Private Club Dues RE: COVID-19

[iacas]

53 minutes ago, klineka said:

Are there really that many non profit private clubs? 

Even private clubs that aren't owned by a big corporation would still presumably have owner(s) that want to make a profit, right?

 Yes. There are some rich people who have their own golf clubs and they often don't make a profit. Especially directly.

There might only be 20 of them in the world, but still… 🙂

[Mr22putt]

1 hour ago, klineka said:

Are there really that many non profit private clubs? 

Even private clubs that aren't owned by a big corporation would still presumably have owner(s) that want to make a profit, right?

I believe most private clubs (that aren't owned by a large corporation)...especially the older established clubs have not for profit status.

Here one of many articles on the status

https://www.wral.com/wral-investigates-private-country-clubs-can-claim-nonprofit-status/12068405/

[Mr22putt]

17 hours ago, FlyingAce said:

The club has laid off everyone except one person to maintain the course. Re: congregating - it is both members and non-members. Seems like some members are inviting their friends from other courses to play, and the usual groups (mostly younger players) are still playing as a group as if things are normal. A friend lives by a tee box and she said last weekend was so busy, there were groups back to back from 8am to 7pm. She could tell many were not from our club. She saw people playing barefoot, a teenager playing naked, some goofing around, some beating the life out of the tee boxes, etc. The bathrooms are closed so people were just using whatever bushes they saw fit. She played yesterday alone on a par5 and a ball flew in her direction out of nowhere. A few minutes later a few guys, in flip flops, came in sight holding just a few clubs and a 6-pack.  Turned out they were playing the hole backwards and didn’t think that would be an issue...

I agree that it is not possible to police the course and prevent members from playing (many live in the golf community). But to open the door for anybody to come in is a different story. 

Yes anyone can play Tanoan if  you have a member bring you in.

@Mr22putt Thanks, I am bored but doing well. I have been in home isolation because my husband works at a hospital and I don’t know what he is going to bring home, so I don’t want to risk spreading anything if I go out.  And I certainly don’t want to pick up anything and pass it on to him. He cannot afford to be sick. I have been practicing in my backyard but have lost my swing/feel. I keep hitting the ball outside my yard and I fear someone may get hurt from my errant shots...

I hope you are doing well yourself!

I have no problem paying parts of my dues if they are maintaining the course. But they let everyone go except one maintenance guy. It is not possible for one person to maintain a 27-hole course. 

I can quit my club and play elsewhere, but there isn’t even a person to contact since everyone is gone.

 

Hi Ace:

First....my utmost respect to both you and your husband....your husband who is a front line health care professional who's basically going into work in 'ground zero' and you for your voluntary self isolation to minimize any spread of Covid 19.

Seems like Tanoan is the closest and most convenient course for you to play golf.

Obviously your call....but based on your prior posts that the clubs seems unfriendly to you and you most recent posts.....Tanoan seems really mismanaged.

I don't know how much or if you have a refundable initiation (I doubt it though).....I would consider quitting this club....assuming there are other good options nearby.

I would call and then email your club and cc the HQ in Cali to notify them....I'm not sure of your club's specific process to resign.

Take care and stay healthy.

BC is employing many safeguards against Covid 19 (people can be fined for not physical distancing) ...but I'm surprised we still have don't a shut down order of non-essential businesses like Ontario....most golf courses, both private and public in BC have closed....there are maybe 5-7 public courses (they have sold out tee sheets)  that remain open on a day to day basis and all are 40+ kms away from me....I live near the core of Vancouver.

Edited April 6, 2020 by Mr22putt

[boogielicious]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

 Yes. There are some rich people who have their own golf clubs and they often don't make a profit. Especially directly.

There might only be 20 of them in the world, but still… 🙂

My friend’s club in NH is like that. Rich owner who doesn’t seem to mind just breaking even. It’s never very crowded there when I play with him.

[ghalfaire]

I belong to a private club that is seasonal and we pay our dues in Dec/Jan.  It just did open for play albeit with lots of changes to normal operations.  But so far no talk of refunding any part of the dues.  Maybe if this lock down and modified operation continues into the Summer that will initiate the discussions on annual dues.  We'll see.

 

Edited April 6, 2020 by ghalfaire
clarity

[Big C]

I am Social Member at a Club Corp property. We primarily use our membership for the swimming pool and the family events they host throughout the year. 

Per the latest announcement, here is what our club is doing for members. 

- 100% of Social member dues will be credited towards any future food & beverage or club events, good for 6 months after the club re-opens.

- 75% of Golf Member Dues will be credited towards the above, as well as cart fees, guest fees, pro shop merchandise, or golf lessons. 

- All monthly food & beverage minimums will be waived until the club re-opens. 

