amount of total players, and thus don't lose any revenue.

Of course, that wasn't the case last Saturday, so my theory is invalid.  It was very busy.  In which case, I agree with Erik.  If the course allows groups of five every 8 minutes and that leads to 5 hour (or more) rounds, yet its always packed, why on earth would they want to change that?

Those of us who can't stand the slow play go elsewhere when we can.  If it gets bad enough for them and people stop coming (based on the conditions of the course now, I have no idea how its possible to get any worse) then they can look at making changes.  Otherwise, there is no reason.

I wouldn't even say it's respect for the game as most of the fast players are total hackers, I sometimes see people running around pushing their carts, smashing a massive toupee divot before the ball and then running off again 30 yards up the rough and then same again, as long as they're enjoying it I'm not fussed. The main thing is just most of us Brits (English, Scottish or Irish - I've noticed no difference between the cultures) are impatient, don't have a lot of free time or a combination of both .

Nobody minds people in carts over here, not that I've noticed anyway. Pulling my clubs keeps me warm, keeps me fit and saves me money, which is what most would agree with I would say. No way would I be walking in CA, NV or AZ (the only three places I've played in the US), it's just too hot for that.

I think if we used carts we would be quicker still, I'd be pretty disappointed if I couldn't fit 18 holes in 2.5 hours in a cart and if it happened more than once I'd be looking to move to a less problematic course.

The main problem I've noticed over here is with the older guys not letting faster players through. I think they think it's disrespecting them, or they're less of man by letting youger people through or something bonkers like that. Personally I won't stand for it and if it's clear in front I'd basically drive straight past them to the next hole or just beat them to the tee box, and make sure they 100% know what I'm doing. Then I'd complain about their slow play/ not letting players though once I got back to the clubhouse.

I actually saw one fourball of aged 50+ guys taking ages on a tee box (none of them had teed off) in the distance,  with two young lads in cart blatantly waiting behind them who had caught up (I'd let these lads through about a hole earlier). I got to the tee box just after and the old guys were still there, the young lads were just looking at me thinking wtf is going on here? All four of them tried their best to not even acknowledge we were there (it was impossible to not see us, as we were about 5 yards away from their clubs). I had a quick chat with the younger lads again and basically jumped on the back of their cart and we all just drove straight past them down the side as the last guy had teed off and they started walking up.

No excuse for slow play or holding a group up if it's clear in front of you, and you can't begrudge anyone going past you. Speed up or get out of the way.

I'm guessing that's GUR? Why so many tyre tracks across it? No wonder the place is crap if people don't look after it. I'd be sending a bill out for repairs if someone did that on a course I ran.

If they send out fivesomes as a standard policy, then it doesn't matter what the interval is.  I've played with just one group in a fivesome that was as fast as any foursome (we once finished in 3:55 and had to wait on a threesome from 16 in).  My home course allowed them with very stringent stipulations - that they keep up and they were required to all be in carts (3 carts to a fivesome).  Any lagging and they were required to either drop a man or pick up and move forward (or both), and that was made clear to them right up front.  As a rule, we discouraged them, especially on weekends.  I mostly saw them on weekdays around midday.

The other issue that I dispute is a course allowing a back-up on the first tee.  That never happened on my home course.  If one group hacked it up on the first hole to the point where the group behind them was more than a couple of minutes late, then the slow group got "counseled" immediately, either by the starter driving out and getting them to move, or by calling the ranger in to do it.  We just didn't stand for that.  The tee sheet was written in stone.  If a group was late, then they didn't go until there was an opening.  There was no squeezing.  Walk-ons were accommodated when the sheet allowed it.  Didn't matter if it was the district director of golf, he waited for an opening.

The only exception was for frost delays, but then the entire sheet was adjusted and any open times were blocked off until we were back on schedule.  I had days where the sheet was booked from 7 AM, but after an hour and a half frost delay, I didn't get back on schedule until after noon.  On those days, I just told any walk-ons that they were probably out of luck.  The 7 AM time went off at 8:30, and the 7:09 time at 8:39, etc.  If the 7:18 time was open (or the group cancelled, not wanting to wait), then the 7:27 group would move up to that position and go at 8:48 to gain one tee time on the delay.  We kept that up, playing with and adjusting the schedule until we caught up.

Interval is important, but it's not a sole factor, despite what that article tries to indicate.  Course setup and player education are also factors that can play a big role.

Yeah.  The only good thing about it, though, is that I didn't actually see any fivesomes out there.  They're not the only course I've ever seen allow fivesomes, but they are the only course I've seen advertise them.  If you go online to book, the drop down menu gives you the choice of 1 through 5.  But at least they don't cram every threesome and twosome and all singles together to try and make fivesomes.

Another problem with this course (I think) is that the second hole is a par 3.  That seems to always be a bottleneck.

One course nearby that I think does something really right:  The first hole is a 400 yard par 4, and they don't allow you to tee off until the group ahead of you is on the green. Pace of play there is almost always really good.

" the average round time was reduced 14 minutes by switching from 10- to 11-minute intervals."

Majority of public courses I know, tee times are 8 minutes apart.   On Saturdays when all the tee time slots are filled, gridlock happens like a clockwork.   My current home course tee times are 10 minutes apart and most rounds are done in 4 hours and 30 minutes except when there is a tournament in front.   11 minute interval won't help a slow tournament group to move any faster.