Playing From the Wrong (Too Long) Tees?

[Tepi90]

I play with randoms these days after moving 700km south and not knowing anyone to play with atm. In Finland I think most courses have white, yellow and red tees, red being the shortest and white longest.

So far all my rounds (10?) have been from yellow tees, since rest of the group have played from there. The club has started weekly competitions recently, that I plan to participate in sometime soon. Those competitions are played twice a week, once from white and once from yellow. I'd like to practice from white tees some rounds before tho, but just feel too uncomfortable going there when rest of the group is playing from yellow... Is it often that you have people playing from different tees and is the general thought "that guy thinks he is better than us" when he/she decides to play from back? Think I'll just let people think what they want and do what helps my game most.

Before moving I used to play my home course from all tees with friends to get most out of it. Front tees turned some par 4's into really long par 3's and back tees usually made you use 1-2 clubs longer for the approach shots.

[iacas]

Based on that chart, 86.32% of respondents at the time of this post play the correct tees or shorter tees than the chart says they should. This leaves only 13.68% of people that play tees too long for them (by the chart).

But then you get to the next question, and apparently we're all SUPER-great here on the site at being awesome, because NOBODY voted 0-15% of golfers play tees too long for them… despite the previous answer coming in at 13.68%.

I think the number of golfers who play tees too long for them is often drastically over-stated. I think it's below 25%.

Spoiler

More often than not I'm trying to drag people back a set of tees. My friend who is 56 keeps wanting to play from 5700 yards. Which, most of the time, I let him. But sometimes I "force" him back to 6300 so we are only one tee box apart. (This mattered a little bit more when we were sharing carts, in 2019.) He scores about the same and gets to hit a larger variety of clubs, while from 5700, yeah, he can reach some par fives, but he hits a lot fewer different clubs, too. Lots of wedges into greens from 5700 yards.

Might be < 15%.

[billchao]

2 hours ago, Tepi90 said:

Is it often that you have people playing from different tees and is the general thought "that guy thinks he is better than us" when he/she decides to play from back? Think I'll just let people think what they want and do what helps my game most.

It happens every time I play. I don’t often see other people playing from the back tees and I’ll tell everyone up front that’s where I’ll be playing from.

Don’t worry about what other people might think. Play your game, keep a good pace and nobody will say anything.

[Cartboy]

21 hours ago, billchao said:

I have never dropped 10 strokes from moving up one set of tees.

I do.

I shoot disproportionately better on shorter courses, more than the slope would suggest.

20 hours ago, dagolfer18 said:

When I play, especially if it’s a new track, I generally opt for the white/regular tees, mainly because I don’t want to hit an embarrassing drive from the blues, and someone playing an adjacent hole looks at me and thinks, “Why is he playing the blues?”

Or, "Why is he playing golf?"

🙄😷

[Cartboy]

7 hours ago, iacas said:

It’s a long day from any set of tees.

My point was I don’t think this happens very often. Most people play the correct tees. And not just 51%.

I guess it varies from course to course, because on my main course, which is tough, like I said, and which is played by a lot of older, first-time, tourist golfers, like I said, it is a big problem.

I have found it very difficult, as both a marshal and a player, to convince/suggest someone who is struggling, and having a totally miserable time, that they should move up a tee.

&, like I said, I see so many go to the first tee, hit from something further back than white, and you can immediately see they chose the wrong tee.

I believe that the first time on a course, there is a very strong tendency to just go to "White."  That's a mistake at my place for a lot of golfers.  That's why I want to make our Combo White (5877 yards/Slope 128), and make our White (6299/Slope 130) another color.  But, that won't happen, for whatever reason.

Of course, on Mens' Day, we always had the rule about not hitting it past the "Ladies" tee.

😷

- - - - - -

Somewhat related, the last time I got my former golfing buddy/jerk on for $25, which was the last time I'll get him on for $25, and he was having a totally horrible day, after he threw his putter and hissy-fit on the green in front of the owner's house, he said something about me playing "cobbled-up" tees, or whatever it was he said, I told him you can play any arrangement of tees you want on a course, and use the USGA rules to adjust it to a rated tee for posting purposes.

Speaking of which, he's in town this week.  Too bad I'm not working, not golfing, and not socializing.

😷

 

 

59 minutes ago, billchao said:

Don’t worry about what other people might think. Play your game, keep a good pace and nobody will say anything.

One of the best statements ever made here.  Maybe add "have fun".

😷

 

 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Cartboy

[CarlSpackler]

23 minutes ago, Cartboy said:

I shoot disproportionately better on shorter courses, more than the slope would suggest.

Not me. I shoot the same score on my old home course (RIP)

Than I do on my new home course (white tees).

It doesn't make sense.

