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How do I stop coming over the top? - Page 2

post #19 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

Originally Posted by tm22721 View Post
So which video is more correct ?

Hip Turn #1 or Hip Turn #2 ?
GAH! Neither. Why do people insist that the hips "clear". And I have to say Shawns swing is not one that I find that appealing.

Look, the biggest misnomer about the hip turn is that the hip with no weight on it is the one leading the swing. In the backswing they think the right hip moves out of the way. In the forward swing they think the left hip gets out of the way. It's just wrong wrong wrong wrong and I can't believe all these people aren't smart enough to think about it on their own.

Just think about things for a second. If you are standing on one foot and you want to shift your weight to the other foot you PUSH OFF of the foot that has weight on it. Now I'm going to say this with great emphasis because it is absolutely important. WITHOUT THE PUSH THERE IS NO WEIGHT TRANSFER.

For example. Stand on just your right leg. Now, put your left foot on the ground a few feet from your right, but don't put any weight on it. Now, HOW did you do that? How could you possibly have made a movement with your left leg but not shifted your weight? According to every golf instructor I have ever heard this must be an absolute miracle because EVERYTHING is done by the left hip on the forward swing!!

Are you beginning to see my point here? It's the PUSH OFF of the RIGHT foot that makes the weight transfer AND the hip turn happen. It's the RIGHT knee, and RIGHT hip that make the hips move because it's the one actively pushing. The left can't do anything but get out of the right hips way.

Here is one of THE BEST hip turns I've seen in an amateur.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6avjUoLRSQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0EbFIc6IJ4

Watch the tremendous push of his right side through the shot. THAT is power. He doesn't even come close to holding the imfamous tush line but it has to be one of the most powerful lower body movements I've seen.

The bottom line is, drive the right side through. Don't "clear" anything.
post #20 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

I agree with your points Ringer. I disagree with Shawn's debunking of the X factor and his assertion that a golfer should actively clear the hips on the back swing. I do like, though, how he compares the action of throwing a punch to that of the action the forward shoulder should take in the back swing. But I believe that it's essential that this shoulder move drive and pull taught the hips.

IMHO, the golfer should shift the lead hip forward, but not consciously turn it in the downswing. This is enacted by a combination of a push from inside of the back foot (from an area an inch or two before the beginning of the big toe) and a pull from the lead hip. If the golfer laterally moves the hips forward as far as possible while keeping the head back as an anchor, the hips will eventually turn and the weight will transfer forward. When the golfer enters the start of hitting zone (club shaft parallel with the ground and in-line with the target) his or her weight will already be spread 60%/40% front to back because of the forward movement of mass from the legs, hips, and lower torso. The momentum of the club head and arms after impact will pull the torso and head forward, toward the target and around the left leg.
post #21 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

I just fixed one guys "over the top swing" a week ago in a foursome I was playing in. This worked great for him -----

When you set up on the ball check your right hand position in relation to your toe line. If your right hand is inside your toe line --or partially inside --- then simply push your hands away from your body about 4 inches and set your right pinky finger on your toe line.

This position will flatten your backswing and allow for a totally different swing plane. It should allow you to come into the ball from slightly inside out.

If this does not help then I suggest you work on alignment and getting a maximum shoulder turn on your backswing.
post #22 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

I solved my driver slice problem today, by setting up to hit a draw. I use a closed stance with the clubhead pointed at the target. It turns my slice into a slight fade.

Since it seems to work consistently for me I will permanently adopt it. Life is too short and I am getting tired of swing theories that don't work on the golf course.
post #23 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

I had a similar problem (slicing) and seemed to have corrected today by taking the club back in the middle.

Imagine taking it back high (like hitting the ceiling), then taking it back low (like trying to hit a door knob), then I took it back right in the middle. I gained about 25 yards (now 250) within 15-20 yards left/right on target. I also notice the other swings gave me fades with less than ceiling take back and draw with just above door knob, but below middle.

This was todays outcome, If I can recreate this next trip to the range I'll be pretty happy.
post #24 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

Originally Posted by New Guy View Post
I had a similar problem (slicing) and seemed to have corrected today by taking the club back in the middle.

Imagine taking it back high (like hitting the ceiling), then taking it back low (like trying to hit a door knob), then I took it back right in the middle. I gained about 25 yards (now 250) within 15-20 yards left/right on target. I also notice the other swings gave me fades with less than ceiling take back and draw with just above door knob, but below middle.

This was todays outcome, If I can recreate this next trip to the range I'll be pretty happy.
Whatever works.

Today I tried rolling off my right instep during the weight shift. This keeps my right heel from rising off the ground too early and keeps my right hip (and right shoulder) back longer. With this move, I can't swing over the top anymore, it's physically impossible to do.

Keeping your right hip back is what Shawn Clement suggests. Now I understand why.
post #25 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

My instructor gave me a simple thought to remedy this problem. Elbow to your pocket, swing to right field. This really helped me get the feel for swinging from the inside and making good contact with the ball.
post #26 of 42

Re: How do I stop coming over the top?

