Prodaytrader

Ewwww .... What kinda of question is that???? I sense a trap of sorts. Is this a question of morality? If so I fail. Hold me accountable in the afterlife but counterfeit software works the same as DMCA software only without DMCA. Don't judge me though. I already know all the arguements. As I get older I try harder to play by the rules, I can't say that's always been my crede though. How's that for an answer without culpability?

Ah Thank You Ernest. I'm glad I could remind you of someone you are clearly so fond of. To take a moment to say so, shows you care. I like you too

Kinda harsh. I'll reply without trying to insult you in turn. Why would someone want a fake? 1) cheaper - no endorsement deals, marketing, CEO golden parachutes 2) just about everything in America, clubs included are made in China. Most of the time your ok with this unless the Chineese attempt to pass it off as their own then in which case we consider it junk 3) metal is metal right? A chunk of metal milled to look like a golf head surely behaves the same as similar items. Why would someone go through the trouble of making a replica and then leave it hollow? 4) most replicas I've heard of come from the same factories that design the components for name brand products. For instance, I'd have no problems letting Foxconn build for me a iPhone knockoff since I know they built Apple's.

I like your idea. How do these compare with some of the new blades Mizuno offers? I was thinking of getting fitted for a set of Mizuno blades but I ran into so much difficulty I was thinking I might just do what you did.

DON'T LISTEN TO ANYONE HERE! LOL You are only going to become more confused. There is a conspiracy in the industry and it is well permeated in this forum. They want you to buy two sets of clubs, possibly three. One to learn to hit the ball with, one set to learn to make the ball go and then one set to make the ball go where you want. If your going to get a set, get a set you feel like a million dollars in. All the clubs are designed to go the same distance, by rules of the game of golf. I'm you don't think Tiger is above putting Titanium in his putter head to get an advantage then your wrong, The thing that stops him is the rules. Golf clubs are like a pair of boxing gloves or a pair of running shoes. You will do all the work, the equipment just sort of gets in the way. Go with a club that is EASY to HIT and EASY to CONTROL. Whatever equipment you think will make that happen, then go for it. I have a thread about Mizuno with several emails from Mizuno actual regarding when a player is "ready" for a certain club. Between them, the "pro's" at the store and the infinite wisdom of the Internets I find there is a huge lack of consistency regarding equipment. In the end I think the choice of equipment is a personal matter that you are best left in control of. I'm not even sure fittings are all that helpful. It's a relatively new tech and how anyone one the Masters prior to 2000 is beyond me.

Ya I was gonna have my wife do that for me. Which shaft do I tell her to get?

Giddie Up Dead Horse! Thank you for your reply. Overall, the MP 59 is not going to be quite as forgiving as the MP 53. The cavity is much smaller, and therefore the center of gravity is not as low. The purpose of a cavity on a golf club is to help stabilize the head at impact on a mis-hit. Advancements in weight distribution have allowed the cavities to become wider and deeper. These features allow game improvement style irons to be more forgiving, as well as benefit players in trajectory and distance. Most golfers would start out with a club that is slightly easier to hit, and then as their game progresses, move into an iron that is more suitable for shot shaping. In our opinion, it sounds like the fitter is attempting to point you in this direction. If you need any additional information, please feel free to let us know. Best regards, Mizuno USA http://www.mizunousa.com Consumer Support Division 1-800-966-1211 Straight from the horses mouth. Since I accidentally miss more then I accidentally hit, I think I'm qualified just fine. I also think I will try a proshop instead of a sporting good store. This way I can see the ball flight better and wont be thrown off by cold play and jitters.

I want to ask you why you care? I know you feel slighted, I would too, but dont they appear to be the same? I mean its not like they are hollow or something. Can you tell they are fake? I'm thinking about buying fakes intentional, so I want to know how close they are to the real thing. It sounds like to me you cant even tell the difference, which means thats a good fake.

