Scramble Cheaters

In every 4 ball scramble I've played in my life there are always groups of hackers claiming insanely low scores. Today my team was a group of pretty good golfers. A couple probably high teen handicappers, me, and one that usually breaks 100. We also had two of us that were crushing drives all day long and we made every green in regulation except one. Our approach shots were poor as well as our putting so we finished with a -3 69. Anyway, we were watching a group where 3 of the 4 would definitely rarely shoot under 100 individually and their "good player" was probably a high teens handicap. I never saw any of them hit the green on a par 3 all day long and they were topping drives here and there off the tees. These guys claimed a -10. It was for charity and very lax so I don't really care but something is puzzling me about all these scrambles I've played in.... How are they cheating? Wouldn't you need collusion between all 4 players? How could 4 golfers, even if they are friends, write down lower scores than they earned? And other than blatantly cheating by claiming, say, a birdie when you actually parred, what things might these teams be doing to get their scores so low? Even foot wedges and not taking some of the worst player's drives like they are supposed to (at least 2) wouldn't get their scores so low. Is it like, after missing a 15 footer 4 times, they say "well, your ball jumped off line and it was going in so we're taking bird there," and things like that?

I've played in a lot of charity scrambles over the last 28 years, and it's my observation that the winners are usually not the best golfers, they're the biggest liars.  It's whoever has the biggest balls to come in and turn in a scorecard saying they shot something like -22 with a straight face.  Yes, of course it's collusion between all four players - they're just outright lying on their scorecard.  Why do they do it?  Who knows?  Ego, I guess - there's usually no money involved (or very little, anyway).

Most of the charity scramble tournaments I've played in are drunkfests, and many of the groups play real loose with the rules (if they even know the rules in the first place).  I play with the same group of guys almost every time - we usually come in somewhere between E and -5, and we know there's no chance of winning with that kind of score.

To me, the game of golf, when played properly is a game of integrity.  When I play by myself and I take liberty with things like moving the ball out of a difficult lie, hitting a second ball that went way out of bounds and not  scoring it as such, taking 3 strokes to get out of a sand trap and only counting one stroke, re-hitting a 4' putt and only counting it as one stroke, etc, etc, and ending up scoring on the score card a 94 when, if counting and playing everything properly I really shot a 104...I am only fooling myself.

I play with a guy that has his own rules....if you hit a ball in the water and you can find it and retrieve it you do not lose any stroke.  Same deal if you hit a ball into the wood, you find it, you can drop it back in play and not count strokes.  He always beats me on the score card, carries a lower handicap.  I used to think I was a better golfer than I was because I did not score the game properly...

I used to think that the best score I ever shot was 84...but in reality, it was more like a 94 because I did not play according to the rules, took a few liberties with "playing it as it lies", hitting a second shot off the tee and only counting it as one stroke, re-hitting that 30 yard chip that I chili dipped or sculled across the green and into oblivion...

I play in a few scrambles never expecting to win, and never have, because there is always someone that views winning as the end all, has a much sharper pencil than I do, probably bought 10 mulligans to use, and really has no conscience about turning in a less than legitimate score card showing 12 birdies an eagle, and 5 pars...but, I am not the golf police so I just play the scramble, score my and enjoy it...very seldom do I hang around for the final results to be tallied and prizes awarded.

When playing a normal round, I never feel like I am playing against my playing partner--I feel like I am playing against the course and the person that designed it.  Unfortunately, they (course designers) generally win and in some instances I think they "cheat" because they made the course more difficult in some areas than others (of course that is from my perspective that is developed by the level of competence I have on the golf course)....But, I still have hope that someday I will break 90--legitimately.  Shot a 94 at The Bridges in Gulfport, MS Friday...

This is why I no longer play in Men's Association events, etc.

People cheat. And people will continue to cheat.

A few years ago I played in a scramble team where I was the D player with a 2 HCP. We had 2 mini tour players and another scratch player. I was on the team because I was a long hitter and a good scrambler. We shot -21. We had one par on a b!tch of a par 3 and 4 eagles (one on a par 4). We won. I've played in many scrambles and would never think of cheating. I don't know of any where I could definitively say someone was cheating. Most of my scrambles were end of year scrambles for my work league.

Unless the competition is poorly organized and managed, the only time anyone would have a chance to cheat in any significant way is in a team event where all the players in the group are in on the fix.  I played tournaments for 22 years in a men's club on a public course and never even heard of anyone trying to cheat.  It's pretty hard to cheat when your marker is also your fellow competitor (you never keep your own score) and you are playing in a foursome of players who are all in the same flight and all playing for the same prize.  Even in team events the teams were matched by the computer so it was impossible to stack a team or arrange a fix because you aren't just playing with a bunch of guys that nobody except you knows.