From the sound of things, ours is a pretty generous deal compared to some of the posts I am seeing on here.

Edited April 6, 2020 by Big C

[RickK]

My club sent out a letter just last week because of inquiries.  I copied and pasted the pertinent items outlined below.

The Waterside Grill/Banquets/Special Events:
1. Detailed cleaning policy of the entire establishment, every 2 hours, set in place and strictly monitored.
2. Sit down restaurant dining has been eliminated to adhere to social distancing requirements.
3. Take-out orders are available based on limited menu.
4. Curb side pick-up available upon request.
5. No gathering of more than 10 people and social distancing within the building observed of 6 feet.
6. Cancellation/postponing of all scheduled events and community activities.
7. Special “Family Style” dinners for take-out and catering orders being offered.
8. Take out of mixed beverages allowed with food orders.
Golf Operations:
1. Detailed cleaning policy of the entire establishment, every 2 hours, set in place and strictly monitored.
2. Social distancing of 6 feet per person required and no gathering of more than 10 people.
3. Golf cart ridership restricted to one person per cart (exception for family members only)
4. Flagpoles to remain in hole at all times. Flagpoles cleaned 2+ times per day.
5. Rakes removed from sand traps.
6. Driving range closed until further notice. Putting green open and flagpoles removed.
7. Removal of sand bottles and coolers from golf carts.
8. Golf carts cleaned and disinfected after each round.
9. Cancellation of all scheduled tournaments and events.
10. Elimination of all shot-gun starts to minimize crowd size in favor of tee times.
11. Remove water stations on golf course and provide bottle water for free.
12. Elimination of course beverage cart. Snacks, beverages and ice bags available in Pro Shop.
Fitness Center:
1. The Fitness Center is closed until the COVID-19 social distancing requirement is removed.
2. Membership fees for the fitness center are suspended until the center is reopened.
Tennis Courts:
1. Detailed cleaning policy of tennis court area, every 2 hours, set in place and strictly monitored.
2. Water stations removed.

The club is doing all it can to remain open and keep as many of the employees working as they possibly can.  Our club is within a city that is solely within a gated community.  The golf course is more busy every day than it has ever been because of the "stay at home" order from the county.  Also, the golf course is considered to be a "park" and has not really had any issues staying open....so far.  What we do have to do is practice social distancing.   Also, the golf course is only open to members and their guests.  Outside players unaccompanied by a member...not allowed.  

The county sheriff can show up at any time to make sure all the precautions required are in place and being observed.  As far as golf membership dues are concerned...we are paying what we always pay.  

 

Edited April 8, 2020 by RickK

[Club Rat]

On 4/5/2020 at 8:09 PM, David in FL said:

I’d like to see the staff continue to receive some pay to help ensure that they come back too.

Our owner committed to paying employees through March but has not announced if any future months will be paid.
We have a $50 Food Minimum which the owner removed and I contacted the GM and asked if it could be donated to help staff.
He indicated yes, so I authorized a $100 charge and hope other member donate also.

There are staff members who have been at the club for years, it would be a bad situation if they do not return.

[FlyingAce]

American Golf just sent a 2nd notice out, probably after receiving complaints, and what they are offering now is much more acceptable. But they did not mention anything about having more staff to maintain the course. Still just one person for now.

As for restricting play to members and guests only - the GM has turned in a membership list to the security at the gate. Anyone coming in for golf has to be on that list, and if they are guests of a member, they need to come in in the same car as the member. But if the member lives inside the community, then they can just say they are visitors. Not exactly sure how they will enforce that, or if it is even possible. But at least this will weed out anyone who really shouldn’t be there in the first place.

Edited April 8, 2020 by FlyingAce

[iacas]

Arriving in the same car? That’s not social distancing.

[Mr22putt]

42 minutes ago, iacas said:

Arriving in the same car? That’s not social distancing.

Tru Dat

52 minutes ago, FlyingAce said:

As for restricting play to members and guests only - the GM has turned in a membership list to the security at the gate. Anyone coming in for golf has to be on that list, and if they are guests of a member, they need to come in in the same car as the member. But if the member lives inside the community, then they can just say they are visitors. Not exactly sure how they will enforce that, or if it is even possible. But at least this will weed out anyone who really shouldn’t be there in the first place.

 

Why is golf being played at your club....shouldn't it be closed?

1) as per the American Golf Corp website...they state all courses to be closed.

2) NM has a stay at home order....aren't golf courses there considered non-essential....I never saw courses on the NM essential businesses list.

Tee Times & Golf Courses at American Golf

---

Reserve tee times for public and private golf courses across the country. Weddings, tournaments and other events at clubs nationwide. Plan your golf outing through American Golf!

