Jump to content

18 posts / 3593 viewsLast Reply

Recommended Posts

Hi guys

potential issue at our club, 8 th hole uphill OOB all up left side but a cart path runs up left side about 6 to 8 feet from fence. There are small trees planted along the fence which used to be staked so free drop, now they have grown stakes are gone and no free drop which is fine. ( free drop made hole too easy imho). Problem is if a ball stops on the gravel path and you are right handed the room to drop is small and trees and fence interfere. This makes it difficult in places to even have a playable shot after a free drop. You couldn’t play from path with out destroying a club but seems harsh that your only 5 yards off the fairway on a man made path but have to drop where it’s virtually unplayable. There are places where if you took relief it would be unplayable then two clubs only gets you back to path!

can we make a local rule that all drop to right of path if a ball is on the path? Or a drop zone for path? Or is it just tough?

thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Register for free today and you won't see this ad spot again!

Why can't you drop on the right side of the path.  All you need is Nearest Point of Relief from the path.  Of course, if that is to the left and you get a difficult angle to hit from, that is just tough.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi.

if you’re right handed the nearest point of relief is almost always the left side. It just seems harsh that your ball is in bounds and would be perfectly playable but because you have to get relief from a cart path your ball becomes unplayable. It’s not just a difficult angle, you don’t have a swing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Gazzagolf said:

Hi.

if you’re right handed the nearest point of relief is almost always the left side. It just seems harsh that your ball is in bounds and would be perfectly playable but because you have to get relief from a cart path your ball becomes unplayable. It’s not just a difficult angle, you don’t have a swing.

Depending on how close the path is to the fence, I see a possible way around this.  So you take your drop between the path and the fence, and you can't take a stance to hit the ball toward the green.  A reasonable option is to hit sideways, or even backward (toward the tee).  If the path interferes with THAT stance, you get relief again.  If there isn't enough room to drop the ball inside the fence without having your feet on the path (hitting toward the tee), your NPR might then be on the right side of the path.  Of course, if the path is 6 to 8 feet from the fence, there probably IS enough room to take that shot toward the tee without interference from the path.  I'd be aiming my tee shot at the other side of the fairway, to do my best to avoid this problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

19 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

Of course, if the path is 6 to 8 feet from the fence…

Right, there's always going to be enough room to take a stance over there.

Don't hit it there, and if you do, consider putting it or blading it back into play so your club(s) don't hit the cart path.

The only real alternative is actually for the club to move the OB line to the (outer) edge of the cart path. That would eliminate drops on that side, but with the obvious other consequences.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I know the ball is on the cart path and you supposedly get a "free drop." But in this case could you take an unplayable lie instead and drop no nearer the hole two club lengths toward the right side of the cart path +1 stroke. Chances are it'll put your ball just off the cart path or maybe you'll be clear. Who knows? But if you're not completely clear with your feet still on the cart path, could you then take cart path relief? Hey, I'm just asking. I'm no expert. I didn't see anything that says you can't do this. It would be an alternative to wrecking your club or the two or three strokes taken trying to hit out of a mess in the bushes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

2 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

I know the ball is on the cart path and you supposedly get a "free drop." But in this case could you take an unplayable lie instead and drop no nearer the hole two club lengths toward the right side of the cart path +1 stroke. Chances are it'll put your ball just off the cart path or maybe you'll be clear. Who knows? But if you're not completely clear with your feet still on the cart path, could you then take cart path relief? Hey, I'm just asking. I'm no expert. I didn't see anything that says you can't do this. It would be an alternative to wrecking your club or the two or three strokes taken trying to hit out of a mess in the bushes.

That's exactly correct.  However, if you lift your ball with the intention of taking free relief from the cart path, you have limited your choices: 

take free relief, near the point of nearest complete relief to the left of the path.  Once you have taken that drop, you can then take any of the unplayable lie choices, at a cost of one penalty stroke, but once you're on the left side of the path you might not be able to get to a decent spot with the relief options available

Take two clublength relief from the original location on the path (unplayable lie), with a total of two penalty strokes

or take stroke and distance relief (unplayable lie) with one penalty stroke.  

This is all in Interpretation 9.4b/6.  The moral of the story, be sure you know what your plan is before you lift any ball.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

They can create drop zones on the fairway side of the path to take your relief from the path.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

On 6/3/2019 at 3:23 PM, DaveP043 said:

That's exactly correct.  However, if you lift your ball with the intention of taking free relief from the cart path, you have limited your choices: 

take free relief, near the point of nearest complete relief to the left of the path.  Once you have taken that drop, you can then take any of the unplayable lie choices, at a cost of one penalty stroke, but once you're on the left side of the path you might not be able to get to a decent spot with the relief options available

Take two clublength relief from the original location on the path (unplayable lie), with a total of two penalty strokes

or take stroke and distance relief (unplayable lie) with one penalty stroke.  

