LIV Golf (Saudi PIF), "Mergers," and More

[Shindig]

6 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Every corporation deals with this with their employees. But I guess it is different with golf. Missing a day of work unexpectedly is a bit different from missing a tournament. But I would think something similar could be created regarding personal/injury issues as they are in other sports.

I wonder what they'll do if one of their players wants to spend even more time with their family. 

[imsys0042]

3 hours ago, Shindig said:

I wonder what they'll do if one of their players wants to spend even more time with their family. 

Added to that, what happens if there is a conflict between a tournament and one of Pat Perez’s grandkids being born?   Maybe Putin will start a golf tour for him to run complaining to. 

[iacas]

28 minutes ago, imsys0042 said:

Added to that, what happens if there is a conflict between a tournament and one of Pat Perez’s grandkids being born?   Maybe Putin will start a golf tour for him to run complaining to. 

Grandkid? It was his kid he was talking about. He’s not going to be on LIV for a grandkid.

[Friz]

5 hours ago, Shindig said:

I wonder what they'll do if one of their players wants to spend even more time with their family. 

It's so sad how fake this argument ever was in the first place.

LIV Players: "The PGA Tour made me play in too many events."

Also LIV Players: "In addition to our LIV events we need to fight to be able to play in DP World Tour events, also let's play Asian Tour events to keep our OWGR up so we can also continue playing in the majors"

[imsys0042]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Grandkid? It was his kid he was talking about. He’s not going to be on LIV for a grandkid.

Yeah….I was just poking fun.   I think that whole story of his was utter bollocks.  

[turtleback]

22 hours ago, iacas said:

@saevel25 said it pretty well, but to add to it for me…

Mediocre is defined as "Of ordinary or undistinguished quality." or "of a middle quality."

CHIII is not that.

The average or "middle quality" Tour player does not earn $43M. They don't keep their Tour card for 20 years. They don't win three times.

Sorry, Tour players disagree vehemently with you. CHIII is, I'll say again, super widely respected for what he's done on the PGA Tour.

 

The only aspect of his career that is not mediocre is his longevity.  In money list terms, over 20+ years he was in the top 25 only 4 times, while he was outside the top 50 8 times.  Good enough to keep his card, but hardly the stuff of stars.  Not only did he have only one top ten in a major he has a very poor record in both the Players and the WGC events, so he has been pretty lousy in premium events.  In 9 of his 20+ years he wasn't even ranked in the top 100 in the OWGR.  Other than his first 3 years he's only been in the top 50 on the OWGR once.  He's been around a long time mostly as a third tier player, occassionally sniffing the second tier.  Never made a Ryder Cup team, made 2 Pres. cup team's.  That all adds up to mediocre, relative to the standards of the Tour, in my book.  Except for his longevity.

And that the 'super widely respected' label is meaningless to me.  I put more stock in analyzing his record.  Heck, I'd bet half of those players with all this respect for his accomplishments still think Jack is the GOAT.  Howell comes across as a super nice guy and I'm sure that colors their thinking.  I'm sure he is highly and widely respected' as a person, but by the standards of the Tour he was meh, but for a very long time.

The details are here, for all to see:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Howell_III

[iacas]

3 hours ago, turtleback said:

The only aspect of his career that is not mediocre is his longevity.

Right, so… lasting that long puts him well above "mediocre." Plenty of guys have Tour status for 1-3 or even six or seven years. Very few make a living and don't lose their Tour status for a few decades.

3 hours ago, turtleback said:

Good enough to keep his card, but hardly the stuff of stars.

Big gap between "stars" and "mediocre." And I know mediocre doesn't mean "bad."

3 hours ago, turtleback said:

And that the 'super widely respected' label is meaningless to me.

Just sharing. Their perspective is different than yours, and in many ways more relevant, because it's afforded him a nice lifestyle while still not burdening him with recognition, etc.

He's had a very solid career that's the envy of tens of thousands of other professional golfers.

[Shindig]

Oh no.  The broadcast team of Sir Charles and David Feherty is already tempting, and this would add to that temptation.  I am still not going to watch though.

 

Broadcaster Gary McCord is in job talks with LIV, says it'd be fun to join Feherty, Barkley in 'clown car' | Golf News and Tour Information | GolfDigest.com

 

[Big Lex]

38 minutes ago, Shindig said:

Oh no.  The broadcast team of Sir Charles and David Feherty is already tempting, and this would add to that temptation.  I am still not going to watch though.

