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The assumption, however, is that there was.  If a golfer were to tee up an orange; I dare say the swing would, after impact, result in a different posture.  It would be interesting to note the differences up to impact.

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7 minutes ago, Piz said:

The assumption, however, is that there was.

No. Why? Huh? He hit a golf ball with a golf club.

7 minutes ago, Piz said:

If a golfer were to tee up an orange; I dare say the swing would, after impact, result in a different posture.

I don't think that is true at all.

He's a baseball player. That's a home run style golf swing on the left. It's what he knew.

Now he knows the swing on the right. For golf.

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This is how I feel I finish (on left). I know my weight is back but for the life of me can't get it forward. I have been making better contact in general but need to solve this as well as many other pieces I am sure. Going to see if can get one of the guys to record a few  swings for me this weekend and finally start a "my swing" thread. 

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18 hours ago, iacas said:

The kid made it in one swing. That one was like three swings in. :-P

So… good instruction? ;-)

It ain't bragging when you can back it up:) 

I'm glad it went that well for the student. The swing on the left is a terrible habit to get stuck in. 

3 hours ago, Gator Hazard said:

This is how I feel I finish (on left). I know my weight is back but for the life of me can't get it forward. I have been making better contact in general but need to solve this as well as many other pieces I am sure. Going to see if can get one of the guys to record a few  swings for me this weekend and finally start a "my swing" thread. 

 @Gator Hazard - nipping this habit in the bud will go a long way towards solving a lot of other issues, IMO (obviously not saying that's the case with you, but I believe it is for me). After 3 years of working on this on my own, I've finally made a tiny bit of progress this year. But a lot of the time I still feel too much pressure on my trail foot through impact and follow-through. Much of my practice still goes towards getting my weight forward. It's super frustrating.

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30 minutes ago, JonMA1 said:

It ain't bragging when you can back it up:) 

I'm glad it went that well for the student. The swing on the left is a terrible habit to get stuck in. 

 @Gator Hazard - nipping this habit in the bud will go a long way towards solving a lot of other issues, IMO (obviously not saying that's the case with you, but I believe it is for me). After 3 years of working on this on my own, I've finally made a tiny bit of progress this year. But a lot of the time I still feel too much pressure on my trail foot through impact and follow-through. Much of my practice still goes towards getting my weight forward. It's super frustrating.

Thanks @JonMA1  I'm going to keep working on it and hopefully get some help. Keep an eye out for a truly hideous swing from me, coming to a thread near you in the near future. 

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On 7/20/2017 at 5:32 PM, JonMA1 said:

 

 @Gator Hazard - nipping this habit in the bud will go a long way towards solving a lot of other issues, IMO (obviously not saying that's the case with you, but I believe it is for me). After 3 years of working on this on my own, I've finally made a tiny bit of progress this year. But a lot of the time I still feel too much pressure on my trail foot through impact and follow-through. Much of my practice still goes towards getting my weight forward. It's super frustrating.

I, and several of my buddies have dealt with this issue, Think of him what you will, but I watched a Hank Haney video lesson on this very issue! He said that if you were going to work on this to head to the range and concentrate only on getting your weight through the ball! Never mind where the ball goes!

Mind you, this doesn't mean shoving your head toward the target at the start of the downswing! That's a killer too! 

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Sorry about being late on an entry here, I am a baseball instructor. The picture on the right is how Babe Ruth ended his swing(your noted  correct golfing position). I believe the Babe had the best home run swing. The picture on the left is how the line drive swing is currently taught. Ruth never left any weight on his back foot at the end of the swing(his left foot was always dangling and sliding on the toe at the end of the swing- you can see this in Babes instructional video to the orphan kids on youtube). So the Babe might have had a great Golf swing too!  (by the way admin- I do not see the pics unless I click on the blue rectangle on the left of the post. is there a browser setting I must change for this forum)

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I do not know where you arrived at that conclusion. If you analyze the swings of todays modern home run hitters you will see the exact swing of the Bambino. I have done slow motion analysis of every major league home run hitter. Longoria, Pujols, Bonds, etc. I have actual footage in 480 fps hispeed camera of them.  That concept of keeping the weight on the back foot maneuver is basically incorrect, a weight shift is also required for baseball or you do not get batspeed  just like golf.  

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5 hours ago, allenw25 said:

(by the way admin- I do not see the pics unless I click on the blue rectangle on the left of the post. is there a browser setting I must change for this forum)

I'm not an admin but...what browser are you using?   The pics show up for me on my desktop PC using Chrome, Firefox, and MS Edge.

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1 hour ago, allenw25 said:

I do not know where you arrived at that conclusion. If you analyze the swings of todays modern home run hitters you will see the exact swing of the Bambino. I have done slow motion analysis of every major league home run hitter. Longoria, Pujols, Bonds, etc. I have actual footage in 480 fps hispeed camera of them.  That concept of keeping the weight on the back foot maneuver is basically incorrect, a weight shift is also required for baseball or you do not get batspeed  just like golf.  