Charity scrambles are a different breed, poorly managed with no oversight and the teams are self organized - they sign on, pay their entry fee and nobody ever looks at them twice.  Especially if the prizes are significant, it will attract the worst sort of golfing riff-raff, since they know going in that nobody will be watching or questioning them.  They also attract teams like Vangator's with a bunch of way above average players (4 eagles in a round?  Never happen in a normal group of scramble golfers.  I don't think I ever heard of more than 2 in a round in 22 years, but we didn't have stacked teams either).  In either case the typical honest team has little chance to do anything but just make their contribution to the cause and play some meaningless golf.

My men's club held a 5 man scramble every spring as a welcome mixer for new members (teams computer arranged by handicap), and the lowest score I ever saw was 15 under par 57 - generally 10 under or higher was out of the money.  Those were honest teams with 5 players ranging from a mid to low single digit "A" player to a 25+ "E" player.  The winners usually had an exceptional day putting.  Honest scrambles almost always come down to the lowest teams holing some unlikely putts or chips.

I agree,  But other than the fact that it is played on a golf course with golf clubs, a scramble has precious little to do with, . . . , you know, actual golf.  Knowing what scrambles are, I wonder that people who dislike the scramble antics play them so much - or, at all.

I hang around because I've won some nice things in the door prize drawings....an R11 driver, a golf bag, a set of Vokey wedges, gift certificates for free foursomes, etc.  I couldn't care less about the final results and trophies, we know we're never in the running for those.

I still enjoy a day outside on the golf course with friends.  Many of the charity scrambles I've played in over the years were put on by my employer and/or related associations, so I knew many of the people there and there were always some who I hadn't seen in some time - so it's always like a reunion combined with a golf tournament.  I don't care about winning in an event like that, I'm just there for the fun and the charitable donation going to a good cause.

Yeah when I say that these guys were hackers I really mean it. Like about as good as having a buddy come out who has never played up until 6 months ago and his entire practice has been coming out with you once a month since. But yeah, I know this happens at every charity scramble but it just baffles me. I just don't see how I could be in a group and happily accept my prizes knowing we lied. Especially with 4 people in the group.

I played in one Scrambler about 15 years ago.  Never again!  It was just a drunk fest, guys screwing around on the course playing what clearly was not what the game of golf is all about.  I actually have no problem with others participating in them, but to me "it does not represent what the true game of golf is.

Yeah I know, all the younger guys on here are thinking, "man this old dude is a stick in the mud, lighten up OLD MAN".

Just how I was taught many years ago, and still play the game.

I'm no spring chicken, and I play the game buy the rules too, but I still enjoy playing a scramble now and then.  Not all of them are just outings for drunks.

Wish I had played in one of your scramblers then.  I may have just hit on one of the not-so-great ones.

I played in one last weekend where we had the string you could buy to save strokes and mulligans you could buy. The winning team came in with a 50. Luckily the prizes were just small trophies since you could buy your way to the win. On one par 5, if every teammate donated $20 you got to take your tee shot from 100 yards out.

God that is stupid.

Around where I live (and I'm sure everywhere else), there are complaints of groups who are either really, really good and cleanup scrambles by lying about their handicaps or are blatantly lying about score. They will walk away with $1000 for this, for a weekend, and it's really annoying to some people. But it's not confined the scrambles! Where I caddied there was a best ball, 4 ball tourney and one year a group of newer members with handicaps from 20-34 won and it was a mystery since a lot of people knew that their handicaps were padded with gimmees, not counted strokes and not adhering to the rules.

I play these things all the time for work. I enjoy them a lot but never expect to win. I always figure the winners were 4 good golfers that formed a team. If you get 4  bogie golfers together I think you end up with a birdie on every other hole right? Not sure. Outright cheating as you describe seems stupid.

I can go out and have a good time tossing a football around on the beach or in a park with friends.  I don't need to strap on full pads and a helmet, have referees, a marked field, goalposts and a scoreboard to enjoy that.  I view scramble tournaments much the same way.

Charity scrambles are more about making money for whatever cause than a "real" golf tournament.  They allow you to buy string, mulligans, etc. because it raises more money for the charity, which is their main goal.  If somebody is looking for a "real" golf tournament played (and scored) strictly by the rules, there are plenty of those out there too.

I have probably played in 40 or 50 scrambles and have not seen the cheating people claim goes on. I have heard people complain that people were cheating yet I sat and watched the groups make shot after shot. A group where the best handicap is a 15'ish is not a great group and -3 is a very poor showing for such a group IMO. I played in a group where it was myself (about a 11 or 12 handicap at the time) and 2 guys who could not break 110 with the last guy never having really played golf. We shot a -1 which I was pretty happy about. I have played in other groups where we have shot -10 to -12 without a single digit handicapper. It's all about making approach shots and putting.

I played a scramble last month and with me as a single digit handicapper and 3 guys over 20 handicappers we managed only -5. A lot of strokes were left on the course and we could have easily shot -8 or lower but didn't make putts or some easy approach shots. We happened to be behind a team that shot -16 and we watched them the whole way. There was plenty of grumbling from other teams afterwards but we watched them all day. No cheating. If you want to see how easy it is to get to double digits under par then actually put together a decent group.

Personally I think the grumbling is a bunch of sour grapes.