Dropped Ball, Found and Played Original

[DrvFrShow]

Then I've got a question relating to the title of the thread.

1) I hit a drive - a cut. It went into the trees on the left side. I saw two small branches of pine drop to the ground. I had reason to believe that it took quite a bit of steam out of the drive. I lost sight of the ball because of the trees. 

2) I looked for the ball in the area of the trees. I didn't find it. So I used the local rule and dropped at that point and played a shot which landed on the fringe. On my way to the hole I found my original ball sitting pretty in the first cut on the left out LOS because of a small hill about 70 yds closer to the hole. And yes it was my ball - I had my initials on it. 

3) So I played my original ball and took a par. 

Did I make the right decision?

[Double Mocha Man]

I'll wait for the "rules guys" to weigh in but I think once you declared your ball lost and played another ball it doesn't matter if you find the original... even if it's in the hole!

[Rulesman]

You can't in fact 'declare a ball lost'. As soon as you substitute another ball, the original becomes lost.

[DaveP043]

To build on @Rulesman, if you read the local rule, once you drop the second ball, the original ball is out of play and the substituted ball is in play.  @DrvFrShow, you didn't do it correctly, sorry.

[Double Mocha Man]

7 minutes ago, Rulesman said:

You can't in fact 'declare a ball lost'. As soon as you substitute another ball, the original becomes lost.

Semantics, a bit. But here's a question: If you drop a fresh ball but don't hit it and find your original ball within the total 3 minutes then what is the rule?  Or is the dropping of the fresh ball the "declaration" ?

[dennyjones]

2 hours ago, Double Mocha Man said:

Semantics, a bit. But here's a question: If you drop a fresh ball but don't hit it and find your original ball within the total 3 minutes then what is the rule?  Or is the dropping of the fresh ball the "declaration" ?

Look at post #22...I believe you'll find the answer there

[Double Mocha Man]

7 minutes ago, dennyjones said:

Look at post #22...I believe you'll find the answer there

Ah, thank you.  That'll teach me to first read all the posts in a thread. 

So, apparently, you can drop another ball, without serious intent to hit it... and you can pick it up if you find the original (within the allotted time).  I'm thinking "intent" comes down to swinging at the fresh ball, or if you're Mr. DeChambeau the 4 minute scientific lead-up, caddie discussions, triple wind check, to striking the ball.

[Missouri Swede]

5 hours ago, Double Mocha Man said:

it doesn't matter if you find the original... even if it's in the hole!

This one I know:  If the original ball is in the hole, the hole was over for that player, even if he didn't know it at the time.  So the dropped ball was inconsequential.

[pganapathy]

On 9/16/2019 at 1:24 AM, DrvFrShow said:

Then I've got a question relating to the title of the thread.

1) I hit a drive - a cut. It went into the trees on the left side. I saw two small branches of pine drop to the ground. I had reason to believe that it took quite a bit of steam out of the drive. I lost sight of the ball because of the trees. 

2) I looked for the ball in the area of the trees. I didn't find it. So I used the local rule and dropped at that point and played a shot which landed on the fringe. On my way to the hole I found my original ball sitting pretty in the first cut on the left out LOS because of a small hill about 70 yds closer to the hole. And yes it was my ball - I had my initials on it. 

3) So I played my original ball and took a par. 

Did I make the right decision?

The moment you hit a ball you dropped, that became the ball in play.  The only time this doesn't apply is if you hit a ball that goes in the hole and you assume it is lost so hit another.  In that case, since you have holed out, the hole is done and the second ball you hit doesn't count

[iacas]

4 minutes ago, pganapathy said:

The moment you hit a ball you dropped, that became the ball in play. The only time this doesn't apply is if you hit a ball that goes in the hole and you assume it is lost so hit another.  In that case, since you have holed out, the hole is done and the second ball you hit doesn't count

That's not the only time.

[Rulesman]

53 minutes ago, pganapathy said:

The moment you hit a ball you dropped, that became the ball in play.  

Are you sure?

[DaveP043]

12 minutes ago, Rulesman said:

Are you sure?

Under the local rule, if in effect, the ball dropped is in play and the original is no longer in play, even if found within the 3 minutes search time.

[JOBS]

If you hit the ball after it has been dropped the second ball is definitely in play!! No matter what.., unless your original is in the hole. If you have not hit the dropped ball and your original ball was never OB or in a Penalty area you may correct the drop.Rule 14.5.

If you were in a penalty area, drop a ball and then find your original ball you may not play your original. I studied the KVC rule and spoke with the Pro where I play.  He said it is all about KVC and to memorize when you can and when you cannot make a correction. Every ball dropped in golf is dropped with the i intent to play that ball (or you would never drop a ball). That's why there is only at the appropriate time an opportunity to correct an incorrect drop when it is dropped for the wrong reason, but if you hit that ball then you own that ball all the way into the green where upon missing the opportunity to  make the correction. Game over. 

That is how it was explained to me. Hope that makes sense. 

Edited September 16, 2019 by JOBS

[pganapathy]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

That's not the only time.

Are you saying you can hit a ball you drop and it isn't in play in other circumstances.  I didn't know.  Please elaborate on what circumstances??

[Rulesman]

6 hours ago, pganapathy said:

Are you saying you can hit a ball you drop and it isn't in play in other circumstances.  I didn't know.  Please elaborate on what circumstances??

You can a drop a ball correctly with intent to play it but it may not yet be in play.

[iacas]

4 hours ago, Rulesman said:

You can a drop a ball correctly with intent to play it but it may not yet be in play.

He did say "hit a ball you drop".

[pganapathy]

9 hours ago, Rulesman said:

You can a drop a ball correctly with intent to play it but it may not yet be in play.

 

4 hours ago, iacas said:

He did say "hit a ball you drop".

Correct, a dropped ball is not in play till you hit it.  If you find the old one within the three minutes, you can pick the dropped ball up and hit your original.

@iacas- you did say there are times when you can hit the dropped ball and it still isn't the ball in play.  Please elaborate on the circumstances for everyone's benefit.  I know it isn't the ball in play when you have already holed out.  What else.  Thanks

[DaveP043]

1 hour ago, pganapathy said:

 

Correct, a dropped ball is not in play till you hit it.  If you find the old one within the three minutes, you can pick the dropped ball up and hit your original.

@iacas- you did say there are times when you can hit the dropped ball and it still isn't the ball in play.  Please elaborate on the circumstances for everyone's benefit.  I know it isn't the ball in play when you have already holed out.  What else.  Thanks

If you drop and play a provisional ball, it is NOT the ball in play until your original is lost (3 minutes is up) or it becomes known or virtually certain that your original is out of bounds or you play the provisional from a spot nearer to the hole than the original is likely to be.

There may be other instances where a ball can be dropped and played without immediately becoming the ball in play, but I can't think of another right now.