I also have the same issue. I hands are getting away from my body. But mine is a hook left. Today, I put a tee under my right arm pit and held it there.

That helped. As long as I swung slow!
post #27 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by tm22721 View Post

I have the same problem. I took videos of my swing and determined that I was not turning my hips, I was not taking a complete shoulder turn, I was not staying behind the ball, I was not keeping my left arm straight, I was casting the club, I was not keeping the club close to my body, I was not shifting my weight, I was sliding my hips, I had a reverse pivot and I was not keeping my left wrist flat at the top and at impact.


When I cured all of those problems, I still had a slice so I went back to the video and discovered an additional flaw. I was not turning my hands over at impact. Phew.


When I do all of those things correctly I get straight ball flight with driver, and a draw with the irons.


YMMV

That's all!? Couple range sessions and you're cured.
post #28 of 42
Curing this can take some time, so the only advice is patience and keep at it.
post #29 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by powertrip240 View Post

I have a bad slice, and I've been told it is because my swing comes over the top. I know it's difficult for anyone to fix my swing without seeing it, but does anyone have any quick tips for curing this problem?

 

Biomechanically, all the forces in the downswing tend to throw the clubhead out, if we don't take steps to 'keep it in'. So it's a hugely common problem...

 

In the downswing:

 

  1. Practice a 'bottom-up' unwinding sequence. That is, make sure your muscular work is legs - hips - trunk - shoulders - arms, in that order. Think of your body as a corkscrew.
  2. Practice 'wrapping' the club around your body - like a blanket. If you do #1, this will be easy.
  3. Practice a passive release of the wrists - just let them do their own thing. Let them release when they want to (they will do it perfectly...).

 

AND/OR

 

Place a cardboard box just outside the toe of the club at address - if the box doesn't move at impact - your swing path was fine. If you lapse in concentration, replace it with a concrete block.

 

These simple thoughts (and the box) will drive the club towards a correct planar path through impact.

 

Try them and let me know the results....

Chris

post #30 of 42

+1....I like to feel like at the top of my backswing I drop my right hand straight down, it will help prevent your right shoulder from spinning outward

post #31 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by powertrip240 View Post

I have a bad slice, and I've been told it is because my swing comes over the top. I know it's difficult for anyone to fix my swing without seeing it, but does anyone have any quick tips for curing this problem?

I gave this tip to someone on another thread who said helped. You don't even need a ball. If done properly, you'll feel a swing that doesn't come over the top.

 

I think this drill works best with a driver, but will work with any club. Take your setup. Have a tree or a pole lined up behind the ball along what would be your target line (your golf bag would work too). It should be positioned so that when you start your normal back swing, your club head barely gets by the tree (no more than a half inch). Practice swinging. As long as the tree or golf bag is positioned properly, it will force you start your downswing by "dropping" the club first to get it past the tree or bag. It automatically will stop you from coming over the top. If you come over the top, you'll hit whatever's back there. Hope this helps

post #32 of 42

here you go!!

 

oh and at around 10 mins, question of the week is me!!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PwJ-kx1-uI&feature=g-high-u

post #33 of 42
Quote:
GAH! Neither. Why do people insist that the hips "clear". And I have to say Shawns swing is not one that I find that appealing.

Look, the biggest misnomer about the hip turn is that the hip with no weight on it is the one leading the swing. In the backswing they think the right hip moves out of the way. In the forward swing they think the left hip gets out of the way. It's just wrong wrong wrong wrong and I can't believe all these people aren't smart enough to think about it on their own.

Just think about things for a second. If you are standing on one foot and you want to shift your weight to the other foot you PUSH OFF of the foot that has weight on it. Now I'm going to say this with great emphasis because it is absolutely important. WITHOUT THE PUSH THERE IS NO WEIGHT TRANSFER.

 

I think you're misinterpreting what Shawn is saying.

 

He's saying the hips have to turn (i.e. clear) in order to have a complete backswing and follow-through.  And they do.  You can't turn your torso without turning your hips.  Your spine is not allowed to turn much at all independent of your hips.  Just try it - keep your hips perfectly still and see how far you can twist.

 

However, he then talks about the leverage off the right foot, and the lateral movement.  That's the "push" you're looking for.  

 

Shawn does not advocate at all leading with the hip.  He advocates letting the body "get out of the way" as you let gravity swing the club back and then follow through.  It gets "out of the way" by your hips and torso turning, but he's advocating letting that happen - not by consciously leading with the hips.

post #34 of 42

The thought that really helps me to start the club down the slot is to remember that your arms and your shoulders shouldn't swing together, per se. Your arms will lag behind your shoulders, so relax them, and remember that your hands lag behind your arms, so they aren't in a rush. Essentially just let gravity help you drop it into the slot, instead of swinging with your shoulders only and losing power as well as coming over the top.

post #35 of 42

I found this drill extremely helpfull.

 

post #36 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by AmazingWhacker View Post

I found this drill extremely helpfull.

 

 

 

that looks like what ruined tigers swing with hank haney...

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