[billchao]

49 minutes ago, Cartboy said:

I shoot disproportionately better on shorter courses, more than the slope would suggest.

That really just comes down to what your strengths and weaknesses are. If you’re a relatively short hitter with good accuracy, course length is going to have a much bigger effect on your score than a guy who’s a relatively long hitter who can’t hit a fairway unless it’s from an adjacent hole.

Like I said, the difference between the back tees and the next set at my “home” course is ~300 yards. I’m not gaining 10 strokes with 17 less yards per hole on average.

[djake]

Personally i like to play from the White Tees the first time i play a course.  But i like to look at Golf Courses from how the Architect Designed them and see how different tee boxes lay out a hole.  There are very well designed courses where some holes the Forward Tee is actually more difficult to play from then the Blacks/tips.

When we are on a golf outing weekend we play a course once and then the next time we play it we play 'choose the tee maker'.  Whoever wins the hole gets to pick where everyone tees off from.  If there is a push then whoever has gone the longest in choosing the tee box gets to pick.  That is actually a lot of fun with strategies varying on how far someone can hit a tee shot or not.

Overall, i don't stress over which tee box i am at.  I let the group decide, if we have a Super Senior and wants to play forward off we go.  If someone wants to play the Tips then off we go, if the course is packed though i do suggest due to optics we maybe should play the Whites.

 

[Sandy Lie]

My friends used to joke that playing the back tees let’s you play from places on the course you’ve never hit from before!   I know guys who play the back tees all the time so that they can keep their HDCP up.  Then they like to play in tournaments that are on shorter tees so that they can have an advantage.  Then there’s the other guys who sign up to play in the Championship Flight that have no business doing so, but like to say that’s how they measure their game. ( I scratch my head on that one!).

Now IACAS has cited some stats and I agree with his comments.  But let’s talk about the other stats not mentioned.  Fairways hit, GIR and putting.  I think most would agree that if your playing the wrong tees that statistically your data would show low numbers on fairways and GIR. Putting averages varying!  

For my game I track those areas each time I play.  On average I hit (currently) 74% of my fairways and 55% of my greens.  The other day I shot a 72 with only 50% GIR, hit 73% of my fairways.  I only had 26 putts.  Then of course I turned around and played #2 today, still hit 56% of the greens but only 57% of fairways with 32 putts.  Each course from the White tees. (Greens today were so fast it was like putting on glass! Said they were running close to 14!)

I’ve played with many Guests on #2 and they play the tips as I may have mentioned. (They play big $$$ to do so!) You won’t change their minds, but they will hit memorable shots and shots they won’t want to remember.  I guess it’s what you want from playing the game. Hitting a good tee shot from the right tee with a chance to hit the green and possibly make birdie.  Sounds a lot better than having to hit a long 2nd shot to the green that comes up short or finds the water.

But if you have the game play the back tees because you can. But try to play the tees that fit your game to do your best.

 

[billchao]

13 minutes ago, Sandy Lie said:

My friends used to joke that playing the back tees let’s you play from places on the course you’ve never hit from before!

I can play from the forward tees and end up in places on the course you’ve never hit from before.

14 minutes ago, Sandy Lie said:

I know guys who play the back tees all the time so that they can keep their HDCP up.

Playing from the back tees brings my index down. An 88 from the back is a lower differential than an 88 from the middle.

15 minutes ago, Sandy Lie said:

I think most would agree that if your playing the wrong tees that statistically your data would show low numbers on fairways and GIR.

I think you’re making assumptions based on your own experiences. I’ve already explained that there’s no difference in my scoring from being back one set of tees.

[Sandy Lie]

Quote “I think you’re making assumptions based on your own experiences. I’ve already explained that there’s no difference in my scoring from being back one set of tees.”

Perhaps, but then you are talking about your experiences as well.  
 

Everyday we play the game we have a different experience. How we feel, what club is working, which one is not.  What you are  trying to improve in your game that day.  Sometimes it’s who we play with!  
 

Here’s a question for you / everyone.  How much does your handicap fluctuate?  Does is resemble a bell curve? Your profile indicates your a 12 HDCP.  How often do you play? Do you play the same course all the time?  Same group?  What are your goals for the game?  Do you want to play the game the best you can? For some it’s more of a social thing. They could care less what they shoot. We probably know friends that are very competitive.  The ones I know that are competitive track everything. Statistics can tell you what areas of your game to focus on.  For me it’s my chipping so I practice that more than my driver.  I track more than fairways hit, GIR’s and putts.  Up and downs, driving accuracy, sand saves, etc.  All recorded in a spreadsheet!  It’s how I want to get better, shooting the best score I can based on my own limitations.  My perspective is that we play the game to be the best we can.  Statistics can point you in that direction.

 

[billchao]

45 minutes ago, Sandy Lie said:

Perhaps, but then you are talking about your experiences as well.