The wife and I rode the back of The Dragon yesterday, 318 switchbacks in 11 miles. Awesome! During that time I've contemplated a few things, notice the lack of posts for the last 24 hours or so. I think I have come to the conclusion that God is telling me not to buy these or any clubs for that matter, quit the game and then go feed starving homeless children. bye on second thought: Here's my issue on the shaft selection: if I show the fitter one thing, but do something entirely different on the course, how do I find a shaft on my own? I play around with my swing a lot, lagging at times, flowing smoothly at other times, I'm currently working through this zen master type swing where I become one with the club LMAO. I have a lot of swing knowledge or technical knowledge but have yet to settle onto something that I repeat over and over and over again or what I would call practical knowledge. I'm on a very steep learning curve, partly because I played in HS then in army and partly because I am retired. I have forgotten a lot, but am recalling it very quickly. Besides, it's my nature to ingest whole worlds in entire gulps, golf being no different. Some articles I have read, perhaps even by Iacas, would indicate that all the clubs, by rule, have to be close to the same anyway. And when I think about the degrees on the clubs themselves, I wonder, just how much difference can there be, really, from club to club. Maybe that's why some of you have indicated to just go with what looks good and feels good. Clearly the placebo effect must be at play here, but if it works, then whatever, right? At one point in my haze of memories, I recall pointing out to my wife, these aren't really doing anything different then my current clubs. Somehow I temporarily blocked that out in my pursuit to spend money. Would I be best suited for a standard shaft, one not too stiff or whippy, until I get to a point, if I ever do, where I am certain I want more or less firmness? If this is true, then what about lie angle and the rest? One would presume I address the ball the same each and every time and I can't necessarily say I do that either. Keep in mind my goal was to replace a cursed set of clubs about 2 years ago, but when I did I replaced them with a seriously gimped cavity set and then I accidentally got the 6 iron caught under the wheel of my cart and broke the shaft. Playing with those clubs was like playing with a whiffle bat or something, but I wouldn't discover that until after a year of constant playing, I mean near daily constant playing. So here we are, new season, no Burners to play with since I broke the 6 iron last year, and here we are with the cursed dead mans set once again. I don't want another set of whiffle bats, but I also realize that blades are an awfully aggressive club, but then I am an awfully aggressive kind of guy so there you have it. Thank god for user names...I'm having to bleed my heart out to the world just to find a set of clubs that I can learn to master. oh right...click submit

I don't know how made up my mind was. I started the day thinking 59, asked about 53 and ended at 69 and am now thinking I really mean 64. These numbers are pissing me off! I am not looking for a larger sweet spot or over sized head. I have no problems hitting with the thinner head and want my hands to sting like like a mother when I get lazy. Am I the only one who struggles with intensity? I have lazy swings, goto swings, nono swings, watch this swings, oops my bad swings and finally the famous: don't you whiff this shot for fear of being burned at the stake swings. All of it centers on focus and intensity, at least for me. I expect to be punished on lazy days in an effort to force myself to be more intense. When I'm on, I'm on and I'll play for money, lose but whatever. I'm getting there. Why do I want to enable bad swing styles? I already have a cavity set and a mid set so if I dont like blades i can switch back. I'll even carry an extra set in the car for insurance to keep the den mothers happy. I read some essays on shaft selection. Apparently I'll need to measure the distance between my Johnson and the floor, desired shaft length, flex point and finally something about butt angles. In my day we just said, 'Hows it hangin?' yea seriously no help Mr 40 years of shaft study. My OP had something to do with a preception of not being worthy. I think I have a better understanding of where that idea comes from. I do write a lot but I find that to be an easy task even on an iPhone, plus I kept it to one thread, with a singular purpose and make the promise to disappear once I am satisfied I have acquired enough information. Plus my lava bucket is empty???

So there is no mass behind the sweet spot? No force being accelerated through that specific point in space. No attempt on our part to push our mass through the club to generate club head speed and into the ball? Just a zero sum game where we attempt to not fall over as we swing widely right, transfer our weight evenly through CoG and then back through to the left. No torque applied to the ball inducing spin, or oval shaped swing paths designed to strike the ball at an off angle. None of that applies to golf? I assume a tennis racket will produce the same results then or perhaps a hockey stick would be a better tool. How do you select a shaft? I must needs find an exit quick, I am far from home! It's my user name isn't it? I haven't traded stocks in 5 years. I don't need too any longer. Does that help you guys better help me find a shaft? :) lol