Screen Shot 2020-01-03 at 1.56.21 PM.pngap_beb7aee44afb422a8d0579fb192b3c80-620x

 

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1 hour ago, allenw25 said:

I do not know where you arrived at that conclusion. If you analyze the swings of todays modern home run hitters you will see the exact swing of the Bambino. I have done slow motion analysis of every major league home run hitter. Longoria, Pujols, Bonds, etc. I have actual footage in 480 fps hispeed camera of them.  That concept of keeping the weight on the back foot maneuver is basically incorrect, a weight shift is also required for baseball or you do not get batspeed  just like golf.  

I know all about it. D1 home run hitter and coached hitters after college. I can talk hitting all day long. On home run swings, yes essentially everyone has to get to same positions to have good results. The Bambino had way too much if a weight shift imo. The majority of your weight should be back at contact. The front side is just to torque into creating power. Of course this is impact which is the only thing that matters consistently. It doesn't matter what you look like after the swing or before for the most part. During his time period yes the babe was a monster but in today's game he would get carved up by any D1 Friday night starter. 

Yep pujols keeps that weight over the back knee like he should. That is a ball of Fame swing.

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Great that you were a D1 Player. Look at Pujols back foot at contact(not after contact), all weight is transferred to the front foot.  He is only touching his toe to the ground. If you watch it carefully, he drags the rear foot forward on the toe(not the ball of the foot) with very little weight on it.. Ruth had the toe a similar way however his front leg was more vertical at contact. Pujols does not stride, he rotates his front toe down to create the weight shift. I have taught that to many hitters who have trouble timing a fastball.  That transmission of weight to the front foot causes body rotational torque that in turn, induces great bat speed.   According to numerous pro golf instructors, the golf swing requires a very similar move. In learning to build swing speed many teach the baseball stride for practice with the front foot landing and the rear foot coming forward at impact zone.  Pitchers do something very similar with their landing foot, transfer weight and induce rotation in the hips.. I have hundreds of high speed videos that show the great hitters in action. I can not recall any of them that had any weight on the ball of the foot at contact on a home run hit. When their timing is upset, then all bets are off as they are in panic mode to make contact. (A pitchers #1 job is to screw up hitters timing.- If we had to deal with that in golf, it would would not be a game many would play-lol- it's hard enough to hit the golf ball well when it is still)  Have a great day! This is not a baseball forum, sorry admin... I will stop now.

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For reference it isn't a back foot/front foot thing.. your weight can be "back" with your back foot off the ground. I have pics of myself hitting a home run at contact with my rear foot off the ground. However my weight is biased back. I don't mind to say weight shift more as a transfer of energy into the front/ground that allows a forceful rotation of the lower half. However the upper half, particularly the hands/bat head need to be propelled along the same plane as the pitch for as long as possible for a great swing. There is a "weight shift" but it is not exactly like golf. 

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17 minutes ago, allenw25 said:

Great that you were a D1 Player. Look at Pujols back foot at contact(not after contact), all weight is transferred to the front foot.

No, it isn't.

His weight is predominantly back. He's SPIKED the PRESSURE under his front foot, but that's not weight.

1 hour ago, Casualgolfer said:

Yep pujols keeps that weight over the back knee like he should. That is a Hall of Fame swing.

Indeed.

@allenw25, home run hitters leave their weight back as a way of helping to send the bat forward. Until you understand the differences between weight/pressure and look at COM traces, pressure traces, etc. and understand them… you're going to have a tough time in this conversation.

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Looks like the baseball player plants his front foot and pushes backwards, instead of driving forwards and finishing on the front foot like the golf swing.

A baseball players weight is forward only about 40% and they quickly push and lean back to put all the speed they can into the ball. This would potentially work for a long driver teeing the ball up like crazy, but it would only ever work from a position where the ball is off the ground.

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Last year we played a course in a small community that is "out there" a little ways. I was relaxing in the shade with a beer when a high school team showed up. I spotted the coach and asked him who was playing. It was two smaller schools that were also "out there" a little ways, and not exactly golf powerhouses. I hung around to watch some of them tee off, and man, I saw a whole lot of baseball swings that day! 

My buddy played a ton of baseball back in the day. He was heck of a second baseman, and a heck of an all around athlete. He STILL has a baseball swing despite his best efforts to get rid of it! With the Driver he aims well right, brings the clubhead outside in, but manages to square the face to the path, and pulls the ball into the fairway. His entire Driver swing seems to be a series of compensations for an incorrect weight shift. But, he's grooved his faults, and hits it the same way most times. And he scores well. Breaks 80 all the time. 

And who knows? Maybe if Drivers were as heavy and as stiff as baseball bats, maybe the home run swing would be the preferred way of swinging the club.

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This off season in addition to Superspeed training I’ve been studying Kyle Berkshire ( who grew up playing baseball).  His swing does remind me of growing up playing baseball.  I had one swing for singles/ line drives and another swing for hitting it deep.  His swing reminds me of the latter.

Im going to post what Art Sellinger said on the TPI about Kyle during the WLD this year.

 

average player has to realize that to create speed the upper body tilt and head work back away from the ball. I see them trying to make this big lateral weight shift on their forward swing, but they cannot create speed when their center of mass is past the ball prior to striking it.

 

- Art Sellinger

Think about an intertube being towed by a boat.  If the driver wanted to make the tube accelerate outside the right wake, they'd crank the boat hard to the left. It's an analogy, but the same general concept applies to the golf swing.  This is why golfers who slide (excessive movement towards target) or early extend (move towards target line) often have a difficult time maximizing their power potential.

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