 

Broadcaster Gary McCord is in job talks with LIV, says it'd be fun to join Feherty, Barkley in 'clown car' | Golf News and Tour Information | GolfDigest.com

 

IMO....McCord hasn't said anything that made me laugh in over 20 years, so his presence wouldn't make me want to tune in...probably the opposite. Similarly for Feherty, whose schtick I find kind of worn out. 

But Gary's right...LIV is, at the moment, impossible to ignore, and it's really going to be interesting to see where this all leads. I still can't see it really competing with the PGA Tour on the basis of tournament strength. Three-day, no-cut events with shotgun starts seem sort of silly to serious golf fans, and I think in the end we like our sports to be "legit," our leagues and events to be true championship competitions. LIV has more of a feel of American Gladiator: kinda interesting, and alot of talent, but it ain't real sport. 

 

 

[iacas]

5 hours ago, Shindig said:

Oh no.  The broadcast team of Sir Charles and David Feherty is already tempting, and this would add to that temptation.  I am still not going to watch though.

 

Broadcaster Gary McCord is in job talks with LIV, says it'd be fun to join Feherty, Barkley in 'clown car' | Golf News and Tour Information | GolfDigest.com

 

McCord stinks.

[ChetlovesMer]

5 hours ago, Big Lex said:

IMO....McCord hasn't said anything that made me laugh in over 20 years, so his presence wouldn't make me want to tune in...probably the opposite. Similarly for Feherty, whose schtick I find kind of worn out. 

But Gary's right...LIV is, at the moment, impossible to ignore, and it's really going to be interesting to see where this all leads. I still can't see it really competing with the PGA Tour on the basis of tournament strength. Three-day, no-cut events with shotgun starts seem sort of silly to serious golf fans, and I think in the end we like our sports to be "legit," our leagues and events to be true championship competitions. LIV has more of a feel of American Gladiator: kinda interesting, and alot of talent, but it ain't real sport. 

 

 

Am I the only one getting sort of a pro-wrestling vibe from these guys?

[MSDOGS1976]

11 hours ago, Shindig said:

Oh no.  The broadcast team of Sir Charles and David Feherty is already tempting, and this would add to that temptation.  I am still not going to watch though.

 

Broadcaster Gary McCord is in job talks with LIV, says it'd be fun to join Feherty, Barkley in 'clown car' | Golf News and Tour Information | GolfDigest.com

 

I hadn't planned to watch but McCord certainly closes the door for me. Ha

[Zeph]

As with the players, they pick broadcasters that makes me not want to watch. Interesting strategy.

[turtleback]

7 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

Am I the only one getting sort of a pro-wrestling vibe from these guys?

Vince McMahon just retired from running the WWE.  Can a LIV contract be far behind?

[Zeph]

24 minutes ago, turtleback said:

Vince McMahon just retired from running the WWE.  Can a LIV contract be far behind?

Someone should make a meme with the Vince WWE template, where he’s reacting to Talor Gooch, Ian Poulter etc. being announced as “on the tee”.

[70sSanO]

5 hours ago, Zeph said:

As with the players, they pick broadcasters that makes me not want to watch. Interesting strategy.

I not sure any of the Saudi PIF Board Members are involved in player or analyst/commentator decisions.  I'm thinking Greg Norman is calling the day-to-day shots.

The impression that I have is that the entire LIV Tour has been woefully mismanaged in its approach to building an exciting and fresh alternative to the existing tours.  Once the newness wears off they will be stuck with basically a tweaked lower level version of the same old thing, with the same old commentators.

I would think that at some point Greg Norman will be held accountable by the PIF Board.  Especially if the LIV Tour is viewed as a less desirable professional golf experience by the public.

I'm not sure how much input the PGA (Tour?) has over the NBC/CBS analysts and commentators, but there is an excellent opportunity to re-tool the broadcasts.  Most of the golf analysts are just plain boring and void of any personality.  I'm not saying they have to go full Madden or McEnroe, but maybe have some semblance of being entertaining.

John

Edited July 24, 2022 by 70sSanO

[Shindig]

1 hour ago, 70sSanO said:

I'm not sure how much input the PGA (Tour?) has over the NBC/CBS analysts and commentators, but there is an excellent opportunity to re-tool the broadcasts.  Most of the golf analysts are just plain boring and void of any personality.  I'm not saying they have to go full Madden or McEnroe, but maybe have some semblance of being entertaining.

You don't have to go full Madden, I agree, but now seems as good a time as any to remind the world that Tony Romo is a particularly good amateur golfer and is employed by CBS.

[phan52]

I can't think of many long time PGA Tour players who will move the needle less than Charles Howell III. The announcers are completely meaningless. They just add to the "exhibition" vibe, particularly Charles Barkley, who I love as a basketball analyst.