Yes, as a counter to the generalizations you're making.

48 minutes ago, Sandy Lie said:

Here’s a question for you / everyone.  How much does your handicap fluctuate?  Does is resemble a bell curve? Your profile indicates your a 12 HDCP.  How often do you play? Do you play the same course all the time?  Same group?  What are your goals for the game?  Do you want to play the game the best you can? For some it’s more of a social thing. They could care less what they shoot. We probably know friends that are very competitive.  The ones I know that are competitive track everything. Statistics can tell you what areas of your game to focus on.  For me it’s my chipping so I practice that more than my driver.  I track more than fairways hit, GIR’s and putts.  Up and downs, driving accuracy, sand saves, etc.  All recorded in a spreadsheet!  It’s how I want to get better, shooting the best score I can based on my own limitations.  My perspective is that we play the game to be the best we can.  Statistics can point you in that direction.

This stuff is all off topic. Feel free to start a new thread or post in an existing one. Or several.

---

BTW, there's a quote function:

https://thesandtrap.com/how-to/quote-posts/

[Bonvivant]

I think that the best marker for me when it comes to which tees to play is longest par 4 distance on that particular course. If I see a par 4 that is over 420 yards or so, I know that I shouldn't be playing those tees. Even at 420 yards I have to have a good drive, and would still have 4 iron or more into the green. 450 yards is about the max distance that I even have a chance of reaching with 2 well struck shots. I can play from farther back, but then I just start treating the long par fours as par fives, which I am fine with. Sure, I may shoot 110 instead of 90-100, but I will still enjoy the round from back there, albeit maybe not as much as I would from the 6k mark.

I only play the longer tees if the whole group is doing so, and I just let them know that I am a shorter hitter, but I will keep pace just fine (usually still faster than everyone, even if they shoot in the 60s).

[The Flush]

I am not a good driver of the golf ball. The home course scorecard says the white tees play 6100 yards and distance only makes it tough to reach 1 hole in regulation. The #1 handicap hole is a 425 yard dogleg over/around water. It really only plays that long if you are conservative with the water on your drive or a right handed slicer. If you can carry your drive 250 over water, you have a wedge into the green. If you can only carry it 200 and need to avoid the water you will have hit it 185 to reach in regulation. If you slice your drive while trying to avoid the water, you can have over 200 to the green. There is a peninsula you could drive 200 total on to before reaching the water and then only have 165 in to the green, but you have to hit it pretty straight.

I am closer to 200 than 250, but still feel I am playing the right tees for this course. And I have to play from these tees for league play anyway.

[Cartboy]

20 hours ago, billchao said:

That really just comes down to what your strengths and weaknesses are. If you’re a relatively short hitter with good accuracy, course length is going to have a much bigger effect on your score than a guy who’s a relatively long hitter who can’t hit a fairway unless it’s from an adjacent hole.

 

Exactly. 

I've been inartfully, I guess, trying to say that that is the case. 

On a couple of Par 3s on my northern home course, I hit a 3 or 5 wood, and sometimes a driver, when some in my group are hitting a short iron, but I'm as accurate as they are.  So, length is my nemesis.

[Cartboy]

19 hours ago, djake said:

Personally i like to play from the White Tees the first time i play a course. 

 

That's what I was saying, too, that players new to our course (or any course), mostly older tourists, almost automatically go to "White" (Silver in our case).

When the course opened, we had a forward tee at 5323 and "White" was next back at 6299.  Wow! That's a big difference!  Too long for some older casual tourist golfers, especially since the course is tough, too.

The "Combo" I came up with is 5877.  &, it's Sloped and Rated, a legit tee.

Funny though, the older member groups that I play with have their own "Combo", not different enough to change the Slope and Rating, and I agree more with theirs.

Edited May 13, 2020 by Cartboy

[Cartboy]

20 minutes ago, Cartboy said:

That's what I was saying, too, that players new to our course (or any course), mostly older tourists, almost automatically go to "White" (Silver in our case).

When the course opened, we had a forward tee at 5323 and "White" was next back at 6299.  Wow! That's a big difference!  Too long for some older casual tourist golfers, especially since the course is tough, too.

The "Combo" I came up with is 5877.  &, it's Sloped and Rated, a legit tee.

Funny though, the older member groups that I play with have their own "Combo", not different enough to change the Slope and Rating, and I agree more with theirs.

On some holes I could not reach the fairway from the tips (7324).

[iacas]

1 hour ago, Cartboy said:

Funny though, the older member groups that I play with have their own "Combo", not different enough to change the Slope and Rating, and I agree more with theirs.

You can adjust the slope and rating by yardage difference. If it’s more than 100-150 yards difference the slope has probably changed a point or three.