This is all in Interpretation 9.4b/6.  The moral of the story, be sure you know what your plan is before you lift any ball.

Looking at it from another angle since it's going to cost you anyway, if it's a paved path, I'd probably putt off of it toward the fairway. But if it was gravel, try to chip it off. It's not a full shot and probably wouldn't damage the club - maybe get it into a better spot. I've learned that sometimes free isn't so free.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Gazzagolf, I think you get relief from that path, and that the relief guarantees space to swing, etc.  But there is no guarantee that you get to hit the ball the direction you would like - just that you can hit it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Just now, Cantankerish said:

Gazzagolf, I think you get relief from that path, and that the relief guarantees space to swing, etc.

Not true.

You must take complete relief from the path, but it doesn't guarantee that you have a swing at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

So then, is complete relief possible without a place to swing?

 

Nvm, different kind of relief

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Thanks folks.

from what I can gather as it stands it’s just tough, if you’re on the path you either play or go to nearest point of relief which maybe way worse and leave you with no shot at all.

as a committee we do have a few options to help though. We can create drop zones just for relief from the path, apparently you can make a local rule that makes the path relief from the ball and exclude stance, so you could drop off the path but be allowed to stand on it which would solve the problem without adding to greenstaff workload marking and remarking drop zones. I didn’t know this was an option but our comp sec checked with regional rules officer.

The more brutal option would be make the left edge of the path OOB so you have to drop on the right.

comp meeting next week to decide, thanks for the ideas and help.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Cantankerish said:

So then, is complete relief possible without a place to swing?

 

 

 

Yes - but relief does not guarantee a free swing. One of the most commonly broken rules is people taking relief from paths and thinking they can drop it where they avoid trees and have a clear shot. Complete relief and a place to swing are totally independent entities; they have nothing to do with each other. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

sorry to hijack this thread but I have a question...my playing partner who is right handed found his ball just off the left side of a path. 

Therefore his ball was not on the path nor was his stance, however, he then declared that he intended to play the shot left handed (he has never said that before nor have i seen him play a left handed shot).

Is this legal? I told him I thought you had to make a legitimate attempt and take your normal stance to play the shot but he thought otherwise...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, okeloon said:

sorry to hijack this thread but I have a question...my playing partner who is right handed found his ball just off the left side of a path. 

Therefore his ball was not on the path nor was his stance, however, he then declared that he intended to play the shot left handed (he has never said that before nor have i seen him play a left handed shot).

Is this legal? I told him I thought you had to make a legitimate attempt and take your normal stance to play the shot but he thought otherwise...

16.1a(3) says this:

Quote

(3) No Relief When Clearly Unreasonable to Play Ball. There is no relief under Rule 16.1:

 

  • When interference exists only because a player chooses a club, type of stance or swing or direction of play that is clearly unreasonable under the circumstances.

I'd say that for a right-handed player to choose to play lefthanded when a normal right-handed swing is available is "clearly unreasonable".  A left-handed swing COULD be reasonable if the ball was against a fence or tree or something that made a right-handed swing impossible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

On 6/3/2019 at 1:38 AM, Gazzagolf said:

Hi.

if you’re right handed the nearest point of relief is almost always the left side. It just seems harsh that your ball is in bounds and would be perfectly playable but because you have to get relief from a cart path your ball becomes unplayable. It’s not just a difficult angle, you don’t have a swing.

Remember that you do get a club length, not nearer the hole, from the NPR, which may get you to a slightly better spot.  Also, if your ball stopped in the area between the path and the fence (where you are taking relief from the path), you would not be looking for relief.  The drop is just putting you in the nearest place to where your ball stopped that is not impacted by the path, there's no logical reason why you should get to go somewhere else just because it isn't nice.  As quote I have often seen (and often seen abused), it's Nearest point of relief, not Nicest point of relief.  Putting, blading, chipping, or an unplayable are all other options.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 8/8/2019 at 1:53 AM, okeloon said:

sorry to hijack this thread but I have a question...my playing partner who is right handed found his ball just off the left side of a path. 

Therefore his ball was not on the path nor was his stance, however, he then declared that he intended to play the shot left handed (he has never said that before nor have i seen him play a left handed shot).

Is this legal? I told him I thought you had to make a legitimate attempt and take your normal stance to play the shot but he thought otherwise...