COVID-19 Information: New Mexico Tech

 

Edited April 8, 2020 by Mr22putt

[FlyingAce]

@Mr22putt You are correct that we have a stay at home order and golf courses are all closed in NM. But my course is inside a gated community and the club has completely shutdown, as in let all the staff go. So there is no one to police the course. Members (who live in the community or not) and non-members within the community are all still playing (or chopping around). I know other courses have security to block people from even driving in, but it is pretty much open to anyone who can get on the course at my club - well, members and their guests, plus those in the community...

My club was one of the first in NM to close and on that notice, the GM only said club operations has been suspended and there will be no staff except for ONE maintenance guy. And please watch out for him if you plan to keep playing...

[Mr22putt]

1 hour ago, FlyingAce said:

@Mr22putt You are correct that we have a stay at home order and golf courses are all closed in NM. But my course is inside a gated community and the club has completely shutdown, as in let all the staff go. So there is no one to police the course. Members (who live in the community or not) and non-members within the community are all still playing (or chopping around). I know other courses have security to block people from even driving in, but it is pretty much open to anyone who can get on the course at my club - well, members and their guests, plus those in the community...

My club was one of the first in NM to close and on that notice, the GM only said club operations has been suspended and there will be no staff except for ONE maintenance guy. And please watch out for him if you plan to keep playing...

Hi Ace:

Hope you're not going too crazy in self isolation.

That's a shame that the layout of your club can't refrain all the CLOWNS and hillbillies with no clothes, shoes, etc from entering the property....considering the members continue to pay dues.....you'd think that American Golf Corp would hire proper security to guard the club...but I'm not surprised that a big corporation like American Golf doesn't give a sh*t.....it's all lip service from them....no way the premier privates here in Vancouver would put up with GOOF's entering the property.

Heck...even the muni's here have hired staff to watch over the facilities. 

[FlyingAce]

54 minutes ago, Mr22putt said:

Hi Ace:

Hope you're not going too crazy in self isolation.

That's a shame that the layout of your club can't refrain all the CLOWNS and hillbillies with no clothes, shoes, etc from entering the property....considering the members continue to pay dues.....you'd think that American Golf Corp would hire proper security to guard the club...but I'm not surprised that a big corporation like American Golf doesn't give a sh*t.....it's all lip service from them....no way the premier privates here in Vancouver would put up with GOOF's entering the property.

Heck...even the muni's here have hired staff to watch over the facilities. 

I know, right? How much would it cost to hire security if everyone is still paying dues? I know the course that @NM Golf is at has hired security to keep the yahoos off so we should do the same.

My golf mat just arrived so I am going to set it up and hit a few in my backyard!

[Mr22putt]

51 minutes ago, FlyingAce said:

I know, right? How much would it cost to hire security if everyone is still paying dues? I know the course that @NM Golf is at has hired security to keep the yahoos off so we should do the same.

My golf mat just arrived so I am going to set it up and hit a few in my backyard!

Ace:

I noticed your cap has dropped to 5.5...when did that happen?....I thought you ended the season at 7....my cap has risen to 8.1....but haven't played much in 2020....maybe 4 times in Jan and then only once since.

I still can't believe the fools at your club have no desire to play golf with a mid single cap female golfer. I'd say that would likely not be the case up here in Vancouver and I highly doubt any guy here on the TST would not want to play golf with you.

So you gonna give me 1 stroke per side if we played for skins.....I'd have no SHAME if you DESTROYED me if I was having a bad day....ok....maybe I'd feel like a LOSER if you beat me bad.🤣

[FlyingAce]

6 minutes ago, Mr22putt said:

Ace:

I noticed your cap has dropped to 5.5...when did that happen?....I thought you ended the season at 7....my cap has risen to 8.1....but haven't played much in 2020....maybe 4 times in Jan and then only once since.

I still can't believe the fools at your club have no desire to play golf with a mid single cap female golfer. I'd say that would likely not be the case up here in Vancouver and I highly doubt any guy here on the TST would not want to play golf with you.

So you gonna give me 1 stroke per side if we played for skins.....I'd have no SHAME if you DESTROYED me if I was having a bad day....ok....maybe I'd feel like a LOSER if you beat me bad.🤣

Haha you are funny😂

8.1 is not bad. Early season is always rusty and you will get it back in no time after you start playing again!

I really don’t know why.  I am friendly with quite a few people at the club and we would hangout/chat at the clubhouse/range, but no one had ever asked me to join them. They all know I can play pretty well so it’s not like I’d slow them down.  But it’s ok. I am not really interested in playing for money, competition/bragging rights, socializing, etc. I just want to play with no drama. 

My hcp dropped towards the end of last season. I started working with my instructor during the summer on my driver. Nothing else but the driver. My scores started dropping once my driving distance were consistently over 200yds. The rest just came with it. 