Well, give me a break. I was in boots, I used at least 5 different clubs, my wife & kids present and once again I'm on stage. At every turn, even these comments, I for some reason continue to have to justify the purchase. At what club would I receive less grief on? Is there a preferred method of testing shafts? I'm clearly in this boat alone. S200...S something? stock shaft, steel I believe. The only reason I even desire to look at shafts other then steel is because number 1, lots of pros use them, number 2 I understand they are geared for people with slower swing speeds or joint issues which I have. So I thought maybe fiber would be a better choice. I have yet to test different shafts. What good is their swing optimizer if I don't trust it or I can't produce on demand my best swing thus giving it the data it needs. I get tempo, swing path, releases...yada yada...can I produce it on que when somebody says snap? No I cant. But then that's why I'm not Tiger. It doesn't mean I can't produce a beautiful shot from time to time and the rest of the time I will live with a 150 average 6 iron from a club designed to do 180. Maybe someday I will be able to maximize it's potential. I'll continue to work the chip game and putting so as to bring the handicap down thus justifying the desire for maximum feedback irons. At this point I'm tempted to go to Wal-Mart and see what they have.

the story continues..... I went back to Dicks armed....so well armed. I'm in a small town and during dinner I happened to notice the golf pro was eating at the same restaurant. So I decided to sneak back over to Dicks thinking I might get a different salesman. I did. I took my 6 iron, I grabbed a MP 69, MP 59, JPX 825 and a JPX 825 PRO. I currently use something more like the JPX 825 only without the weight difference. The swing weight in the 825 seems much lower or heavier, I cant tell which. I did in fact consistently hit cleaner shots with the JPX 825 Pro. I really liked the feel of it. I must say though...of all the nicest shots I had, I hit 85 my wife says, the longest, loftiest shots and most fun...were from the MP 69. It's a different kind of club for sure. I picked it up 4 times after each try with the other clubs. Each time I picked it up, I out shot whatever I just did with the previous iron. It feels lighter by far when compared to the 825 pro, but I can still hit that son of ball clean enough to knock it stiff 180 with a hang time that would put A.J. Trapasso to shame. I all but settled on the MP 69 and was thinking about shafts when I decided to engage the new sales agent. So what's the process I ask for purchasing these clubs? We get you fitted he says. Ok lets fit I say. It costs 50 dollars but will be waived he says, fair enough, what now. He hooks me back up to the Mizuno swing tester thing that lost the sale in the first place, so I say to him, I have already done this 'test' and what it will say is, not to buy the MP 69. So I ask, how do I learn what shaft to use on the club head I have selected. No other way he says other then to use this machine and if you don't buy the clubs I will have to charge you 50 bucks. So I say back, well I already did this once today, they didn't charge me 50 dollars, and I'm telling you that machine is going to cost you a 1000 dollar sale, for the second time today! Is there no other way to get this information I ask. No he says! I all but lost it. Why is this such a difficult process? I knocked every damn one of those balls 140 to 180 yards in a cluster 20 yards wide. I would have been pleased to see each one on the course but after careful testing and weighing all the factors I want the MP 69. What's so complicated about this??? I saw it with my own eyes, I used my own club, I knocked the MP 69's out of the park, why would I not want that club? How do I find the right shaft should I be forced to order online? Is there not two polar opposite shafts that I can use to compare like I did to select the club head? From there maybe narrow it down to one or two choices but surely there are see-able or feel-able differences I can measure for myself.

I don't buy the argument that cavity backed clubs are a cost free benefit. Simple physics would dictate that a larger sweet spot means less mass across the entire sweet spot thus less of a sweet spot if the club remains the same weight. I think the only true comparison possible is to take my old club along and swing them all to see which I feel best with. If I were looking for consistency then maybe a cavity would work but MB clubs seem to offer loftier balls.

I went to Edwin Watts, I informed him I did not wish to be talked out of the MP 59! He said no problem I own them too, but you know what I play with JPX. Half hour later, I'm having dinner with my wife, no clubs, saying to her: see I'm not crazy. Nobody will sell me the clubs! We think we now understand the differing motives. I do not wish to mask my swing faults and he does. Maybe so I will purchase two sets like I've already done? Madness!