 

Of course it's not legal. He's a cheating douche and I can guarantee that he is in other aspects of life.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • 2019 TST Partners

    PING Golf
    FlightScope Mevo
  • Posts

    • First of all the Garmin Truswing is an amazing tool that gives very accurate swing metrics.  So this is not a dig on the device.   That much said this is a consumer warning.  I have sr flex shafts that are graphite.  I put the truswing on my 7 iron and left it in place thinking I would spend the winter focusing on perfecting my swing with that club and move on in the spring to others given that I have single length hybrids to wedges.  My fourth time out I take a swing and the shaft snaps right below the garmin.  So friends my advice is if you are going to use one of these make sure you don't tighten it too much or it might result in some surprises.    
    • The problem is not hitting different types of shots or adjusting.  The problem is conditions can vary from one foot to the next.  In the situation I was, it would well have been possible that the condition of the sand where the ball was and your feet were would be completely different.  It makes judging what you are going to do nigh on impossible. I am OK with people hitting different shots from the same situation.  That is what makes golf great. I am also OK with challenges. What I have a problem with is conditions being bad due to insufficient maintenance.  I would rather have a course with other alternatives, even if it is a hazard, than an area that is supposed to be playable, but isn't.  To give you an example, my home course is built on a paddy field.  We still get land crabs digging holes on the course.  The understandable decision, a local one, has been made to offer relief from the crab holes on the course
    • I hate it if random strangers ask me if they can join. I always lose my composure. I said "no" a few times and explained why, but they always give  me glimpse like I murdered their first born.   I played a 109 today. For some of you outrageously high, for me a very good round. 😎 Played better than my provisional handicap.
    • Now that my season is done, I would like to reflect. My driving Fairway Hit % in the beginning of the year was less than 40%, to end the year it was 63.5%. My target goal was 65%, and if you remove the drives before I got my new driver it moves up to 66.4%, but that is cheating myself. I need to improve this stat. My average GIR was 7.8. This is bad, I really need to improve this. However, my best rounds of the year were all over 12 GIR, which shows that when I’m on my game, I’m hitting greens.  My Average score on par 3’s was 4.186. I really need to improve my par 3 play. My average par 5 score was 5.546. I’m not mad about this, but considering my length off the tee and with irons, I would want this to be at or under 5. My average par 4 score was 4.915 This is just abysmal. I shouldn’t be averaging nearly a bogey on par 4’s.  My average score in tournaments was an 89. 75. My average score out of tournaments was an 80.66. My goal for tournaments was 85 or better and my goal outside tournaments was under 80. I hit neither. These are the only stats I keep at the moment. I had a few rounds in the 90’s and 2 rounds over 100. The 90+ and 100+ scores were all in tournaments, save for one round of 91 I shot on my schools course. All in all, my short game improved a ton, my  iron ply improved a ton, my driving was the biggest overhaul, and my mid range wedges gained a fair amount of accuracy and consistency. I don’t feel I’m far off of being in the 70’s or better. I typically give myself plenty of birdie attempts, and I can recover well. 
    • Last day of the year for golf. Ended it kind of sadly.  Long story short, I was 2 over through 15, had about 5 birdie putts that I missed, made 2 birdies, had about 4 insane recovery chips that I still don’t understand how I pulled off, and 4 bogeys that honestly shouldn’t have happened. 2 were 3 putts from on the green, one was trying a stupid hero shot and drilling a tree, and the last one was a flubbed chip.  16 Tee I wildly miss the fairway with my fairway wood. It stings extra bad missing the fairway when you try to lay up, so I let it get in my head and decided to try yet another hero shot, drilled a tree and back into the fairway. Gun the yardage, 154 about an extra 10 uphill, so about 164. Torn between an 8 and a 7. My 8 goes about 164 max in the warm if I really up my tempo, and my 7 typically carries 178 in the warm, so I decided to play it safe and grip down on a 7 iron and flight the ball higher in the air so it carries shorter and stops better. Proceed to fly the green by about 10 yards because I absolutely poured the ball. Lose the ball in long grass behind green, return to previous shot, penalize myself for losing a ball and grab an 8 iron, then proceed to come up well short. You can see where I’m going with this. Finish with an 8. Now 6 over through 16, Finish 3 putt double bogey, and then par to shoot 80.  Oh well, shit happens sometimes. Up until that point I was playing well. 11 GIR is a pretty good stat, but 11 GIR and only 7 being par or better is not good.   Edit: looked at scorecard and realized i actually shot double bogey, then par to finish. Kind of stings worse.
  • TST Blog Entries

  • Blog Entries

  • Today's Birthdays


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...