I took the winter off to ski but I still saw my instructor every other week just to keep swinging. I scored a 79 for the first game of this season in early March, then my club closed and everything went downhill. 

Good thing the mat came in time for me to start swinging again - not too bad for my first 30 balls after turning into a couch potato weeks ago...just need to get the tee height/setup right again!

 

 

[Mr22putt]

On 4/8/2020 at 3:58 PM, FlyingAce said:

Haha you are funny😂

8.1 is not bad. Early season is always rusty and you will get it back in no time after you start playing again!

I really don’t know why.  I am friendly with quite a few people at the club and we would hangout/chat at the clubhouse/range, but no one had ever asked me to join them. They all know I can play pretty well so it’s not like I’d slow them down.  But it’s ok. I am not really interested in playing for money, competition/bragging rights, socializing, etc. I just want to play with no drama. 

My hcp dropped towards the end of last season. I started working with my instructor during the summer on my driver. Nothing else but the driver. My scores started dropping once my driving distance were consistently over 200yds. The rest just came with it. 

I took the winter off to ski but I still saw my instructor every other week just to keep swinging. I scored a 79 for the first game of this season in early March, then my club closed and everything went downhill. 

Good thing the mat came in time for me to start swinging again - not too bad for my first 30 balls after turning into a couch potato weeks ago...just need to get the tee height/setup right again!

 

 

On 4/8/2020 at 3:58 PM, FlyingAce said:

1) I am friendly with quite a few people at the club and we would hangout/chat at the clubhouse/range, but no one had ever asked me to join them. They all know I can play pretty well so it’s not like I’d slow them down.  But it’s ok.

2) I am not really interested in playing for money, competition/bragging rights, socializing, etc. I just want to play with no drama. 

3) Good thing the mat came in time for me to start swinging again - not too bad for my first 30 balls after turning into a couch potato weeks ago...just need to get the tee height/setup right again!

Ace

1) So it seems like the members at your club are just "GF'ing" you....nice enough to give you some phony chats, but not nice enough to ask you to play golf.....but have you asked any of them to play golf?

I'm not surprised the women might not ask you to play golf because most women play 'hit & giggle" golf and they are most likely intimated by your very good golf skills.

I hate playing alone...I just end up goofing around...it's ok if I just want to hit a bunch of practice shots. I'll generally wait to see if there is anyone to play golf with....but if I'm out as a single....I generally always ask to join up with a group if I catch up to them and always ask a single if he wants to join up if he catches up.

2) Drama is good...it's always good for a laugh.

3) have you noticed that your driver strikes are either center cut or heel biased?.....seems you don't miss towards the toe....the best spot for distance is just north of center and just a tad towards the toe for best launch & spin combo for distance....have you discussed this with your instructor. Looks like you have a Cally XR 16 driver....did you put those crown sky marks on yourself?....have you hit the Epic Flash and Mavrik?....I was getting some good total distance with the Mavrik when I hit a great shot on the sim....mainly due to lower spin and roll-out....though I only put so much into a sim session....IMO.....the real test is how a club performs on the course.

[FlyingAce]

1 hour ago, Mr22putt said:

Ace

1) So it seems like the members at your club are just "GF'ing" you....nice enough to give you some phony chats, but not nice enough to ask you to play golf.....but have you asked any of them to play golf?

I'm not surprised the women might not ask you to play golf because most women play 'hit & giggle" golf and they are most likely intimated by your very good golf skills.

I hate playing alone...I just end up goofing around...it's ok if I just want to hit a bunch of practice shots. I'll generally wait to see if there is anyone to play golf with....but if I'm out as a single....I generally always ask to join up with a group if I catch up to them and always ask a single if he wants to join up if he catches up.

2) Drama is good...it's always good for a laugh.

3) have you noticed that your driver strikes are either center cut or heel biased?.....seems you don't miss towards the toe....the best spot for distance is just north of center and just a tad towards the toe for best launch & spin combo for distance....have you discussed this with your instructor. Looks like you have a Cally XR 16 driver....did you put those crown sky marks on yourself?....have you hit the Epic Flash and Mavrik?....I was getting some good total distance with the Mavrik when I hit a great shot on the sim....mainly due to lower spin and roll-out....though I only put so much into a sim session....IMO.....the real test is how a club performs on the course.

1. Nope. I have never asked anyone to play. The guys always ask me how I have been playing and they keep track of my hcp too. 

2. People like to gossip and I don’t want to get involved...

3. The XR is my first driver and have been through alot! I changed to a M5tour last season and absolutely love it. I had it in the shop and couldn’t pick it up before they closed, so I am back to the XR until who knows when. Yes, tried the Flash and couldn’t hit it at all. No on Mavrik. Tried SIM and I was getting similar numbers as the M5 so I think I will stick with that for now.